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Old 08-13-2007, 08:07 PM   #166
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Not sure where you are going with this, my brother is my beneficiary and we're not married.

The point is when you exclude based strictly on the fact that they are different from your status quo it's a hateful act.
Ok, beneficiary was the wrong word to use. You probably can't deduct your brother as an dependent or have him get your health benefits, unless he is officially a dependent.

I'm not sure how else I can make it more clear. The idea is that these Civil Unions/Partnerships carry full rights of a marriage. I think we should make it open for all, not just people romantically or sexually involved, period. I don't think it would be fair to exclude that group.

Isn't that fair? It eliminates all of the sexual orientation stuff, therefore, that's no longer part of the debate. Seems like a great solution.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:10 PM   #167
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Martha,

I've got to tell you, you are out of line on this one. I am not bringing up any of that stuff.

You are wrong on where I stand on this.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:12 PM   #168
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Originally posted by MadelynIris


Ok, beneficiary was the wrong word to use. You probably can't deduct your brother as an dependent or have him get your health benefits, unless he is officially a dependent.

I'm not sure how else I can make it more clear. Civil Unions/Partnerships carry full rights of a marriage. I think we should make it open for all, not just people romantically or sexually involved, period. I don't think it would be fair to exclude that group.

Isn't that fair? It eliminates all of the sexual orientation stuff, therefore, that's no longer part of the debate. Seems like a great solution.
Not sure what the point would be, but OK...

And if the church wants to marry two men or two women then they should.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:13 PM   #169
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Originally posted by MadelynIris
Right, isn't the situation similar for gay marriage now? One must move right?

And the question at hand is "denying rights is hate". I posed examples of how we deny some folks under 19 the right to marry, in some states. You claim, this is not a fair comparison. I say it is.
It's not the same. If you are underage, you just have to wait some years until you are granted certain rights.
If you are gay, you might have to wait forever until you're granted those rights.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:14 PM   #170
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It's not the same. If you are underage, you just have to wait some years until you are granted certain rights.
If you are gay, you might have to wait forever until you're granted those rights.
Or wait until you get "saved" and become straight.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:15 PM   #171
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Not sure what the point would be, but OK...

And if the church wants to marry two men or two women then they should.
How can you say that you don't know what the point would be??????? They would be allowed the same benefits of a married couple!!!! In other words, if one had health insurance, the other could benefit from that! One could deduct the other as a dependent! AND ALL THE RIGHTS ASSOCIATED WITH MARRIAGE!

Agreed, if the church wants to marry two men or two women they should, and if the church doesn't want to marry them, they shouldn't.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:18 PM   #172
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If you are gay, you might have to wait forever until you're granted those rights.
Good point. Can't forget about the 4th dimension.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:20 PM   #173
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Originally posted by MadelynIris
Martha,

I've got to tell you, you are out of line on this one. I am not bringing up any of that stuff.

You are wrong on where I stand on this.
Quote:
Originally posted by MadelynIris

I'm not really thinking of 'wives'. More like, two, three, brothers or something along those lines.

Quote:
Originally posted by MadelynIris

Yeah. It's a bit of a farce that some teenagers are not allowed to marry right? Even though, one can get married in Mississippi at 15, one must wait till 19 in Nebraska.

Wouldn't you say that is a fair comparison for debate's sake?
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:20 PM   #174
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How can you say that you don't know what the point would be??????? They would be allowed the same benefits of a married couple!!!! In other words, if one had health insurance, the other could benefit from that! One could deduct the other as a dependent! AND ALL THE RIGHTS ASSOCIATED WITH MARRAIGE!

I love my brother but why would I want to have more taken out of my paycheck for his health insurance unless I was taking care of him. If I was taking care of him then I could already claim him as a dependent.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:21 PM   #175
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You think you're being all "progressive" and stuff, but you're really just dodging and cheapening the issue. I almost have more respect for people who are honest enough to use the Jesus excuse.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:29 PM   #176
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Martha,

The fact that I believe in the right to have a civil union/partnership that provides all the rights of marriage, regardless of sexual orientation, is pretty progressive. I wish 'you guys' (whomever you are) could get it.

Anyway, you think I implied that I used beastality, incest, etc... as an argument against 'gay marriage' in this thread. Why did you just repost quotes out of context to prove your point?

I do respect your views Martha. I'm not sure what the Jesus excuse is.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:32 PM   #177
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


I love my brother but why would I want to have more taken out of my paycheck for his health insurance unless I was taking care of him. If I was taking care of him then I could already claim him as a dependent.
Because it would be cheaper (in most cases) than him getting health insurance on his own, if he were unemployed. A benefit of marriage.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:35 PM   #178
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
I love my brother but why would I want to have more taken out of my paycheck for his health insurance unless I was taking care of him. If I was taking care of him then I could already claim him as a dependent.
Not to mention the premise of exclusivity embedded in the rights presently conferred by marriage. If you entered into a 'union' like that with your brother, then you wouldn't be able to enter one with a woman you might wish to marry in the future without first dissolving it, which wouldn't likely make any of the three of you very happy.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:37 PM   #179
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Not to mention the premise of exclusivity embedded in the rights presently conferred by marriage. If you entered into a 'union' like that with your brother, then you wouldn't be able to enter one with a woman you might wish to marry in the future without first dissolving it, which wouldn't likely make any of the three of you very happy.
Agreed. By current convention, one one partnership at a time.
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:39 PM   #180
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Madelyn Iris, let the folks in this thread label you as hateful and a "dodger" of the issue. They will be running to the ballot box to cast a vote for Clinton or Obama, who have an opinion that is basically equivalent to yours.
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