Religious? Spiritual? God? Athiest? WHY? - Page 3 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 09-23-2005, 05:38 PM   #31
Refugee
 
bcrt2000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,271
Local Time: 10:27 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Sparkysgrrrl
agnostic

I rarely associate U2 with being "religious". There is an atheist in the band after all.
And I do like what the lyrics bring to the table, it has always seemed to me to be done in a 'searching' kind of way, not 'I know what it is, this is the truth' etc which would just make me want to throttle them.

And if nothing else, they got me through vacation bible school when I was a kid
I could recite all kinds of bible verses thanks to them
well... bono recites verses from the bible from time to time (see Boston DVD, Bad -> Streets), and talks about god, asks for god's help, praises god (last night on earth mexico popmart intro, still haven't found what i'm looking for, all because of you, wake up dead man, if god would send his angels, yahweh, Miracle Drug (God I need your help tonight!), One Step Closer (for Bono's father to know if there is a higher being), Until the End of the World (story of Jesus & Judas))

theres also other songs that indirectly are about god/spirituality... Beautiful Day comes to mind (singing the praises of creation), Kite (perhaps about meeting again in the afterlife?), Staring at the Sun (again talking about things similar to BD, he mentions God directly in one verse, but the song is not directly about God), although that is much more up to interpretation than the initial set of songs that i named

if anyone listened to the Elevation Rehearsals, if i'm not mistaken, they had a pastor/priest bless the tour.
__________________

__________________
bcrt2000 is offline  
Old 09-23-2005, 06:59 PM   #32
Rock n' Roll Doggie
FOB
 
Carmelu2fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: LOST
Posts: 8,295
Local Time: 09:27 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by blueeyedgirl


Fuck, he didn't, did he? Another atheist lost to us all.
Yes Adam is a believer now.Bono must have wore him down
__________________

__________________
Carmelu2fan is offline  
Old 09-23-2005, 07:32 PM   #33
The Fly
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Irving, Texas, USA, Earth, Universe, in the mind of God
Posts: 33
Local Time: 02:27 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Carmelu2fan


Yes Adam is a believer now.Bono must have wore him down
Hmmm.. don't know how to feel about this.
It never bothered me that Adam was agnostic(?), because it was obvious that he respected the beliefs of his mates.

Is this such a terrible thing to atheists out there though??

What a short memory I do have though, for there was a time in my life, not more than 8 years ago that I would have had blue eyed girl's reaction. I was not entirely atheist (in that "atheism" is in deed a belief system and so a "religion" of sorts) but more of a "Screw it all!- I don't wanna even think of a God because I don't feel Him and I'm as mad as hell" sort of an agnostic.
... I was not a happy camper.

as the man in shades and funny big shoes sings:

"Take this heart
Take this heart
Take this heart
And make it break"
__________________
trash con is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 02:21 AM   #34
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
For Honor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: East Coast, USA
Posts: 5,278
Local Time: 09:27 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by trash con
Curious...
Was anyone here a fan of the TV show, "Joan of Arcadia"??
I was a huge fan and I was so heartbroken when it was cancelled (Europe is getting it first run right now).

I love the way God was portrayed. And its weekly lessons and themes were very deep.
It was produced by Barbara Hall, a very talented and spiritual woman (and a practicing Catholic, as I) and I gained great respect for her talent, spirituality and sense of humor.

Anyone? anyone??
Does the term, "Little Girl God" mean anything to anyone out there?
(btw, each week they used wwwwwwwonderful music to add to the plot's theme, and of course, U2's "Sometimes You Cant Make It On Your Own" was used.)

Joan... was an interesting show

My stepmother, a devout Catholic, loved it dearly.

I can respect it. Sometimes it was ..... sort of...... typical, in my own vision of it. Sometimes it was frustrating - almost in a way that the main character was frustrated by how god came to her. But for me, it was more.... "well, (to the main character), shouldn't you expect things to go that way by now?"

Anyway, i don't mean to be negative about it.


