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Old 02-17-2007, 03:40 PM   #91
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A question for the people that think this is wrong:

What if there was an effective HIV/ Aids vaccine
that had to be given to before age 12 to be effective? and it worked for both boys and girls, and was offered to all children?


Would you opt your child out?
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Old 02-17-2007, 03:53 PM   #92
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Originally posted by BorderGirl


there are PLENTY of risks.......only people gaining here are Merck and Lawyers.

"public “health” authorities may have taken it a bit too far this time by attempting to require preteen girls, as a condition of attending school, to be injected with a barely tested vaccine against a disease that is not easily transmitted in school setting."

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source: w w w .honesthuman.com

Beware of Gardasil, The Cervical Cancer Vaccine

Only 20,541 women were used (half got the “placebo”) and their health was followed up for only four years at maximum and typically 1-3 years only. More critically, only 1,121 of these subjects were less than 16. The younger subjects were only followed up for a maximum of 18 months. Furthermore, less than 10% of these subjects received true placebo injections. The others were given injections containing an aluminum salt adjuvant (vaccine enhancer) that is also a component of GARDASIL. This is scientifically preposterous, especially when you consider that similar alum adjuvants are suspected to be responsible for Gulf War disease and other possible vaccination related complications.

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http. whale.to/ vaccines/ lobato. html
But besides disagreeing with the test sample size, were there any reported side effects? Everything I've read has the same stuff as any other vaccine we get regularly (mostly injection site pain or reaction).
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Old 02-17-2007, 05:20 PM   #93
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Originally posted by Liesje


But besides disagreeing with the test sample size, were there any reported side effects? Everything I've read has the same stuff as any other vaccine we get regularly (mostly injection site pain or reaction).
Test sample size is just one part of this irresponsible study.
I urge you and everyone to read up on it.

Some people are unsupportive because of "moral" reasons (huh?), but there are health risks to a developing 9 year old body, and the sense of false security that this vaccine will provide.
Cervical cancer is a broad disease not completely covered by this vaccination.
This is not about teenagers having sex, it is about whether Gardasil has been proven safe and effective for LITTLE girls.
If adult girls want it, that should be their own decision.

"There is too little long term safety and efficacy data, especially in young girls, and too little labeling information on contraindications for the CDC
to recommend Gardasil for universal use...."Nobody at Merck, the CDC or FDA know if the injection of Gardasil into all pre-teen girls -- especially simultaneously with hepatitis B vaccine -- will make some of them more likely to develop
arthritis or other inflammatory autoimmune and brain disorders as teenagers
and adults. With cervical cancer causing about one percent of all cancer deaths in American women due to routine pap screening, it was inappropriate
for the FDA to fast track Gardasil. It is way too early to direct all young girls to get three doses of a vaccine that has not been proven safe or
effective in their age group."

Full article (remove spaces):
w w w.ahrp.org/cms/content/view/263/28/
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Old 02-17-2007, 05:24 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep
A question for the people that think this is wrong:

What if there was an effective HIV/ Aids vaccine
that had to be given to before age 12 to be effective? and it worked for both boys and girls, and was offered to all children?


Would you opt your child out?
No. Is this a trick question?
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Old 02-17-2007, 08:38 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally posted by BorderGirl




Some people are unsupportive because of "moral" reasons (huh?), but there are health risks to a developing 9 year old body, and the sense of false security that this vaccine will provide.
Cervical cancer is a broad disease not completely covered by this vaccination.
This is not about teenagers having sex, it is about whether Gardasil has been proven safe and effective for LITTLE girls.
If adult girls want it, that should be their own decision.
Well, I guess I can agree on this. I was speaking more for myself (I'm 22). If I had a 9 year old daughter and honestly thought she was ready to be sexually active, I'd probably be checking her into counseling rather than getting this vaccination. A teenager though, I don't see what the big deal is. I stopped growing at age 13 (like most girls, stopped 2 years after my period started) so I was my "adult" size and shape at that point. If I have a daughter and the same is true for her, I wouldn't have a problem with her getting vaccinated at this age.

