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Old 10-09-2006, 02:38 AM   #16
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Am I the only person with apocalyptic visions here?

Japan can quit easily get nuclear weapons considering the size of their (our, whatever) nuclear civil programme.

But obviously, that ain't going to make China very happy.
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Old 10-09-2006, 03:04 AM   #17
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There is no reason for there to be nuclear war, the magnitude of potential damage may have increased but at the same time the ambiguity is lost and war is still in nobodies interest.
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Old 10-09-2006, 03:33 AM   #18
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Japan doesn't need nukes as a counterweight. All those US submarines in the area aren't carrying rocks. There's no need for war, and there won't be war. The issues are that NK will no doubt use it as an elephant of a bargaining/blackmailing tool, and that NK might (probably will - Iran) try and export the technology or the weapons.

You do know that what North Korea have tested today is still a long, long way (perhaps years) away from being something they can transfer via missile, and their recent missile tests show they can barely get the missiles to where they want them to go anyway. Today has raised the stakes a shitload, but anyone thinking we're on the verge of some kind of catastrophe here is over-reacting.

Problems are:
a) How do you get North Korea to get rid of them - without giving into any kind of blackmail. Iran is watching.
b) How do you make sure they don't pass them on.
c) Keeping other countries - S.Korea & Japan - from pissing their pants and doing something stupid.

& the reality is that there'll be pressure in South Korea, Japan and the US for their respective leaders to do something strong and swift. South Korea and Japan are understandable and I'm willing to bet everyone here $100 that when I get home from work in an hour so, I'll be able to switch on Fox News and watch a bunch of people jumping out of their seats hysterically telling me that the world is going to end any moment now, and these are the people the Bush Admin will want to satisfy in the coming weeks before the election. That shit kinda worries me, but I'm sure this isn't going to suddenly turn into something major. No need for it to, and to be honest, no side wants it to. It's not what North Korea are doing this for.
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Old 10-09-2006, 08:58 AM   #19
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Originally posted by Earnie Shavers
... and these are the people the Bush Admin will want to satisfy in the coming weeks before the election. That shit kinda worries me, but I'm sure this isn't going to suddenly turn into something major. No need for it to, and to be honest, no side wants it to. It's not what North Korea are doing this for.
Besides, the Bush Admin only goes after nonexistent weapons of mass destruction
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Old 10-09-2006, 10:23 AM   #20
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Much ado about nothing here. North Korea is taking, yes granted, an extreme measure of posturing. The power base in that country is desperate to maintain its power and using every deterrent possible. So they will have some sanctions placed upon an already failing state.

Besides, India pulled this same crap a while back and recently were embraced by Bush into the nuclear club despite causing an arms race between Pakistan and India. And so long as other countries of the world continue to attempt to develop new weapons such as mini-nukes and missile defence programs, countries like North Korea are going to want more weapons too. Totally reasonable to me.

China doesn't want anyone to rock the boat so to speak. Economically, China doesn't want this aggravation so they will smack North Korea's hand for this action.

Although, one could argue that the geopolitical world is a tinderbox right now just waiting for a spark.
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Old 10-09-2006, 11:38 AM   #21
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If the UN do nothing they are no better than the League of Nations.

Now where do China stand ? they seemed closer to N Korea than anyone else.

What do japan do ? Is Japan in any danger ?

Will North Korea try and seize the south ?

Should America worry ?

Im British , am i in danger ?
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Old 10-09-2006, 11:50 AM   #22
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I believe China took a firm stance against this just before the testing.
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Old 10-09-2006, 01:50 PM   #23
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so ... almost 5 years after the chest-thumping "Axis of Evil" speech, NoKo has nukes, Iran is well on its way, and Iraq is now in the midst of a Civil War.

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Old 10-09-2006, 01:54 PM   #24
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Originally posted by Irvine511
so ... almost 5 years after the chest-thumping "Axis of Evil" speech, NoKo has nukes, Iran is well on its way, and Iraq is now in the midst of a Civil War.