It was, though, one of the few shows that I felt promoted a lot of good advice and values, and had some awesome secular things going for it, about truth, and moving on, etc.

I would have liked it to have kept going myself.
__________________
For Honor is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 02:28 AM   #35
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
For Honor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: East Coast, USA
Posts: 5,278
Local Time: 09:27 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by trash con


What a short memory I do have though, for there was a time in my life, not more than 8 years ago that I would have had blue eyed girl's reaction. I was not entirely atheist (in that "atheism" is in deed a belief system and so a "religion" of sorts) but more of a "Screw it all!- I don't wanna even think of a God because I don't feel Him and I'm as mad as hell" sort of an agnostic.
... I was not a happy camper.

as the man in shades and funny

This made me think


about myself, all be it a conceited thought.


I really..... don't have any malice towards god.
I don't know what I think about him, but at the same time... well, like I said before, spirituality is something I don't know how to describe, for myself, and it's always interesting when it comes up in conversation.


I respect god, but.... I don't neccesarily "believe" in a religion, or am a Christian, etc.




tangent -


one thing I always was disturbed by was the creation, and perhaps over production of "good and evil". I mean, I recently saw a Johnny Depp film "From Hell", about Jack the Ripper.

ANd to see a religion so twisted and such, it's kind of sickening. THings like that really make me think that mankind uses religion as an excuse sometimes. Almost like a pojection.

Sometimes it's like...... refusing to take responsiblity for your actions. Something evil doesn't manipulate you... it's your own mind/heart.

I go back to one of my most favorite movies - "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon"...

"The real evil resides within the human heart"

I agree....
__________________
For Honor is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 02:39 AM   #36
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
For Honor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: East Coast, USA
Posts: 5,278
Local Time: 09:27 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by U2DMfan


I remember a talk with my dad when I was 12 or 13, I was a Christian in the literal sense, beleived the whole religious line of thinking and he asked me if I truly thought that a billion Chinese folks were going to burn in hell for only following traditions of their parents, the same thing we do in Western countries. It's just a silly idea.


smashingly excellent point.


That was one thing that really, really got to me, when I was first thinking about my definition of my spirituatlity. Oddly enough, I've become a big fan of Oriental culture, but perhaps that is really an unrelated thing.


But your point there, that is what turned my off from Christiatnity at first.... What if, say, Jesus was "born" in the heart of Japan? Or Vietnam?


And really.......
if that were the case
should there be a difference at all?

I don't think so
__________________
For Honor is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 02:47 AM   #37
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
For Honor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: East Coast, USA
Posts: 5,278
Local Time: 09:27 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Carmelu2fan
This is a great thread Hal!! For Honor you words are just a inspiring as U2 lyrics
Wow, that is flattering :blush:

you are too kind! ( but thankyou, just the same )


And yes, really good thread, Halucination
__________________
For Honor is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 02:49 AM   #38
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
For Honor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: East Coast, USA
Posts: 5,278
Local Time: 09:27 AM
Re: Re: Re: Religious? Spiritual? God? Athiest? WHY?

Quote:
Originally posted by Bono'sTyee
Oh wow I love this topic! Haha...let's see...(sorry if the quotes turned out wrong)

I believe in God.
I pray often, not really in front of other people because I'm shy but I do sometimes.



Interesting...I never thought of God that way...



I'd read that if you posted it.



Same here.




Great minds think alike.




Aw...



Hehe..

.............

I guess for me I'm still trying to figure everything out. I've tried different religions/denominations and I have my own take on things. Like Bono said (however I may say this wrong) religion gets in the way of God. I don't think it really matters what you denomination or whatever you are as long as you love God and have a relationship with him. But that's just me....

Interesting....


and to "I'd read that if you posted it."


well, I'll let you know if I ever do write it all out. I've been thinking about if for a time.... But I would never know what to address it as. It would be complex yet simple, I think. Eh, I better not say anymore, because then I'll feel odd about not doing it!

