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Old 09-21-2005, 04:33 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by trevster2k
I don't like watching people pray to god for material things like winning prizes, or games, if there is a god, I don't think he/she cares about who wins the Super Bowl. There is a place for religion in our world as it provides strength, hope, love, comfort, a sense of belonging and guidance for many during difficult times in life.

"hell yeah"


I can't stand it when people pray for small things, or winning prizes, like you say. SOmetimes I don't even like it when you pray for large things.... But as far as sports go, especially professional sports, where people earn salries, etc, I am against praying.

My favorite team has a prayer, but I like it, because it asks for an equal playing field, rather than "god's help to win":

Dear Lord in the battles as we go through life;
We ask for a field that's fair.
As chance that's equal to all in the strife;
The courage to do it or dare.
If we should win, let it be by the code;
With our faith and honor held high.
If we should lose, let us stand by the rules;
And cheer as the winners go by.
Day by day we get better and better;
A team that can't be beat, won't be beat.



Anyhow...

I've been around people who ask god to bless everything, so, perhaps I'm a little more biased about such things.
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Old 09-21-2005, 04:34 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonosSaint
Nice post, For Honor.
Thank you
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Old 09-21-2005, 04:58 PM   #18
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Because from where I stand, someone can preach all they want, but faith isn't somthing you can preach into someone. I don't even believ that you can simply decide to have faith. You either have it or you don't and neither is right or wrong. I'm conent without it. There is no void in my life which many people who have found faith claim they had before they found their faith; only they didn't realise it.
I agree with that statement completely.

I grew up in the Bible Belt, so religion/church played a big part in my life. I was brought up in the Catholic Church until my parents got divorced when I was five. My dad didn't go to church (he was raised Methodist, I think), but when I was eight, he remarried and we started going to a Wesleyan Church. For a while (when I was about 12) we looked at different churches (including a charasmatic, speaking in tongues churches), but my family ended up going back to the Wesleyan while I went to a Southern Baptist church. At thirteen, I looked at Catholicism again and studied a lot and seriously thought about being a nun. The more I read, though, the more issues I had with certain things. When I was 14, I started going to a non-denominational Christian Church, and then when I was 15, I started going to a very strict, VERY conservative Reformed Baptist Church (where I was baptized). My senior year of high school, I decided I wasn't a Calvinist after all, so I became a Free Will Baptist. My third and final year of (baptist) college, I became Episcopalian. Now I don't really consider myself anything. I've studied a lot of different religions and denomination and tons of theology, philosophy, and church history. I used to always feel like I was missing something and really worry a lot about it (hence the switching of denominations so many times!), and never could find any religion I truly believed (though I was good at pretending). I would get really upset that I just couldn't believe no matter how hard I tried (I remember get so upset I would cry about it when I was as young as four). Now I'm agnostic, leaning towards atheist, and I'm much more content than I was when I was trying to find something to believe in. I'm not anti-religion; it's just not for me.
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Old 09-21-2005, 05:51 PM   #19
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Monotheistic/Christian. A belief in divinity and eternity gives me a sense of purpose and direction.
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Old 09-21-2005, 05:57 PM   #20
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No matter what I input into Beliefnet, I always end up with "Liberal to Mainline Protestantism." So I guess that's my closest match to what I am, with Unitarian Universalism a close second.

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Old 09-22-2005, 03:10 AM   #21
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I was some sort of Buddhism, I think. I don't remember if it was the more traditional, or the more modern, liberal kind........


anyhow


One thing I do believe in is Love. I know that is real, at least in my world, in my life. I don't associate love with god, or vice versa. But love is real to me, and I say that with the utmost certainty....
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Old 09-22-2005, 12:33 PM   #22
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Curious...
Was anyone here a fan of the TV show, "Joan of Arcadia"??
I was a huge fan and I was so heartbroken when it was cancelled (Europe is getting it first run right now).

I love the way God was portrayed. And its weekly lessons and themes were very deep.
It was produced by Barbara Hall, a very talented and spiritual woman (and a practicing Catholic, as I) and I gained great respect for her talent, spirituality and sense of humor.

Anyone? anyone??
Does the term, "Little Girl God" mean anything to anyone out there?
(btw, each week they used wwwwwwwonderful music to add to the plot's theme, and of course, U2's "Sometimes You Cant Make It On Your Own" was used.)
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Old 09-22-2005, 03:43 PM   #23
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don't have a lot of time to write, though I feel like there's a lot to say on such an interesting topic, so I'll try to stick to answering Hallu's questions.

Am I spiritual? Sure. I guess I don't have a good definition of what makes someone "spiritual". I believe everyone has a spiritual part of their self, which is separate from the physical, so I guess that means I consider everyone to be spiritual.

