"Right To Die" Case Of Battered Girl - Page 3 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 12-07-2005, 07:14 PM   #31
ONE
love, blood, life
 
BonosBaby12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: East Coast girl living in Chi-Town
Posts: 14,889
Local Time: 02:03 PM
I had heard before that sickos like this get their true justice in prison. Have heard stories from reliable sources about how the guards leak the information. See this is as complete justice. Someone has to defend the innocent.
__________________

__________________
BonosBaby12 is offline  
Old 12-07-2005, 07:26 PM   #32
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 06:03 AM
Is that justice or vengence?
__________________

__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 12-07-2005, 07:30 PM   #33
ONE
love, blood, life
 
melon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 11,781
Local Time: 03:03 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Is that justice or vengence?
The latter.

Melon
__________________
melon is offline  
Old 12-07-2005, 10:39 PM   #34
Refugee
 
Sue DeNym's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: The Beautiful Pacific Northwest!
Posts: 1,608
Local Time: 12:03 PM

Quote:
Peel said Haleigh's doctors "have consistent medical opinion about her current condition" and all agree she will not regain consciousness.
Then let the poor child go.

And her abuser needs to be taken out of society, permanently. Beating her into a vegetative state, then demanding parental rights...what gall. This man is evil, and must be punished. Death penalty or life in prison, I don't care, just get him the hell away from the rest of us before he destroys another innocent life!
__________________
Sue DeNym is offline  
Old 12-07-2005, 11:01 PM   #35
ONE
love, blood, life
 
BonosBaby12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: East Coast girl living in Chi-Town
Posts: 14,889
Local Time: 02:03 PM
I see it more as justice than vengeance. Sitting around in prison being cared for is not a punishment in my eyes. And yes I know it's not a great place to be. But it's a hell of a lot more than some victims will ever have again.
__________________
BonosBaby12 is offline  
Old 12-07-2005, 11:10 PM   #36
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 06:03 AM
What is the calculus of deserved punishment? Why do we see cases of severe crimes against individual innocents (or horses for that matter) elicit more emotion than those of mass murder. It is a fascinating little piece of human psychology, sort of the case where you choose between having one person die or having ten people die, and then being offered the chance to save ten people by sacrificing one person, the second choice is inherently more difficult for people even though the act is more or less the same. In the same manner when confronted by a man who beats an innocent little girl to a state of living death people reflexively desire to see him suffer for what he has done in a manner that will not alleviate any future suffering or bring about any justice - but would be very wary of inflicting suffering upon a mass murderer who when captured holds information that would save lives.

If you have a paedophile in custody who has abducted a young child starving them and indulging his vile instincts who has hidden them away and will not divulge their location what means would you personally be willing to take to get that sort of information, the victims life hanging in the balance? I think that in peoples heart of hearts they react very differently to dilemmas when the truly innocent are involved.
__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 12:52 AM   #37
Forum Moderator
 
yolland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 7,471
Local Time: 09:03 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Why do we see cases of severe crimes against individual innocents (or horses for that matter) elicit more emotion than those of mass murder.
...I think that in peoples heart of hearts they react very differently to dilemmas when the truly innocent are involved.
I think that's part of it, but it's also that the possible "motives" involved here are so much less graspable to most people, incomprehensible to such a degree as to provoke nausea (BonosBaby's visceral disgust) or overwhelmed tears (Irvine). All of us, sadly, have some idea from experience of how hateful feelings can give rise to a kind of madness which makes it easy to see others as deserving of pain and suffering, but it is not an emotion most of us could ever imagine feeling towards our own children, or any children. It is simply too far outside the grasp of most people's imaginations to conceive of feeling this kind of sadism towards a child--even while recognizing that it is seldom any more rational to feel it towards an adult.

I don't think it's categorically true that mass murder, in the sense you seem to be getting at, elicits less emotion from most people. 9/11 was certainly a very emotional day for most Americans. I do think the range of emotions involved was different, though; there was a dimension of fear involved which one wouldn't feel here--partly because of the self-protective I could be next! impulse, and partly because of the unnerving shock of recognizing an emotion you can name and (to a point) grasp running underneath it all.

Personally though, I have always shied away from discussions like this--let's all join together and vent our mortal disgust at this subhuman monster--because it makes me feel claustrophobic and, frankly, a bit frightened. What I feel most of all towards cases like this is a kind of bleak and hollow despair at knowing such individuals will always exist, and that there is nothing--no goodwill gesture, no pre-emptive strike, no longterm readjustment plan, nothing--that any of us can do about it.
__________________
yolland is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 02:02 AM   #38
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
U2DMfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: It's Inside A Black Hole
Posts: 6,637
Local Time: 02:03 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
In the same manner when confronted by a man who beats an innocent little girl to a state of living death people reflexively desire to see him suffer for what he has done in a manner that will not alleviate any future suffering or bring about any justice - but would be very wary of inflicting suffering upon a mass murderer who when captured holds information that would save lives.

Some are wary of torture because of it's drawbacks on our guys.
You know this. It's sort of the John McCain principle.

Many of these same people, maybe even McCain himself would volunteer to kick this particular guy down the street. I don't see a huge inconsistency.
__________________
U2DMfan is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 03:47 AM   #39
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 06:03 AM
You don't?

Individuals who inflict as much if not more suffering and peoples emotional response is entirely different.