__________________
For Honor is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 08:00 AM   #39
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
BonosSaint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,566
Local Time: 10:27 AM
Oh, this topic. I try to stay away from it and I'm always drawn back into it. I find it such a frustrating, troubling and fascinating issue. There is always the desire to believe our lives are more than we have experienced them to be. There is that tenacious human desire for the hope that faith can provide.

Sometimes I am intrigued by people who live their faith, not by the rules (that's easy, sort of. It doesn't take a whole lot of thought--it's laid out there for you), but by the spirit. I rarely pay attention when one preaches, because I don't believe it if I cannot see it in some one's day to day life. So if I don't see someone's day to day or I see constant interpersonal behavior that gives lies to their words, I don't pay much attention. "By their fruits, you will know them..." and all that. I think the words lack credibility when your moral authority does. I make an exception in listening in forums like this as there is no way I am ever going to know posters' day to day lives. So I deliberately suspend disbelief.

I have yet to find a church in which I am comfortable. Personally, I don't believe in rituals or public displays of faith or worship (except music, a lot of strong religious music is kickass--as opposed to some of the tepid Christian rock. I like the traditional stuff) I'm a little uncomfortable with the "Peace be with you." thing, although I am sure it is something nice for a lot of people. I know when I say the words, they are empty and I expect it is the same for at least a couple of other people. I grew up in a church where I was great friends with a couple of the ministers.
I always found it ironic that I could discuss faith and doubt and anger and disbelief with ministers better than the congregation as a whole. Maybe it is not so ironic. (PS, in all honesty, I'm not much of a belonger, so you could probably find me the perfect church and I wouldn't stay long)

I do not know what drives people to churches. I know for some, it is a comfort to feel everything has an answer. On a whole, "ologies"don't like questions; they like answers. Sometimes I facetiously (and not so facetiously) think of starting a church that understood the ying-yangof doubt and faith, anger and joy, acceptance and betrayel. I would probably call it the Church of St. Judas. I guess it would have a limited membership. I have given the easy answers. I don't believe in them anymore. Easy answers get you off scotfree. You have no more responsibility than to let those glib words slide off your tongue. I would demand more of myself and of my mythical congregation.

I do not know what impels some humans to truly act beyond their own interests. I have not yet determined that that "what" is God, but I believe it is faith of some kind.
__________________
BonosSaint is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 07:45 PM   #40
War Child
 
najeena's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: an island paradise
Posts: 995
Local Time: 02:27 PM
I am a daughter of science, so to speak, so I don't consider myself religious. I have respect for all those who do, even the nice Mormons who come to our house in the woods to convert me. Though I sometimes wish for the comfort that such a belief would bring, there's something in me that could never believe in the supernatural. I find miracles enough just looking at all that surrounds us.
__________________
najeena is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 09:00 PM   #41
The Fly
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Irving, Texas, USA, Earth, Universe, in the mind of God
Posts: 33
Local Time: 02:27 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by BonosSaint

I do not know what drives people to churches. I know for some, it is a comfort to feel everything has an answer. On a whole, "ologies"don't like questions; they like answers. Sometimes I facetiously (and not so facetiously) think of starting a church that understood the ying-yangof doubt and faith, anger and joy, acceptance and betrayel. I would probably call it the Church of St. Judas. I do not know what impels some humans to truly act beyond their own interests. I have not yet determined that that "what" is God, but I believe it is faith of some kind.


Arrrgggggh!
Sometimes... sometimes I wish I could make people feel what I feel... Know what I know. See the world and life as I have seen it, as I have lived it, as I have gone through hell (my own hell) and have come back...

I wish I could somehow magically instantly share in the joy, peace, acceptance, wonder, mystery (and yes, frustration), hope... HOPE and faith of my belief... Of my assurance in God, in Jesus Christ... In life having some meaning.... THE meaning.

BUT... I can't, and perhaps I SHOULDN'T because perhaps what I am wishing for is something of ego and pride. Something that makes ME feel better (in that, if YOU feel just as I do, then I am more confident in my beliefs and I am validated).

