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Old 11-03-2004, 03:25 PM   #46
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Paul said alot against homosexuality. Do you believe in what Paul wrote?

Just curious.
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:25 PM   #47
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^Damn straight, practice your religion the way you want but dont force the rest of the people too, its unwarranted interferece - you need less government in your life.
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:29 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadelynIris
Paul said alot against homosexuality. Do you believe in what Paul wrote?

Just curious.

as a secular humanist who admires the basic jesus message, i really don't care what Paul has to say.
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:30 PM   #49
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Re: Religious Fanatics and those who oppose them running our country PLEASE POST HERE

Quote:
Originally posted by tackleberry
Taking the advice of one of the moderators who closed a few threads and told us to create a new one, I have created....a new one.

(a) there's no denying that religion played a huge role in this election. More than any other I can think of. There's also no denying that religion has played a huge role in the war against terrorism and the war in Iraq

(b) Bush attracted voters because of this, and MOST of them are from the south. Now without calling them "hicks" (which they may be...or maybe not) regardless, they are basing their votes on religious values, ones that Bush has used time and time again to run this country and to implement his policies.

(c) I think this is wrong. Because it violates separation of church and state. This is essential to a democracy. A religion based country is NOT a democracy, but rather a theocracy. I fear this country's shift to the extreme right is falling into this category.

(d) that being said, I think these religious values and morals contradict the way this country is being run, and will unfortunately be run in the next 4 years. I ask you this in your deepest of hearts: would God or Jesus "ban" gays from marriage, would God or Jesus start a war, Would God or Jesus have the highest death penalty numbers of any state (Texas). Hmmmm....

a) Is there a problem voting for a candidate that believes alot of the same stuff you believe? Religion playing a role on the war on terrorism? Iraq? IMO these fanatics attacked us;....paybacks are hell!

b) Most of Bush's supporters are in the South. They were everywhere except the Northeast, West Coast, and parts of the UP. Hicks? They? You sure do generalize about people

c) Correct me if I am wrong. But Seperation of Church and State gets taken way out of context. I believe its intent was to say the Government can't tell you how to worship. Stop worrying about the extreme right. Our country has always balanced out....that is why it is so great. We are a melting pot!

d) I am not going to touch the God or Jesus one....gay marriage does not really concern me....death penalty I can see both sides of the argument....God or Jesus starting a war? Don't think they would but I bet they would go into a country and free opressed people.

Anyway next time you are in the South stop on by and we can drink some moonshine, pick a banjo, shovel some cow shit, slop the pigs, and waive a confederate flag around.........oh the sarcasm
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:32 PM   #50
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Re: Re: Religious Fanatics and those who oppose them running our country PLEASE POST HERE

[QUOTE]Originally posted by nbcrusader

2. Most voters base their decision on their own moral compass. In essence, you are saying this is wrong if they use the Bible for their own moral compass.



Actually, I am saying it is wrong for people to just use the bible for a moral compass. Southern slave owners used the bible all the time to justify owning slaves....

I guess those who let their moral compass be their guide will have their Bibles and their guns to keep them warm when they lose their jobs.

We have this quaint thing in this country....it's the separation of church and state. Religion should not dictate policy in this country. I am sickened by this election.
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:32 PM   #51
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President Bush received the exact same percentage of gay votes — 23 percent — as he did four years ago. This despite the president's vocal support for a federal constitutional amendment banning gay marraige.
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:32 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadelynIris
Paul said alot against homosexuality. Do you believe in what Paul wrote?

Just curious.
Paul said "God doesn't want man to allow homosexuals to marry?"
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:37 PM   #53
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Originally posted by A_Wanderer
President Bush received the exact same percentage of gay votes — 23 percent — as he did four years ago. This despite the president's vocal support for a federal constitutional amendment banning gay marraige.
i was shocked at that too, though i had thought it was down slightly, but not by as much as one would have thought. many of them obviously thought the war or the economy was pre-eminent. many gay men are wealthy, and were maybe bought off by four more years of tax cuts. there are also a lot of self-haters out there. but for evangelicals, "moral values" trumped the war. it wasn't about the war on terror for the Bush base. it was about the war on gay unions.

irony.
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:41 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally posted by MadelynIris
Paul said alot against homosexuality. Do you believe in what Paul wrote?

Just curious.
I don't want Shia law.

I want secular laws.


I have a lot of personal beliefs that you would not want imposed on you as laws.
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:42 PM   #55
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Re: Re: Religious Fanatics and those who oppose them running our country PLEASE POST HERE

Quote:
Originally posted by cseggleton



a) Is there a problem voting for a candidate that believes alot of the same stuff you believe? Religion playing a role on the war on terrorism? Iraq? IMO these fanatics attacked us;....paybacks are hell!

b) Most of Bush's supporters are in the South. They were everywhere except the Northeast, West Coast, and parts of the UP. Hicks? They? You sure do generalize about people

c) Correct me if I am wrong. But Seperation of Church and State gets taken way out of context. I believe its intent was to say the Government can't tell you how to worship. Stop worrying about the extreme right. Our country has always balanced out....that is why it is so great. We are a melting pot!


Anyway next time you are in the South stop on by and we can drink some moonshine, pick a banjo, shovel some cow shit, slop the pigs, and waive a confederate flag around.........oh the sarcasm

As a history teacher, I will correct you b/c you are mistaken. The separation of Church and State does not only mean the government cannot tell you how to worship, and by the way, it does with the "under God" bit in the pledge. It also applies to the government not creating legislation involving any sort of relgious matter. In addition, by trying to create an ammendment that would define what marriage is, W is stepping on states rights as well as the separation of church and state.
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:43 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep


I don't want Shia law.

I want secular laws.


I have a lot of personal beliefs that you would not want imposed on you as laws.
Very well said. I applaud.
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Old 11-03-2004, 03:59 PM   #57
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I'll be kind and bite my tongue on this issue, otherwise I'd piss people off like never before.
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Old 11-03-2004, 04:01 PM   #58
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Your grace is to be applauded, I too shall abstain from going into my profound dislike of the evangelical conservative christian movement (I can like individuals but the principles and actions of the group I find wrong).
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Old 11-03-2004, 04:01 PM   #59
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Quote:
I have a lot of personal beliefs that you would not want imposed on you as laws.
Of course not. This is resistance to a NEW LAW - that is to change the definition of marraige to include others than man/woman.

Are we not allowed to resist new laws?

As far as the Paul thing goes - I hear ya.

But how do you form your beliefs.. do you take the 'red text' out of one of the gospels and go from there? You know some else besides Jesus had to fill in the gaps. More of a narrative, ya know.

That would be kind of hard to figure out - unless you just sort of paraphrase/generalize it yourself.

Mark
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Old 11-03-2004, 04:09 PM   #60
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Re: Re: Re: Religious Fanatics and those who oppose them running our country PLEASE POST HERE

Quote:
Originally posted by WildHoneyAlways



As a history teacher, I will correct you b/c you are mistaken. The separation of Church and State does not only mean the government cannot tell you how to worship, and by the way, it does with the "under God" bit in the pledge. It also applies to the government not creating legislation involving any sort of relgious matter. In addition, by trying to create an ammendment that would define what marriage is, W is stepping on states rights as well as the separation of church and state.
Exactly.

Perhaps the 'under God' bit has to change in the pledge? So many Americans aren't religious, nor do they all abide by the same religious codes. Is it fair to have people pledge to a God they don't believe in?

Most of the big issues in this election dealt with religion--something the state should be removed from. Pass the laws and allow people to choose whether or not to use those services (marriage, etc for homosexuals) based on their own moral code.
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