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Old 09-24-2004, 10:04 AM   #91
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Then, it would be a balancing case. For all things labeled "bad" there may be situations where it is "good".
So how can you then label it as bad? From what you just said.. it would be neutral, and therefore up to personal preference.

Perhaps your personal preference is that pornography is bad for yourself, inwhich case you've become the perfect example of what I stated earlier... If you dont like something, avoid it.
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:18 AM   #92
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I guess my point is that with the topic of Pornography: good or bad, the fact that the individual can choose to use or not use pornography doesn't fully answer the question. I say it is bad because it has consequences for the non-viewer.
are those consequences more or less so than the regulated, lawful presence of guns, whether they are for show, hunting, concealed, of an assault variety, etc?

point being that society is wrought with vices enjoyed by many that, as a byproduct, negatively impact on other individuals. when i first responded to this thread my question, and i don't think i've seen it answered yet, is why pornography, in your opinion, is worse than the rest of these vices? is it the 'sanctity' of sex? are you advocating some sort of prohibition?
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:28 AM   #93
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Let' discuss the issue - please don't try to stick the matter on me.

Just because you think there may be good consequences doesn't mean that it should therefore be labeled "good" or "neutral". My argument is that in the vast majority of instances, the viewing of pornography has a negative impact, at some level, on relationships.

Think of all the times pornography is viewed, and how dew the times


I've heard too many cases where a guy is viewing pornography
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:28 AM   #94
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Maybe some people view it as "bad" in the sense that IDEALLY sex should be about more than what it is about in porn. Yes of course some people view it as simply being about pleasure and gratification, but other people see it as being about far more than that.

I think maybe it would be more helpful for people w/ whatever issues they have that cause them to become addicted to porn/or have it adversely affect relationships to see a therapist about those - if they can't afford that, a clinical social worker or other sort of counselor. I think that would have far better consequences for others or non-viewers than porn could have.
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:40 AM   #95
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Originally posted by nbcrusader
Let' discuss the issue - please don't try to stick the matter on me.

Just because you think there may be good consequences doesn't mean that it should therefore be labeled "good" or "neutral". My argument is that in the vast majority of instances, the viewing of pornography has a negative impact, at some level, on relationships.

Think of all the times pornography is viewed, and how dew the times


I've heard too many cases where a guy is viewing pornography
NB,

I was hardly sticking it to you... the fact is that you stated your opinion that porn is 'bad'.

You talk about "vast majority of instances, the viewing of pornography has a negative impact"... you've got some numbers on this somewhere? as well... do you have any numbers on the couples that watch it together?

I know as many women that enjoy some form of pornography as men.
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:41 AM   #96
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point being that society is wrought with vices enjoyed by many that, as a byproduct, negatively impact on other individuals. when i first responded to this thread my question, and i don't think i've seen it answered yet, is why pornography, in your opinion, is worse than the rest of these vices? is it the 'sanctity' of sex? are you advocating some sort of prohibition?

I would say a comprehensive approach to "vices" would be the subject of a different thread. This thread was to focus on pornography. I've never suggested that porngraphy is the "worst" of all vices.

Rather, I believe we grossly underestimate the impact of pornography.
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:46 AM   #97
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Rather, I believe we grossly underestimate the impact of pornography.

I think 'we' grossly underestimate the impact of ignorance and lack of taking responsibility for one's self.
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:47 AM   #98
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I would say a comprehensive approach to "vices" would be the subject of a different thread. This thread was to focus on pornography. I've never suggested that porngraphy is the "worst" of all vices.

Rather, I believe we grossly underestimate the impact of pornography.
thanks. i didn't intend to stick it to you. i merely was sincerely interested in your response. though i can now see a lot were seemingly chasing you.
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:50 AM   #99
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You talk about "vast majority of instances, the viewing of pornography has a negative impact"... you've got some numbers on this somewhere? as well... do you have any numbers on the couples that watch it together?

I know as many women that enjoy some form of pornography as men.
Since no studies have been cited, our examples are either anecdotal or based on a reasonable thinking through of the issue.


Now, in your reasonable estimation, how often is pornography viewed openly by an individual in a relationship, with knowledge of the other person?

Pornography exploded because it can be done in secret behind our computers.
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:51 AM   #100
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I think 'we' grossly underestimate the impact of ignorance and lack of taking responsibility for one's self.
Absolutely.
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:56 AM   #101
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


Since no studies have been cited, our examples are either anecdotal or based on a reasonable thinking through of the issue.


Now, in your reasonable estimation, how often is pornography viewed openly by an individual in a relationship, with knowledge of the other person?

Pornography exploded because it can be done in secret behind our computers.
a) Reasonable thinking.... that's hardly factual, and could very well be biased.

b) Often.

c) If you think porn only exploded in the last 10 yrs because of computers.... you've obviously never looked around your local video store, book store, or magazine rack. Porn has also been availible descretely via mail order for... MANY years... for those wanting to obtain it in 'secret'.
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Old 09-24-2004, 10:59 AM   #102
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Now, in your reasonable estimation, how often is pornography viewed openly by an individual in a relationship, with knowledge of the other person?

Probably very often. If I had to choose one, I'd rather my fiance view porn than cheat on me with someone else. Although I know it can be argued that watching porn regularly is just as bad as cheating, I'd really rather it not be a flesh-and-blood human being actually, in-person getting him off. I would venture that many, many people shrug off their significant others' porn habits if they are otherwise well-behaved in the relationship.
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Old 09-24-2004, 11:00 AM   #103
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a) Reasonable thinking.... that's hardly factual, and could very well be biased.
As is anecdotal evidence.

Quote:
Originally posted by Elvis
c) If you think porn only exploded in the last 10 yrs because of computers.... you've obviously never looked around your local video store, book store, or magazine rack. Porn has also been availible descretely via mail order for... MANY years... for those wanting to obtain it in 'secret'.

I know it has been available for decades, if not centuries.

The delivery systems is now fast and descrete.
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Old 09-24-2004, 11:07 AM   #104
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I know it has been available for decades, if not centuries.

The delivery systems is now fast and descrete.

and so is the news, u2 information, etc.

the accessiblity doesnt cause people to seek out the 'information'... or porn. People choose to seek it out.
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Old 09-24-2004, 11:28 AM   #105
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I agree with both nb and Elvis. Elvis is right - if you don't like it, don't do it. but nb is right too, but even if YOU don't like it and don't do it, that doesn't mean a parent won't or your boyfriend won't. This is why I hate porn. Like all other vices (and I don't see porn as being worse of a vice than any other), it leads to dishonesty, distrust, denial, etc. I know Elvis wants numbers and I don't have any, but what I DO know is that I've seen porn destroy WAY more relationships that it has enriched. Elvis, I think you got a point here "I think 'we' grossly underestimate the impact of ignorance and lack of taking responsibility for one's self.", but I think you really must include "lack of taking responsibility for oneself and everyone else in close relationships with that person."
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