Do I believe in God? Yes. I believe there is one entity who is the source of everything.

Do I have faith in any type of religion? I'd say no. My faith is in that entity who is the source of everything, not in religion.
On a side note related to this one, I think it's funny how Bono claims to not be into organized religion (or maybe he doesn't claim that and people have just put those words in his mouth), because I think it's a pile of malarky. What is "organized religion" but organizing people of similar beliefs toward a common goal? (i'm sincerely asking. that's just the definition that popped out of my head right now). If that's what it is, Bono is DEEP in organized religion. He's always trying to get Christians to act like Christ and care for the poor.
And I applaud him for it. That religious fanatic.

Do religious (spiritual?) takes in u2's songs make me more of a fan? Yeah. Probably.

Why do I have faith? I think Hallu nailed it in the initial post. I decided quite a while back that I really need God. I guess even before that I believed there was a God, but I wouldn't call that faith.
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Old 09-22-2005, 04:16 PM   #24
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Wow. I feel kinda dumb because I had forgotten that I posted this thread. Awsome to see everyone put so much thought into the responses. Thanks. Especially those of you who took the time to answer each one of my questions literally. I didn't expect that. Thanks.

To answer your question trash con, I'm 27. I appreacite the way you said I could probably add the word "yet" to my comments about not having faith. Better yet you didn't imply which faith I am "yet" to find. It's better to hear that than have someone say it's obvious you are missing somthing in your life and here's what it is. I have no problem with the fact that I may find some faith in something, someday. I just don't like it when people say I need it and they know the answer.

I used to have a friend who was a really good freind. We were basically best friends, inseperateable. One day he went to Mexico on a mission trip with his parents who were extremely religious. He wasn't religious at the time. He was also single I might add. When he got back a month later he was now an over the top devoted Christian and believe it or not engage to a girl he had only just met on the mission. 3 Months later he was married and I was not involved in the wedding in any way shape or form other than a guest. Guys I had never met stood up for him. It's now been 6 years since the Mission trip he went on and we no longer speak unless we happen to run into each other by fluke. Obviously people grow apart but for whatever reason we grew apart almost instantly for no other reason than he became a Christian and I was basically instantly not an appropriate person to hang out with. I tried to remain freinds but it would always come down to him and his family overly promoting ther beliefs on me to the point where I realised they felt me to be a lesser person because of my differing beliefs. How screwed up is that? It's the hypocrisy like that which runs so deep in organized religions. I mean if finding faith and living a life of God means to disconnect with true friends who were freinds by choice not by association than I would want no part of it. I actually ran into his Mother in the grocery store the other day. No word of a lie the conversation went like this

Hallucination: He Sheryl how are you?
Sheryl: Hi Hallucination, I haven't seen you in ages
Hallucination: Yeah I know.
Sheryl: So how are you? You married yet?
Hallucination: *laughs* Married? No not yet.
Sheryl: Any potential for marriage?
Hallucination: Nope
Sheryl: Oh that's o.k., you just need to pray to God and you'll find her soon. Pray to God and things will get better.

What? Was she serious. I promptley ended that conversation and went about my grocery shopping. Not even 30 seconds inot it and it had become a preach fest for her to say my life isn't complete without God and even a wife. Unreal

I think that's what makes it so hard for people to have faith in "God". It's the outright hypocrisy and judgment and the looking down on others by many of those who claim to be otherwise. I mean Church is supposed to be a place of acceptance not judgment. I went with a friend(different friend) of mine to Church once. He had asked me in a good way if I'd like to come and check it out. I thought sure, I'll go. It was a spur of the moment thing(evening mass) and I was dressed in jeans and a Guns N' Roses shirt. Not a vulger one or anything but just an old one with the bullet logo on it. I had so many nasty looks and one old lady said it was a disgrace that I wore it. Well thanks everyone I'll be sure to show up on Sunday....or NOT!

For myself persoanlly I think I lean towards there being somthing out there bigger than us. What it is I'm not sure. I'm not sure I buy into the whole "The Bible says" attitude, yet I know there are alot of good messages to be taken from the Bible. trevster2k mentioned he doesn't belive in God yet he's spiritual. He then added that it doesn't make sense. I think it does. I mean watching wildlife and being one with nature seems pretty spiritual to me. Walking the beach at sunset or cross country sking through the bush in winter or simply stopping to listen to the sounds or smell the air and really appreaciating things like that can be spiritual can't they?
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Old 09-22-2005, 06:26 PM   #25
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I am a conflicted person by nature. At least it helps me write songs. Maybe that it it's purpose. Difficult, big questions.

I'd like to know how people strengthen their faith short of an obvious miracle happening to them, or witnessing one.