Why don't we hear about the "root causes" of child abuse?
__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 04:09 AM   #40
Forum Moderator
 
yolland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 7,471
Local Time: 09:03 PM
But we do, we hear about them all the time! Child abuse of the abuser usually heads off the list, followed by substance abuse and inability to manage anger. But again, these are problems no government can address, and again they are completely unrecognizable to most people as "motivations" to do such things to a child.
__________________
yolland is offline  
Old 12-08-2005, 09:15 AM   #41
ONE
love, blood, life
 
BonosBaby12's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: East Coast girl living in Chi-Town
Posts: 14,889
Local Time: 02:03 PM
Just to state ahead of time I am completely respective and open to other's opinions. Realize the degree of sensitivity with this topic.

It's understandable that there is a percentage of those who abuse were abused themselves. Honestly I can't imagine what one suffers with going through that. However does that entitle them to inflict their pain upon someone else in the same manner? To me the answer is clearly no. Having been a child they know what it's like to experience that fear and feel that pain. Why would you want to go and inflict that upon any child? These children are so innocent and trusting of those who are to care for them. Anyone who has dealt with a child knows the unconditonal love they have. And for a psycho to come along and strip that child of everything just absolutely sickens me! That is why I feel it is due justice with the punishment they receive in prison. Sadly there are many in prison who have children of their own. So that's another reason why this occurrs so much. The paternal insticts kick in and they think "What if that had been my child that this happened to?". As with the case of the woman who shot her son's molester in court. She couldn't fathom the system releasing him back into society to do this to another child. Who is going to protect these children from the monster that lurks in the dark?

As for the mass murderers I personally feel extreme anger at what they do. Such as with 9/11 personally I was terrified that I could be next. Being an American you didn't feel you were safe from this horror. Than as the fear subsided the anger kicked in for me. Who really has the right to go and do this to such a large amount of innocent people? My feeling that who was ever involved and is convicted should receive the death penalty. Such as any other case involving a mass murderer or even serial killer. Whenever I hear about these senseless killings it makes me question how someone could do this. Sadly we live in a twisted society and that in itself is quite frightening.
__________________
BonosBaby12 is offline  
Old 01-17-2006, 01:41 PM   #42
Forum Moderator
 
yolland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 7,471
Local Time: 09:03 PM
I suppose this is the best possible ending to the grotesque closing chapter of this girl's life. On with her killer's trial.
Quote:
MA high court says state can take 11-year-old off life support


By Adam Gorlick
The Associated Press, 17 January, 2006


SPRINGFIELD, Mass. – The state's highest court ruled today that the state can withdraw life support from an 11-year-old girl who was badly beaten, allegedly by her adoptive mother and stepfather.

Haleigh Poutre, of Westfield, was hospitalized in September after she was allegedly kicked and beaten nearly to death with a baseball bat.

The girl's stepfather, Jason Strickland, asked the Supreme Judicial Court last month to block the state from taking her off life support, arguing that he was the girl's "de facto" parent. He is already charged in her beating and if she dies, could face a murder charge.

The adoptive mother, Holli Strickland, who was also Haleigh's aunt, was also charged in the beating and was found dead alongside her grandmother in a possible murder-suicide less than two weeks later.

The state Department of Social Services has custody of the girl and wants to remove her from life support, citing opinions from her doctors that the girl is in a permanent vegetative state.

A juvenile court judge granted the state's request to disconnect Haleigh's feeding tube and ventilator, prompting Jason Strickland to appeal to the SJC. Doctors had said Haleigh would die within a few days without the feeding tube.

But in its ruling, the court said he had offered no evidence "that his participation in (Haleigh's) life was of a loving or nurturing nature."

"Obviously we're deeply disappointed," said Strickland's lawyer, John Egan. "They decided the case on the most narrow grounds possible." No decision had been made on whether the case would be taken any further, he said.

Haleigh's biological mother, Allison Avrett, said today: "I'm in complete shock at this point. My mind is running with things." She has said she favors removal of life support, because the girl has suffered enough.

Haleigh was adopted by her aunt about five years ago after Avrett moved to Virginia with a new boyfriend. Jason Strickland, who never formally adopted the girl, argued that as the stepfather, he should be considered a de facto parent and allowed to have a say in whether she lives or dies. Egan insisted his client wasn't motivated by the chance he could be charged with murder if the girl dies. "We should be coming down on the side of life as opposed to death," he told the justices during last month's hearing.

But the SJC said in its ruling that it was impossible to consider Strickland's intentions without also taking into account the criminal charges he might face if she dies.

"To recognize the petitioner as a de facto parent, in order that he may participate in a medical end-of-life decision for the child, is unthinkable in the circumstances of this case," the SJC said.
__________________
yolland is offline  
Old 01-17-2006, 02:00 PM   #43
Blue Crack Addict
 
MrsSpringsteen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 24,974
Local Time: 03:03 PM
I hadn't heard that, thanks for the info yolland

That poor little girl

Yes, time for his trial
__________________
MrsSpringsteen is offline  
Old 01-17-2006, 06:47 PM   #44
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
BonosSaint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,566
Local Time: 04:03 PM
Poor child. Looks like she had no one to look out for her.
__________________
BonosSaint is offline  
Old 01-17-2006, 06:56 PM   #45
ONE
love, blood, life
 
indra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 12,689
Local Time: 04:03 PM
Poor kid.

I don't understand how people can do stuff like that.
__________________

__________________
indra is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:03 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com