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Old 02-10-2014, 10:08 PM   #976
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He certainly cost himself some money. There will be teams who won't draft him because of this. Some because they're bigots and others because, more than likely, he'll be a distraction.
What about if a team purposely drafts him over publicity? What he gets passed on but goes exactly in the same pay rate spot as he would've anyways?

He's already a well known name. If he's even remotely successful in this league he's going to be a walking icon. He will have no problem getting endorsements, even as an average player.
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Old 02-10-2014, 10:43 PM   #977
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No NFL team will draft someone for publicity. The Jets used to but realized it doesn't work.

The bottom line is he's a mid-round prospect who already had fall potential because he's a tweener. The league is moving to 3-4 and he is being left behind. It gives every bigot in every front office an easy out if asked why they passed on him.
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Old 02-10-2014, 11:28 PM   #978
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Before last season, a lot of people thought that Manti T'eo would be a distraction for the Chargers. Sure, his press conference at the Combine almost overshadowed the whole event , and his draft day and first game was also a circus.

But guess what? Other than the odd joke or mention, nobody talks about that whole weird fake girlfriend thing. The circus left town after the first game, and one would hope the same will be said about Michael Sam.

After his first few games, hopefully talk will be about his performance on the field and not who he dates off it. After a while, people will see it's not a big deal and no one will care anymore.

All it takes is one.
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Old 02-10-2014, 11:47 PM   #979
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What about if a team purposely drafts him over publicity? What he gets passed on but goes exactly in the same pay rate spot as he would've anyways?
Have you ever watched the NFL? Ever?
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Old 02-11-2014, 12:17 AM   #980
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have you ever watched the nfl? Ever?
no im mistaken please remind me what it stands for!
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Old 02-11-2014, 11:51 AM   #981
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Just heard an interesting interview with a player in which he said what I've been saying: players and teams are much more willing to have a gay teammate than they are with the media knowing they have a gay teammate. In other words, he doesn't care if a guy is gay, but he doesn't want it to be a distraction.

The best thing for Sam would be if a couple more guys came out before the season started. Once the lid gets blown off this thing, it'll settle back down to playing football. The majority of players, coaches, owners and fans don't care what a player does in his free time so long as he contributes on the field and doesn't distract the locker room.


The one part that a coworker and I started talking about this morning that I haven't heard anyone mention yet is what kind of HR policies will teams have to implement re: dating in the work place. Two guys breaking up midseason could be devastating for a locker room.
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Old 02-11-2014, 02:17 PM   #982
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The story made the news here, and we're all eagerly awaiting the response of football loving America. According to our sensationalist press, of course.

But I'm pretty impressed he dared to do this before the big draft. Now it's up to the big teams to show their support and open mindedness.

it would indeed be amazing if this started a snowball effect, with gay players coming out in several sports disciplines. That would be quite a movement.
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Old 02-11-2014, 03:26 PM   #983
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ironically, it seems that the most seemingly gay friendly sports might also be the most homophobic. it might be easier for a gay football He-Man to come out than a Johnny Weir.

this is a long article, but absolutely fascinating:


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Why Is The World's Gayest Sport Stuck In The Closet

To outsiders, men’s figure skating is widely perceived as the Gayest Sport Ever, the butt of endless jokes — consider last weekend’s SNL cold open about the “U.S. Men’s Heterosexual Figure Skating Team.” The direct action group Queer Nation has recently protested figure skaters Brian Boitano and Johnny Weir for not speaking up against Russia’s anti-gay laws. One of the group’s representatives, who asked to not be named, tells me, “Everyone assumes all male skaters are gay. So what? … I have a hard time believing that figure skating is a particularly homophobic sport. I don’t understand this impulse, particularly from figure skaters, to hide their sexuality. You can’t tell me that if Jeremy Abbott came out as gay that it would affect his standing in the skating world.”

To insiders, though, it’s no surprise that skaters are reluctant to speak out on LGBT rights, let alone come out themselves. Most male skaters and officials are committed to keeping their sport in the closet, whether that means choosing “masculine” music, hinting about a girlfriend, or outright denying any connection to homosexuality. A figure skater can never quite outskate the judges’ opinion of him, and judges and institutions, it turns out, are notoriously conservative — as some would say, “family-friendly.” At the National Championships, which took place this January in Boston, a phrase I heard often was “don’t ask, don’t tell.”

It’s not that skating hasn’t had out gay athletes. There’s Rudy Galindo, a ready-made hard-knock story who grew up in a trailer, abused alcohol and drugs, and lost two coaches and a brother to AIDS. Galindo came out publicly a few weeks before the 1996 U.S. nationals; he skated last in his group (a position that made it harder for the judges to artificially deflate his scores), and to everyone’s surprise, he won, becoming the first out national champion. When he was finally inducted into the U.S. Figure Skating Hall of Fame last year after having been rejected three times, his sexuality was not mentioned during the ceremony.