Its a wonderful world .......


So the 2nd cold war begins ?
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Old 10-09-2006, 01:55 PM   #25
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Originally posted by Irvine511
so ... almost 5 years after the chest-thumping "Axis of Evil" speech, NoKo has nukes, Iran is well on its way, and Iraq is now in the midst of a Civil War.

North Korea has had nuclear weapons since 1994, Iran started its program to get nuclear weapons back in the 1980s, a country the size of Iraq can't be considered to be in a Civil War when the sectarian violence is only occuring in two or three of the 18 provinces and the government is still fully intact.
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Old 10-09-2006, 01:55 PM   #26
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It's the end of the world as we know it. ohhhhhhhhh yeah it's the end of the world.

when the time comes let's throw a BBQ.
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Old 10-09-2006, 02:15 PM   #27
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Originally posted by STING2


North Korea has had nuclear weapons since 1994, Iran started its program to get nuclear weapons back in the 1980s, a country the size of Iraq can't be considered to be in a Civil War when the sectarian violence is only occuring in two or three of the 18 provinces and the government is still fully intact.



oh STING, even Colin Powell thinks Iraq is in the midst of a Civil War.


[q]Our second goal is to prevent regimes that sponsor terror from threatening America or our friends and allies with weapons of mass destruction. Some of these regimes have been pretty quiet since September the 11th. But we know their true nature. North Korea is a regime arming with missiles and weapons of mass destruction, while starving its citizens.

Iran aggressively pursues these weapons and exports terror, while an unelected few repress the Iranian people's hope for freedom.

Iraq continues to flaunt its hostility toward America and to support terror. The Iraqi regime has plotted to develop anthrax, and nerve gas, and nuclear weapons for over a decade. This is a regime that has already used poison gas to murder thousands of its own citizens -- leaving the bodies of mothers huddled over their dead children. This is a regime that agreed to international inspections -- then kicked out the inspectors. This is a regime that has something to hide from the civilized world.

States like these, and their terrorist allies, constitute an axis of evil, arming to threaten the peace of the world. By seeking weapons of mass destruction, these regimes pose a grave and growing danger. They could provide these arms to terrorists, giving them the means to match their hatred. They could attack our allies or attempt to blackmail the United States. In any of these cases, the price of indifference would be catastrophic.

We will work closely with our coalition to deny terrorists and their state sponsors the materials, technology, and expertise to make and deliver weapons of mass destruction. We will develop and deploy effective missile defenses to protect America and our allies from sudden attack. (Applause.) And all nations should know: America will do what is necessary to ensure our nation's security.

We'll be deliberate, yet time is not on our side. I will not wait on events, while dangers gather. I will not stand by, as peril draws closer and closer. The United States of America will not permit the world's most dangerous regimes to threaten us with the world's most destructive weapons. (Applause.)[/q]
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Old 10-09-2006, 03:08 PM   #28
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North Korea is worrisome, although I have skepticism as to whether or not we should get involved at this point. If South Korea isn't asking for our help, then all we should do is keep our ears open until they do.
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Old 10-09-2006, 03:34 PM   #29
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Question: I was just reading CNN.com and they listed the countries w/ nuclear weapons and the quantity that they posessed. For instance, CNN listed France as having 350 nuclear weapons.

What does that mean exactly? Does that mean 350 atomic bombs similar in strength to what the US dropped in Hiroshima and Nagasaki or something much smaller?
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Old 10-09-2006, 05:27 PM   #30
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Originally posted by Numb1075
Question: I was just reading CNN.com and they listed the countries w/ nuclear weapons and the quantity that they posessed. For instance, CNN listed France as having 350 nuclear weapons.

What does that mean exactly? Does that mean 350 atomic bombs similar in strength to what the US dropped in Hiroshima and Nagasaki or something much smaller?
No, what the United States dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki was about 15 Kilotons in strength, most French nuclear weapons would be about 250 Kilotons in strength.
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