We all have to live our lives, experience our experiences, stumble and fall, and hopefully get up again, and find answers, if answers are in fact what you choose to find.

I wouldn't make a good Mormon or Jehovah's Witness is think.

("Preach the Gospel at all times,... when necessary, use words."
- St. Francis of Assisi. I love that quote, yet I can't seem to give in to it)

Okay... It has been said that a Good Church should raise MORe questions than have answers.
So, I don't totally agree with your accessment on "ologies" only having answers.
One of the "truthes" of Catholicism, as all other faiths I assume, is that there are in fact Mysteries that we cannot answer or should we... and we have to believe and accept... on faith.
(faith... a dirty word???)

What drives people to church?... most times, its the " I have to go or I will burn in hell" reason. It used to be for me.
It isnt any longer.

DOH!... I have to go! I'm having dinner with a friend (my ex, no less)... and she will KILL me if I am late... again (But she won't...cos she's a good Catholic!

More on this later... plus more on my Joan of Arcadia!

Peace.
__________________
trash con is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 09:56 PM   #42
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
For Honor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: East Coast, USA
Posts: 5,278
Local Time: 09:27 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by BonosSaint
I'm a little uncomfortable with the "Peace be with you." thing, although I am sure it is something nice for a lot of people. I know when I say the words, they are empty and I expect it is the same for at least a couple of other people.
Interesting..... that is, actually.....
the one thing I can say sincerely when I go to church. Mostly, because I think me saying "peace be with you" is kind of a secular thing, though in a church few things are secular, but, what I mean is... it seemed more genuine than most other things I did or said in a church. More real. More sincere. But that's just me.




Quote:
Originally posted by BonosSaint
[B]
I do not know what drives people to churches. I know for some, it is a comfort to feel everything has an answer. On a whole, "ologies"don't like questions; they like answers. Sometimes I facetiously (and not so facetiously) think of starting a church that understood the ying-yangof doubt and faith, anger and joy, acceptance and betrayel. I would probably call it the Church of St. Judas. I guess it would have a limited membership. I have given the easy answers. I don't believe in them anymore. Easy answers get you off scotfree. You have no more responsibility than to let those glib words slide off your tongue. I would demand more of myself and of my mythical congregation.
I believe I know what you mean... at least a little bit.
Responsibility is a major thing that I contemplate, and I don't like easy answers myself...........


Quote:
Originally posted by BonosSaint

I do not know what impels some humans to truly act beyond their own interests. I have not yet determined that that "what" is God, but I believe it is faith of some kind.
I was thinking about that the other day......


I do things that are genuinely "nice", so to say.... but I try to figure out what my pay off is. I know, my stepmother.... she likes to do nice things for peoplle, but it's sort of a guilt trip for her, at least sometimes. Sometimes she comes home from work and feels like she has to make a cake or do something for her coworkers, and it just strikes me sometimes. She is too nice for her own good, and needs to be looked out for... but she's getting better.

However, there are times when she is secularly, indifferently, and wholesomely doing something just to be nice to someone. Some people like to make other people happy, so I guess there is a personal benefit in getting a positive reaction out of someone.



To take your statement further......
I wonder... why people do strive for peace, pleasant/calm states of mind...?
Realistically, is it just because it is a more plesant emotional feeling? Like how sleep is restful when you grow weary?


The more I see things now, the more I just see, like electronics, two charges - positve and negative. It's all energy, but really, it's just divided between positive and negative.... Too much sleep , too much peace causes idleness and still generates unhappiness. Too much war, action, violence, causes inner strife, and has one craving for peace.


I suppose...... this is why I feel people are too shallow sometimes. not to be arrogant, but, there must be others who see things this way, right? Or at least, a little?
I only ask... slightly out of fear, because I don't react to things the way most people do, and that makes me wonder a lot...


Anyhow...
anyhow...