I have prayed about things and felt better, but am I placating my ego? Some would say yes, I used to not think so with conviction.

Organized religion is a scam, IMO those who participate are not willing participants to the scam, I don't think in most cases I just have to think some of them are blind followers and others must haev been touched by something deeper.

I have faith, it's just not as strong as I would like or as it used to be. Too many massive holes. I firmly beleive in God, a higher power etc. I beleive that Jesus was real, but I struggle with the idea that billions who are only raised to beleive a certain way will not meet the "kingdom": because of how their parents taught them. It's this sort of disconnection that is troubling.

If I had blind faith I'd probably be a better person. At least that's what my guilty conscience leads me to believe.

I remember a talk with my dad when I was 12 or 13, I was a Christian in the literal sense, beleived the whole religious line of thinking and he asked me if I truly thought that a billion Chinese folks were going to burn in hell for only following traditions of their parents, the same thing we do in Western countries. It's just a silly idea.

I beleive religion is a crutch, but faith is not. Faith to me is important. The problem with me is I was raised half-fundamental Christian (mother), half-agnostic (father) and in my journey as a human being, after 30 years I still have many more unanswered questions that form faith.

Absolutely spiritual, just a skeptic of all that is the coroporation of religion, all faiths. Faith in something bigger than yourself might be a defensive psychological reaction or it might be something very real. How do you know the real difference without just blindly believing what has been taught for centuries?

I'd love advice from anyone. Quoting scriptures at this point is not a great help. Part of my problems lies in the nature of the way that book was written. I don't believe that it is infallable. It may have been at one time, long ago, but not anymore.
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Old 09-22-2005, 06:35 PM   #26
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Re: Re: Religious? Spiritual? God? Athiest? WHY?

Oh wow I love this topic! Haha...let's see...(sorry if the quotes turned out wrong)

I believe in God.
I pray often, not really in front of other people because I'm shy but I do sometimes.

Quote:
Originally posted by For Honor


Perhaps to me, God is a more extended consciousness. Or conscience, extended conscience.
Interesting...I never thought of God that way...

Quote:
Originally posted by For Honor
personally, I'd say I have my own relgion/philosophy. I'm thinking about writing it all out some day......
[/B]
I'd read that if you posted it.

Quote:
Originally posted by For Honor
Generally speaking, Bono + U2 make me respect Christianity, etc, a lot more.
[/B]
Same here.


Quote:
Originally posted by For Honor
Moving on, U2 has captivated my not by their religion, but by how those 4 people use their religion. The sincerity behind it. It's not fabricated. And of course, Bono's humility

I must be
An acrobat
To talk like this
And act like that


That song made me really respect U2/Bono a lot more. Because that is something I can certainly relate to, and helped me understand their music a lot more.
[/B]
Great minds think alike.


Quote:
Originally posted by For Honor
I think all religions and non religious people can get along, just as long as they are respectful and keep an open mind. I get along withe people from all religions, and walks of life.
[/B]
Aw...

Quote:
Originally posted by For Honor
"Hey god - you created this world, not me."
[/B]
Hehe..

.............

I guess for me I'm still trying to figure everything out. I've tried different religions/denominations and I have my own take on things. Like Bono said (however I may say this wrong) religion gets in the way of God. I don't think it really matters what you denomination or whatever you are as long as you love God and have a relationship with him. But that's just me....
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Old 09-22-2005, 06:39 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sparkysgrrrl
[B]
I rarely associate U2 with being "religious". There is an atheist in the band after all.
Hey I heard Adam converted...it's in the revised version of Walk On (the book) isn't it?
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Old 09-23-2005, 04:30 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bono'sTyee


Hey I heard Adam converted...it's in the revised version of Walk On (the book) isn't it?
Dear lord, then I am out of the loop aren't I lol
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Old 09-23-2005, 09:18 AM   #29
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Originally posted by Bono'sTyee


Hey I heard Adam converted...it's in the revised version of Walk On (the book) isn't it?
Fuck, he didn't, did he? Another atheist lost to us all.
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Old 09-23-2005, 05:07 PM   #30
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This is a great thread Hal!! For Honor you words are just a inspiring as U2 lyrics I can honestly say what has drawn me to U2 mostly (besides the fact that there music is awesome!) I totally agree with there religious and political veiws. I grew up as a Christian and I studied many different religions in collage and I do believe that there is a higher power. All religions believe that.I feel that there is a creator of the sun, earth, people , animals,etc. I veiw religion as a way to keep us as humans moral and consciences. To tell a man "if you cheat and steal you will go to hell" would be a way to inforce morals on a society. However , I do believe that we were created in the image of GOD (an intelligent ,yet very emotional being)not evovled* from simple minded primates.
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