A decade later, skater Johnny Weir brought exquisite technical and artistic performances on the ice, but he also brought a reality-television show, a pop song (“Dirty Love”), and an outspoken diva-worship of Lady Gaga; a word often used to describe him was “flamboyant,” despite the fact that, until 2011, he kept his sexuality private. And last month, after 1988 gold medalist Brian Boitano was named to the U.S. Olympic Delegation to Sochi, he announced that he, too, was gay. Boitano’s enough of an established legend to be on the safe side, but it seems that in general, gay skaters are just a tad too implicating of the male skaters around them to be seriously endorsed. They are dismissed in countless subtle ways. One pump-up video montage at nationals showed clip after clip of top male skaters performing one enormous jump after another, but depicted Rudy Galindo crossing himself and Johnny Weir bursting into tears.

So what exactly is male figure skating — which has the potential to be a gay haven in the world of sports — so afraid of?
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Old 02-11-2014, 05:39 PM   #984
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Here's an interesting thought, albeit dangerous to state without coming off the wrong way.

It's hard to understand what really goes on in any locker room, in any sport.

In the NFL, the macho man culture speaks for itself. Being gay in the NFL might be the hardest of the four North American sports. Some might physically target you over your sexuality, in game.

In the NBA, that macho man culture isn't there. Basketball isn't the most physical of sports. And to no surprise, I imagine basketball to be one of the better of the four sports with gay athletes. There's a certain respect for players like Jason Collins, for example. Of course this isn't league-wide, that isn't expected. But, it's been seen several times that the thing to do in the wake of a gay slur in the NBA is to apologize to Jason Collins (lol).

In the MLB, I don't think that same respect culture exists. My theory behind that is that MLB culture is founded upon a lot of international players, unlike the NFL or NBA. There's no macho man culture, but I also suspect that baseball demands the least amount of education per player, on average. So, I do think that it might actually be most difficult I'm the MLB to actually change the culture.

Lastly, in the NHL, things don't stay consistent with the other three leagues. You again have the lack of education per player required. You've also got the most amount of international players. Yet, the NHL, publicly, is the strongest league in support of gay athletes. I imagine the source countries of these athletes actually work in the opposite way as opposed to the MLB.

I guess ultimately the question is... where is the source of homophobia most powerful in sports? Lack of education? Macho man culture? Basketball subculture (not to be confused with the NBA itself)? Backgrounds in nationality? The NFL might truly be the scariest sport to be gay in, but ultimately is it the hardest league to exhibit progressive change?

I honestly think that might be the MLB. I think that nationality thing is more powerful than anything else.
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Old 02-11-2014, 06:40 PM   #985
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In the NFL, the macho man culture speaks for itself.
Wrong again.

Detorit Pistons v Indiana Pacers Brawl/Fight - "Malice in the Palace" | Biggest Fight In NBA History - YouTube
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Old 02-11-2014, 06:48 PM   #986
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Oh there was a big fight a decade ago in basketball? You're right I'm sorry. Why don't you stick on topic and quit your trolling? You have added literally zero substance to a perfectly legitimate post open to discussion.
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Old 02-11-2014, 06:56 PM   #987
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Oh there was a big fight a decade ago in basketball? You're right I'm sorry. Why don't you stick on topic and quit your trolling? You have added literally zero substance to a perfectly legitimate post open to discussion.
Perhaps you can stick to mindless arguments in a pointless hole instead of trying to speak about sports. You're out of your depths, Sparky.
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Old 02-11-2014, 07:00 PM   #988
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All I'm saying is... this is a discussion about same sex marriage and even I am deviating a bit off topic talking about homophobia in sports. If you disagree with a point I made, feel free to engage in discussion and state your opinion instead of choosing to respond the way you have.
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Old 02-11-2014, 07:01 PM   #989
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The NBA actually had the first openly gay professional athlete, and all 30 teams refused to sign him.
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Old 02-11-2014, 08:39 PM   #990
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Same Sex Marriage Thread - Part III

All thes professional sports teams have one thing in common: they are all made up of employees. The players are hired and fired at will, and they compete for a paycheck paid for by people buying merchandise and tickets for entertainment events.

Fuck whatever macho culture may exist. These are professional adults capable of acting like adults and adhering to whatever rules of conduct and behavior their employer expects of them. If someone doesn't like the thought of sharing a locker room with a gay guy, that's really his problem, and one he needs to get over much in the same way a lawyer or accountant would have to get over his issues with a gay person in his workplace. It's not on the gay person to make you comfortable. It's up to you to manage your shit.

It's just a job. There aren't lives at stake. It's not the military.
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