I will always be on the side of "peace" or "good" or whatever. Just because that is the more productive of the two - culture, science can develop during peace time. Prosperity, develpoment. I think peace may allow us to evolve, or become something greater than ourselves.


Than just....................... "human" in the simplistic, minute form.

But we are still fighting each other, so I guess it might take a long, long time.

If I were to write a philosophy, or religion our or something, I would promote that the most. But at the same time.... you can't deny the reality around you. Or more so, you can't deny reality...
__________________
For Honor is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 10:00 PM   #43
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
For Honor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: East Coast, USA
Posts: 5,278
Local Time: 09:27 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by trash con




Arrrgggggh!
Sometimes... sometimes I wish I could make people feel what I feel... Know what I know. See the world and life as I have seen it, as I have lived it, as I have gone through hell (my own hell) and have come back...

I wish I could somehow magically instantly share in the joy, peace, acceptance, wonder, mystery (and yes, frustration), hope... HOPE and faith of my belief... Of my assurance in God, in Jesus Christ... In life having some meaning.... THE meaning.

BUT... I can't, and perhaps I SHOULDN'T because perhaps what I am wishing for is something of ego and pride. Something that makes ME feel better (in that, if YOU feel just as I do, then I am more confident in my beliefs and I am validated).

We all have to live our lives, experience our experiences, stumble and fall, and hopefully get up again, and find answers, if answers are in fact what you choose to find.


I know where you are coming from. I especially like how you ended it.


But in regards to the beginning.....
What if someone could feel that same feeling you do, the same joy and peace, etc...... but with something other than Jesus?
__________________
For Honor is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 11:09 PM   #44
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
BonosSaint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,566
Local Time: 10:27 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by trash con


Okay... It has been said that a Good Church should raise MORe questions than have answers.
So, I don't totally agree with your accessment on "ologies" only having answers.
One of the "truthes" of Catholicism, as all other faiths I assume, is that there are in fact Mysteries that we cannot answer or should we... and we have to believe and accept... on faith.
(faith... a dirty word?

Peace.

Oh, I didn't say "ologies" only have answers, just that they like answers better than questions. I wasn't raised Catholic, so I don't know about the Mysteries. I'm assuming transubstantiation is included in that. If I'm correct on how you are defining the Mysteries, I never had many questions or much interest in the supernatural (in the broadest definition) aspect of religion. However, your paragraph is kind of making my point. The question is stifled. You just have to have faith and if you have doubts about it, that's your problem. That is one of the "ology" answers I mean.
__________________
BonosSaint is offline  
Old 09-24-2005, 11:28 PM   #45
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
BonosSaint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,566
Local Time: 10:27 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by For Honor


Responsibility is a major thing that I contemplate, and I don't like easy answers myself...........


I was thinking about that the other day......


I do things that are genuinely "nice", so to say.... but I try to figure out what my pay off is. I know, my stepmother.... she likes to do nice things for peoplle, but it's sort of a guilt trip for her, at least sometimes. Sometimes she comes home from work and feels like she has to make a cake or do something for her coworkers, and it just strikes me sometimes. She is too nice for her own good, and needs to be looked out for... but she's getting better.

However, there are times when she is secularly, indifferently, and wholesomely doing something just to be nice to someone. Some people like to make other people happy, so I guess there is a personal benefit in getting a positive reaction out of someone.



To take your statement further......
I wonder... why people do strive for peace, pleasant/calm states of mind...?
Realistically, is it just because it is a more plesant emotional feeling? Like how sleep is restful when you grow weary?

(Okay, that's an interesting point. People act beyond their self interest because it really is in their self-interest. Actually, that's a great point. The selfishness of unselfishness. That makes sense to me.)

If I were to write a philosophy, or religion our or something, I would promote that the most. But at the same time.... you can't deny the reality around you. Or more so, you can't deny reality...

Okay, that's an interesting point. People act beyond their self interest because it really is in their self-interest. Actually, that's a great point. The selfishness of unselfishness. That makes sense to me.
__________________

__________________
BonosSaint is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:27 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com