But I still haven't seen anything that proves the vaccination is unsafe for 11 year olds, even if we're hesitant to do it that young.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:22 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally posted by Liesje


Well, I guess I can agree on this. I was speaking more for myself (I'm 22). If I had a 9 year old daughter and honestly thought she was ready to be sexually active, I'd probably be checking her into counseling rather than getting this vaccination. A teenager though, I don't see what the big deal is. I stopped growing at age 13 (like most girls, stopped 2 years after my period started) so I was my "adult" size and shape at that point. If I have a daughter and the same is true for her, I wouldn't have a problem with her getting vaccinated at this age.

But I still haven't seen anything that proves the vaccination is unsafe for 11 year olds, even if we're hesitant to do it that young.
Even though a child's body size and shape may be that of an adult, they are not yet biologically adults.
The hormonal effects of estrogen for females alone.....
This is off topic but theres's a great book all females should read called "The Female Brain" by Louann Md Brizendine.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:35 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally posted by BorderGirl


Even though a child's body size and shape may be that of an adult, they are not yet biologically adults.
The hormonal effects of estrogen for females alone.....
How so? I was my adult height and weight, physically and reproductively mature, and could have started taking birth control (hormones) just like adult women.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:36 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally posted by BorderGirl


there are PLENTY of risks.......only people gaining here are Merck and Lawyers.
That's just a completely bombastic statement right there.

They say they don't know the effects of co-immunizing with HepB. OK, well what are they basing it on? If that statement is being made, I'd like to know on what grounds, and further to that, if there IS a real concern, that is rather easily dispensed with by not immunizing at the same time (HepB is a multi-course vaccine anyway).

BTW if you want to talk about sample size or length of tracking of subjects, then look into HRT which has become the devil incarnate, and on the basis of an incredibly piss poor study.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:47 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally posted by Liesje


How so? I was my adult height and weight, physically and reproductively mature, and could have started taking birth control (hormones) just like adult women.
\

I am not an M. D. so I cannot answer directly to this, but I do know that the effect of disease or drugs, is processed differently in children than in adults.
For instance breast cancer in younger people tends to be much more aggresive and deadly than in someone older, because their cells are dividing more rapidly and they are changing faster than they would be if they were old.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:53 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally posted by BorderGirl
\

I am not an M. D. so I cannot answer directly to this, but I do know that the effect of disease or drugs, is processed differently in children than in adults.
For instance breast cancer in younger people tends to be much more aggresive and deadly than in someone older, because their cells are dividing more rapidly and they are changing faster than they would be if they were old.
But my point was that I was fully developed physically and reproductively/sexually so I would consider myself an "adult" as far as medications. For example, I take the same doses of OTC meds now as I did then. I take the same birth control pills now that my friend did when we were 13 (I didn't take it then, wish I had!!). Mentally and emotionally I was not an adult, but a vaccine doesn't really have anything to do with one's emotional state.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:55 PM   #101
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Originally posted by BorderGirl
\
For instance breast cancer in younger people tends to be much more aggresive and deadly than in someone older, because their cells are dividing more rapidly and they are changing faster than they would be if they were old.
I don't believe you can establish causation that easily and in fact I think that it has never been definitively established.

Logically speaking, younger women are not getting screened as often, so their tumors are on average found in later stages. That alone negatively affects their prognosis and could explain why the survival rates are lower.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:57 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally posted by anitram


That's just a completely bombastic statement right there.

They say they don't know the effects of co-immunizing with HepB. OK, well what are they basing it on? If that statement is being made, I'd like to know on what grounds, and further to that, if there IS a real concern, that is rather easily dispensed with by not immunizing at the same time (HepB is a multi-course vaccine anyway).

BTW if you want to talk about sample size or length of tracking of subjects, then look into HRT which has become the devil incarnate, and on the basis of an incredibly piss poor study.
You know if adult women want to make adult decisions that's cool, but to impose this by law onto the parents of girls in the sixth grade is just overstepping civil liberties.
There should be more test studies of this age group first.
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Old 02-17-2007, 10:59 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally posted by BorderGirl
You know if adult women want to make adult decisions that's cool, but to impose this by law onto the parents of girls in the sixth grade is just overstepping civil liberties.
There should be more test studies of this age group first.
Which is it? Civil liberties or science?
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Old 02-17-2007, 11:04 PM   #104
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Originally posted by martha


Which is it? Civil liberties or science?
Science, then choice, I hope.
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Old 02-17-2007, 11:05 PM   #105
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Do you have a choice about other required childhood vaccinations?
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