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Old 02-13-2012, 03:36 PM   #271
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I lost you at the second Americans ...
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Old 02-13-2012, 03:43 PM   #272
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One by one they all fall down.
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Old 02-13-2012, 04:03 PM   #273
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This might be a dumb question, but I'm curious: around the globe, is America seen as more or less accepting of gay marriage?
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Old 02-13-2012, 04:07 PM   #274
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Woo to Washington state and New Jersey .

This is starting to feel like a guessing game: What state will be next?
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Old 02-13-2012, 04:22 PM   #275
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This might be a dumb question, but I'm curious: around the globe, is America seen as more or less accepting of gay marriage?


globally, we're way ahead of most. as western nations go, we seem to be a bit behind, say, parts of Western Europe and Canada, but so far ahead of Australia and Central Europe. Argentina and South Africa also have marriage equality.

so we're pretty good. but our size makes us less nimble than others -- you won't find a place in the western world more gay friendly than, say, San Francisco; but then, there's rural Wyoming.
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Old 02-13-2012, 04:23 PM   #276
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Woo to Washington state and New Jersey .

This is starting to feel like a guessing game: What state will be next?


Maryland and Maine and Illinois.
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Old 02-14-2012, 10:38 AM   #277
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Old 02-14-2012, 03:34 PM   #278
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Washington state legalized it! I am proud to live here.
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Old 02-14-2012, 03:45 PM   #279
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why must the right of some americans to discriminate against other americans be crushed by the people all those americans elected to make laws to govern said americans?
Most laws apply to a general sense and are not necessarily applied in a fair fashion.

Take drinking age for example, lowering the age of 21 to 18 arguing that if kids are old enough to go to war and die they should also be able to drink and die from drinking too, if they wish. Due to the small portion of teenagers under 21 who got drunk and died, caused accidents and higher insurance premiums, etc. then the law applies to all teenagers and generalize that all teenagers under 21 are irresponsible, when the reality is that they aren't.
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Old 02-14-2012, 07:31 PM   #280
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Maryland and Maine and Illinois.
Sounds good.

Illinois would be great if for no other reason than it'd be nice to have another state here in the middle of the country supporting us. Iowa's all alone right now "middle"-wise, all the other states that legalized this are on the western and eastern ends of the country !

Awesome quote from Jon Stewart there . Christians here in the States who complain about "persecution" should go talk to their fellow Christians in the Middle East right now. I'm sure those guys would have a LOT of sympathy for U.S. Christians' plight.
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Old 02-18-2012, 12:21 PM   #281
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TRENTON, N.J. — Gov. Chris Christie has followed through on his promise to reject a bill allowing same-sex marriage in New Jersey by quickly vetoing the measure Friday and renewing his call for a ballot question to decide the issue.

The veto came a day after the state Assembly passed the bill. The state Senate had passed it on Monday. Christie, a Republican who opposes same-sex marriage, had vowed "very swift action" once the measure reached his desk.

In returning the bill to the Legislature, Christie reaffirmed his view that voters should decide whether to change the definition of marriage in New Jersey. His veto also proposed creating an ombudsman to oversee compliance with the state's civil union law, which same-sex couples have said is flawed and promotes discrimination.

"I am adhering to what I've said since this bill was first introduced – an issue of this magnitude and importance, which requires a constitutional amendment, should be left to the people of New Jersey to decide," Christie said in a statement. "I continue to encourage the Legislature to trust the people of New Jersey and seek their input by allowing our citizens to vote on a question that represents a profoundly significant societal change. This is the only path to amend our State Constitution and the best way to resolve the issue of same-sex marriage in our state.

"I have been just as adamant that same-sex couples in a civil union deserve the very same rights and benefits enjoyed by married couples – as well as the strict enforcement of those rights and benefits," the statement continued. "Discrimination should not be tolerated and any complaint alleging a violation of a citizen's right should be investigated and, if appropriate, remedied. To that end, I include in my conditional veto the creation of a strong Ombudsman for Civil Unions to carry on New Jersey's strong tradition of tolerance and fairness."
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Old 02-18-2012, 12:39 PM   #282
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Gubernatorial activism.

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Old 02-18-2012, 12:45 PM   #283
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I can't imagine voting on anyone's right to get married, a right I have just by virtue of being born straight.

I don't feel in any way deprived that gay marriage was legalized in my state and I never got to vote on it.
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Old 02-18-2012, 02:12 PM   #284
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Gubernatorial activism.

The executive branch vetoing an act of the legislative branch = a republic

The governor asking that the law be decided by a vote of the people = direct democracy

The courts assuming to be above all of that = judicial activism
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Old 02-18-2012, 02:26 PM   #285
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The executive branch vetoing an act of the legislative branch = a republic

The governor asking that the law be decided by a vote of the people = direct democracy

The courts assuming to be above all of that = judicial activism
Abolish the courts then? Why don't we just have people vote on everything?
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