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Old 09-23-2005, 03:19 PM   #46
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I am in no position to be throwing stones.

I find myself telling stories sometimes and I have to test myself for bias.

I was talking about a very good friend, who is a bit difficult, he is very demanding, unforgiving of mistakes when he is paying for a service or a product. He is successful and does not quibble about price.

He is equally hard on himself, his work product. He sets the highest standard for himself and everyone, else.


Well, when I was relating a story I stopped myself from describing him as a “gay” person.

I asked myself what his sexuality had to do with him being extremely demanding.

I am very forgiving, as long as it is salvageable, and the mistake will not be repeated.
I find this attitude gets me further in the long run. The old “love vs fear” theory.

Well, I told the story without sexual orientation mentioned. (I did a quick inventory of difficult clients and friends and found correlating numbers in the straight population)
To preface the story as my “gay friend” would only contribute to stereotyping and reveal my? bias.

At age 20-30 I was cock-sure in my opinions as being 100 per cent sound.

At age 50, I am able to see other sides more objectively without feeling threatened that “my absolute truths” are not the only answer.

WE ALL HAVE BIAS’.

The only question is
will we work on them?
Can we move away from them? Little by little?


I have started threads in here that put my BIAS up front.
I am capable of learning, growing and moving on.
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:19 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
There are all kinds of ideas that will never be completely eliminated. I don't see the need for racial agitators any more than I see the need for anyone still fighting to let women into the workforce.
I disagree. As long as racism exists, someone needs to raise hell about it. We need demonstrations and such to show that we don't approve of racism, to keep public awareness up. When an evil like racism is going on you just don't sit around and twiddle your thumbs, you agitate. I agree that we'll never get rid of racism, but that's no reason not to protest.
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:26 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511
race matters.
In light of your statement (with which I do not necessarily disagree), will we ever get to a point when race does not matter?
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:30 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


In light of your statement (with which I do not necessarily disagree), will we ever get to a point when race does not matter?


i have no idea.

great question -- possibly unanswerable, so long as there is history.
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:34 PM   #50
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actually, let me amend that.

i think there might be an end of easy racial distinctions.

how?

through sexual attraction. today, more than ever, there are kids of mixed race heritage, and it's no secret that people of one race often find people of other races extremely alluring -- just think Thomas Jefferson and his slaves, or, heck, even Strom Thurmond. i would say the majority of my friends have dated outside their race.

i thought "monster's ball" was a brilliant movie, and a movie where the graphic sex scene was 100% justified and necessary to plot and theme -- it showed that opposite-race sexual attraction is a powerful, powerful thing, and it allowed a white racist to see a black female as a woman and human being. sexual desire trumps racial prejudice. it's through sexual attraction and romance and love and procreation that racial distinctions will become more and more blurred.

to further complicate this, if one day i do adopt (and i hope life allows me to do so), i don't see myself adopting a white child.

for whatever that's worth.
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:35 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
I don't see the need for racial agitators any more than I see the need for anyone still fighting to let women into the workforce.

The fact that we have a federal sex discrimination law does not mean the fight is over,

There are many acts of discrimination occurring daily.
There needs to vigilance to provide equal opportunity for all.


You and I (and I could name others that post in here) are white males living in America.

Do we see ourselves as only someone that has something to lose in these disputes?

Is it OUR place to tell the women to “stop bithin' you can be a garbage collector or a fire fighter.”
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:37 PM   #52
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A true melting pot of races. I wonder how many generations it would take to achieve.

But if "race matters" is always tied to a history of racism - it is self perpetuating. It will never end.
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:39 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader
A true melting pot of races. I wonder how many generations it would take to achieve.

But if "race matters" is always tied to a history of racism - it is self perpetuating. It will never end.


one self-defines partially (if not mostly) through determining what one is not.

i don't see it ending either.
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:44 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511




i thought "monster's ball" was a brilliant movie, and a movie where the graphic sex scene was 100% justified and necessary to plot and theme -- it showed that opposite-race sexual attraction is a powerful,
billy bob's charater did evolve a bit



but bigots fucking slaves and maids
will do nothing to end racism and only adds to it


it is my hope that with easy transportation, world economies, that a few hundred years cultures will mix to an extent that race matters less

i am currently seeing someone outside of my race
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:51 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511





i don't see it ending either.
This is sad.
but many only define themselves as "us and them"

I have been working hard to let go of that concept

There really is only "us"

Many would achieve that "us"
through converting, conquering, or making them change over to "us"

I guess if we were ever "lucky enough" to have an earth destroying meteor approach our planet
we could be "us" for that duration.
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Old 09-23-2005, 03:58 PM   #56
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Funny thing, though, regarding race-Irvine's post about mixed relationships made me think of it...in my sociology book it says that there's never been such thing as a pure race because of the kinds of things Irvine alluded to-slaves and white owners getting together and things like that. So it's a bit strange to hear a racist talking about wanting a "pure" race...if my book is true, their ancestry isn't pure, either.

I've never dated outside of my race, but that's due to the fact that I've tended to lived in towns that are so full of white people it's not even funny-finding someone who wasn't white wandering about was a surprise to many. The main minorities there were Mexicans, and even then, it was a very small portion, and it was mainly some families.

But I definitely recall some remarks made in one of the towns I lived in back in Iowa whenever a white person would date a Mexican. They weren't very friendly remarks.

In regards to the race card, I agree with what U2democrat about hurting a cause and that sort of thing, but at the same time, I don't doubt that there's still underlying racial issues in this world. What worries me is the fact that it seems with a lot of other tragic events in which prejudice and discrimination ran rampant, people didn't seem to wake up, so...I'm a bit worried as to how bad things have to get before people do wake up.

Angela
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Old 09-23-2005, 04:06 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally posted by Moonlit_Angel
Funny thing, though, regarding race-Irvine's post about mixed relationships made me think of it...in my sociology book it says that there's never been such thing as a pure race because of the kinds of things Irvine alluded to-slaves and white owners getting together and things like that.

So it's a bit strange to hear a racist talking about wanting a "pure" race...if my book is true, their ancestry isn't pure, either.



Angela
They don't need a pure race to be bigots

They just need to be able to differentiate.

That they will have sexual relations with
minorities means nothing more than when a man? uses a street walking prostitute for sexual gratification

does that mean he wants to share his life with her, put her on his health plan and in his will?
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Old 09-23-2005, 04:09 PM   #58
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Words can't explain my feelings for this thread...


"He won the lottery by being born
Big hand slapped a white male American"
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Old 09-23-2005, 04:15 PM   #59
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I have just read through this whole thread and I just want to say
I love you Mrs. Springstein and Irvine!!! I agree with you both 100% . I really is sad that some ppl want to pretend that race is not an issue when it is so obvious that it is. Racism does exsist!! I just hope that one day it won't.
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Old 09-23-2005, 04:19 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep
They don't need a pure race to be bigots

They just need to be able to differentiate.

That they will have sexual relations with
minorities means nothing more than when a man? uses a street walking prostitute for sexual gratification

does that mean he wants to share his life with her, put her on his health plan and in his will?
Oh, that's very true, I agree. I was thinking about the KKK people who talk about how they want to keep their race pure when I wrote that-never gonna happen, buddy, you've got mixed relations in your ancestry.

But yes, you are right about that stuff, too.

Angela
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