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Old 09-02-2013, 08:39 PM   #526
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Congratulations and much happiness to both of you.
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Old 09-03-2013, 01:45 PM   #527
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Old 09-04-2013, 05:55 PM   #528
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well, it's official.

Memphis and I are engaged.
Congratulations to you both!
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Old 09-04-2013, 07:45 PM   #529
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well, it's official.

Memphis and I are engaged.
Huge congratulations!!!
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Old 09-04-2013, 08:10 PM   #530
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I'm late to the party, but congrats, Irvine. I wish you the very best.
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Old 09-04-2013, 08:39 PM   #531
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Congratulations, well deserved.
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Old 09-04-2013, 09:18 PM   #532
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Thanks to everyone.

We'll have the wedding at some point in 2014.
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Old 09-04-2013, 10:41 PM   #533
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Hey Irvine,

If it's not too personal - I was curious about what both your families think of the marriage. You don't have to answer if you don't want to - I am just curious to see how families (in general) are reacting to all of this. For instance, my aunt had a lesbian marriage last year and my grandma stood up at the reception and shouted, "will someone PLEASE tell me who is the bride and who is the groom."

For the most part our family really has embraced my aunt's marriage (and believe it or not, when we have a family gathering my aunt's wife seems really drawn to me as a friend and we spend a lot of time talking about FYM sort of topics...)

Anyway - do you expect that your families will embrace the decision? Or do you think there will be at least a few older relatives that will make a stink of it?
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Old 09-04-2013, 10:48 PM   #534
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For instance, my aunt had a lesbian marriage last year and my grandma stood up at the reception and shouted, "will someone PLEASE tell me who is the bride and who is the groom."
Dear Lord.
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:02 PM   #535
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Dear Lord.
She was born in the Midwest in 1922. Not to excuse her actions during the reception - but in her lifetime she lived through the The Great Depression, WWII, Korean War, Her sons in Vietnam, her grandsons (my brother and I) in the Gulf War and War on Terror, landing a man on the frickin moon, space shuttle, pc's, Internet, Great Society, Frank Sinatra, The Beatles, U2...you name it.

We tend to cut her a bit of slack...
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:46 PM   #536
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That's really awful. I remember you had hinted that the children in their marriage -- it is a marriage, not a "lesbian marriage" -- had some difficulties being the children of a same-sex couple. Perhaps this might have something to do with it? Not this incident in particular, but sounds like there's a lack of acceptance there that the child likely absorbs.

As for our families, everyone is fine and happy and the important people plan on attending. I'm sure it's hard for our parents in some ways, but for very different reasons that are too complex to go into here (in a nutshell, Memphis is from a fire and brimstone tradition, I'm from American Beauty-style white suburban perfectionism land), but that's their problem, and not one that would be too much different than an interracial or an inter-religious marriage for people who are a little bit racist and a little bit prejudiced. Literally everyone else is happy for us, and finds it somewhat unremarkable. We've been together 8 years and own a house -- why wouldn't we be married?
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Old 09-04-2013, 11:49 PM   #537
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it is a marriage, not a "lesbian marriage"
In fairness to Aeon, had he not specified it was a same sex marriage, there would've been a lot of "...I don't get it"
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Old 09-05-2013, 12:39 AM   #538
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That's really awful. I remember you had hinted that the children in their marriage -- it is a marriage, not a "lesbian marriage" -- had some difficulties being the children of a same-sex couple. Perhaps this might have something to do with it? Not this incident in particular, but sounds like there's a lack of acceptance there that the child likely absorbs.
I think the problems with the children are more complex. The behavioral issues sort of came to light when my aunt first "came out of the closet" so to speak. The marriage was only more awkward for them, bit not a root cause. The eldest son ran away and joined the Navy only to be killed by a texting driver while on leave (I'm not blaming my aunt for the car accident - just stating he ran away). Her other children are doing okay, but they are certainly struggling with the idea that their mom is now married to another woman. I don't think my grandma has that much influence anymore - but she did make me stop parking my car in front of her home because I had one of the Darwin bumper decals back in 1993 (the one with the Christian fish and the feet...I thought I was so clever).

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As for our families, everyone is fine and happy and the important people plan on attending. I'm sure it's hard for our parents in some ways, but for very different reasons that are too complex to go into here (in a nutshell, Memphis is from a fire and brimstone tradition, I'm from American Beauty-style white suburban perfectionism land), but that's their problem, and not one that would be too much different than an interracial or an inter-religious marriage for people who are a little bit racist and a little bit prejudiced. Literally everyone else is happy for us, and finds it somewhat unremarkable. We've been together 8 years and own a house -- why wouldn't we be married?
That makes sense. I guess that was about what I would expect. Although I would probably keep an eye on Memphis' bro cousins speaking out...

If either of my kids turn out gay (although at 14 - I'm fairly certain my stepdaughter prefers boys), I'm certain I would still love them and try to be a great dad. But I must admit - it would be difficult for me. I know I know - that makes me sound like Archie Bunker - but it's how I feel.
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Old 09-05-2013, 10:05 AM   #539
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Congrats to you and Memphis, Irvine
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Old 09-05-2013, 12:10 PM   #540
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I think the problems with the children are more complex. The behavioral issues sort of came to light when my aunt first "came out of the closet" so to speak. The marriage was only more awkward for them, bit not a root cause. The eldest son ran away and joined the Navy only to be killed by a texting driver while on leave (I'm not blaming my aunt for the car accident - just stating he ran away). Her other children are doing okay, but they are certainly struggling with the idea that their mom is now married to another woman. I don't think my grandma has that much influence anymore - but she did make me stop parking my car in front of her home because I had one of the Darwin bumper decals back in 1993 (the one with the Christian fish and the feet...I thought I was so clever).


firstly, i am very, very sorry for your loss. i've had a similar situation, and it's unimaginably horrible to lose someone so quickly. especially, for you, someone that young.

i also was probably a little bit quick to jump on the grandmother, and while i think her behavior is awful, family dynamics are always complex and impossible to explain on a site like this. i will say that if your aunt is a later-in-life lesbian, it probably *is* a bit strange for her children who lived through a divorce and then a remarriage to a person of the same sex. i can't begin to know the details, and they aren't my business, but it seems like it's complex and messy, like life. and i wish them all the best.



Quote:
That makes sense. I guess that was about what I would expect. Although I would probably keep an eye on Memphis' bro cousins speaking out...

If either of my kids turn out gay (although at 14 - I'm fairly certain my stepdaughter prefers boys), I'm certain I would still love them and try to be a great dad. But I must admit - it would be difficult for me. I know I know - that makes me sound like Archie Bunker - but it's how I feel.

i think only a small amount of people could even afford to make the trip up to DC, and those that have said they would come are thrilled. even in the deep South, it's generational. pretty much everyone under 40 can't see what the issue is with SSM.

we also haven't figured out the guest list just yet.

of course, there are complexities to our situation. we've had difficult things to deal with that no straight couple would ever have to deal with, and i think it speaks well of our relationship that we're still together and happy as ever even without certain things that most straight couples take for granted.

i don't think it's inappropriate or wrong for a straight parent to wish that their children would also be straight. certainly, it's easier, and certainly it's what the vast majority of people are. it's easier to fit in than to stand out. it's also normal to want your children to be like you. and there's a 95% chance that your children are straight. but it's important to realize that if your child is gay, these feelings you have of disappointment or difficulty, are *your* issues, and it's up to you to work through them. your child has done nothing wrong, and in fact has done a lot right in coming out and being honest. and, further, that there is nothing you have done wrong as a parent. homophobia not only hurts gay people, but it hurts their families.
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