Poll: Is George W. Bush becoming unpopular???????????? - Page 6 - U2 Feedback

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Old 03-04-2003, 03:16 PM   #76
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slick.
nice edit.
db9

reminds me of the selective process of the liberal news reprting methods..
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Old 03-04-2003, 03:18 PM   #77
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Quote:
Originally posted by Danospano
Adding to the discussion of how history treats political leaders: If historians explore both sides of the story, we must assume that you (Zooropa) said this because the average person will not explore the details from both perspectives. Right?

This being said I think that while intellectuals may delve deeper into the knowledge tree, the average American or whoever will read the mass-marketed textbooks that reflect a rosey painting of all its leaders from the past. How often do we hear about the scandals and crimes of Andrew Jackson, Andrew Johnson, Lyndon Johnson, Nixon, etc. We may know bits of their unglorious past, but if you look at what the high schools are teaching there is an absence of dirt.

I think Bushie will be remembered as the guy who was president when the two tower fell and the guy who furter postponed important decisions dealing with the environment, the stocks and exchange regulation, and the issue of world poverty.

His legacy will be honored by some idiots, but his record is his true legacy. What has he done for America? What has he done for the rest of human civilization?

Can anyone name 5 major decisions this administration has made that has propelled our democratic freedoms? Our civil liberties? Our pursute of life and liberty?

Oh, and by the way....I'm still Anti-Bush....
The average person doesn't always have the time to look at both sides, and many instances, they don't want to/need to etc.

It is also difficult to separate the political actions of a historical figure from his personal actions. Some don't care to.

I think it's hard to judge Bush completely because his administration is only 3 years old. His impact on America may be profound, or negligable. Here is why the "time" arguement is valuable. As for your specific questions, if he is succesful, the world will be safer, Democracy will come to the Middle East, Schools will become more efficient, same with healthcare.
On the flip side, are environment may not benefit, the Middle East may become more unstable etc. But these are things that we will only see down the road.

Something on Civil Liberties...
Life, Liberty and the pursute of happiness.
Notice that LIFE, comes first. If the government has to invade our privacy to protect our lives, I'll take the hit. W/O life, there is no liberty, or happiness.
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Old 03-04-2003, 03:25 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zooropa
Something on Civil Liberties...
Life, Liberty and the pursute of happiness.
Notice that LIFE, comes first. If the government has to invade our privacy to protect our lives, I'll take the hit. W/O life, there is no liberty, or happiness.
Note that it says "AND." In logic, the word "AND" says that all elements must be together, otherwise the entire statement is false.

Without liberty and/or happiness, there is no "life."

Melon
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Old 03-04-2003, 03:34 PM   #79
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wink

Quote:
Originally posted by melon


Note that it says "AND." In logic, the word "AND" says that all elements must be together, otherwise the entire statement is false.

Without liberty and/or happiness, there is no "life."

Melon
You can have life w/o liberty and happiness.
w/o life, you can't have liberty and/or happiness because you're, err, mmm, dead....
If you want to define life in a qualitative way, that's different, but I don't believe that that is how the word life is used in "Life, liberty and the persuit of happiness."

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Old 03-04-2003, 03:42 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zooropa


You can have life w/o liberty and happiness.
w/o life, you can't have liberty and/or happiness because you're, err, mmm, dead....
If you want to define life in a qualitative way, that's different, but I don't believe that that is how the word life is used in "Life, liberty and the persuit of happiness."

Considering the secular Enlightenment philosophy of the Founding Fathers and some of their comments, especially Benjamin Franklin ("Those who would sacrifice Liberty for security are deserving of neither") and their cynical view of government, I tend to think that I'm right on this.

Melon
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Old 03-04-2003, 03:43 PM   #81
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hey theres too much of this - here!
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Old 03-04-2003, 03:48 PM   #82
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Well... Bush sure isn't becomin unpopular around here

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Old 03-04-2003, 03:50 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally posted by melon


Considering the secular Enlightenment philosophy of the Founding Fathers and some of their comments, especially Benjamin Franklin ("Those who would sacrifice Liberty for security are deserving of neither") and their cynical view of government, I tend to think that I'm right on this.

Melon
Classic Liberal Theory believes that the government should only exists to protect it's citizens. There is a contract between the government and it's people. Upon agreeing to this contract, the individual is aware that he will sacrifice a small amount of his liberty in order for the government to protect him/her.

I tend to think I'm right on this...
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Old 03-04-2003, 04:40 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally posted by Klaus
verte76: well if you go back in time you allways get the "winners history" - so i don't think it's biased.
Why not take the informations you can get (not only the ones you like) and make up your own mind?

Klaus

I do have an opinion. It's no secret that Bush is even pissing off allies. The Arabs are against a war in Iraq. The press has been quoting Rumsfeld as claiming that the Arabs want a war in Iraq. Huh? The news about the Arab opinion came out of reliable sources reporting on a summit held by Arabic powers to handle the Iraq crisis. Like I said before, I am anti-Bush. I don't like his arrogance, and I don't like this pro-war stuff of his. Rumsfeld is a . I'm just saying that in the future some stuff may come out that we don't know about right now. Maybe some aide will write memoirs of the Bush White House in ten years and spill some previously untouched beans. That doesn't erase the fact that Bush is pissing off allies right and left. I work in a library and people are still writing books about the Reagan administration. The more time goes on, the more complete the knowledge is about any and all public figures.
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Old 03-04-2003, 09:38 PM   #85
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Sidenote: I love that people are begining to call Dubya and Rumsfeld 's and mother- 's and pieces-of-dog- . It's about time!!!!!!!!

Oh yeah....and here's a for diamond
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Old 03-04-2003, 10:04 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally posted by Danospano
Sidenote: I love that people are begining to call Dubya and Rumsfeld 's and mother- 's and pieces-of-dog- . It's about time!!!!!!!!

That seems unnecessary.
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Old 03-04-2003, 10:14 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zooropa


Classic Liberal Theory believes that the government should only exists to protect it's citizens. There is a contract between the government and it's people. Upon agreeing to this contract, the individual is aware that he will sacrifice a small amount of his liberty in order for the government to protect him/her.

I tend to think I'm right on this...
I don't think what Bush is doing is sacrificing a "small amount" of liberty. The Patriot Act of 2001 authorizes domestic espionage and secret trials. I don't think that is what classical liberals envisioned, particularly since they revolted against imperial kingdoms that did both.

Melon
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Old 03-04-2003, 10:18 PM   #88
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bush is a cool cat under pressure.
as true artists and true leaders do..
he
will
not
sell
out.

thank u
diamond
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Old 03-04-2003, 10:21 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally posted by verte76



I do have an opinion. It's no secret that Bush is even pissing off allies. The Arabs are against a war in Iraq. The press has been quoting Rumsfeld as claiming that the Arabs want a war in Iraq. Huh? The news about the Arab opinion came out of reliable sources reporting on a summit held by Arabic powers to handle the Iraq crisis.
I just want to jump in here. Arab governements in public have not always stated publicly what they are saying privately.

This may or may not be different than any governement, but it is particularly true, for them, that they make public statements to appease their populations, and then say another thing in private.

Peace
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Old 03-04-2003, 11:18 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond
he
will
not
sell
out.
he already did 18 months ago.
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