Police shoot 'dead' a suspect, London... - Page 7 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 07-26-2005, 02:21 PM   #91
Babyface
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 9
Local Time: 01:08 AM
I can't put into words how this incident enraged me. FEAR.....people really need to try to handle their fear and not let it lead to mistakes such as this. It happens all the time. A man whose house had been previously broken into, came home one night to find the door unlocked. Opened the door, saw a figure, shot the person dead. It happened to be his son who had a key to the house and was home doing laundry.

I also don't get what exactly muslim looks like. 99% of Muslims aren't visibly identifiable any more than Christians are. I was in a cab the other day talking about this London police bullshit incident and the cabby said he'd be wary of sitting beside someone with a backpack and even more so if that person was a Muslim. WTF???????????? and how would one know if that person was a Muslim or not? Some people think it's as simply cut and dried as that. Fear and ignorance........a winning combination.


Belle Chanson
__________________

__________________
Belle Chanson is offline  
Old 07-26-2005, 02:22 PM   #92
Blue Crack Addict
 
DaveC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: illegitimi non carborundum
Posts: 17,390
Local Time: 08:08 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by trevster2k
Put yourself in this man's shoes before you suggest it was stupid to run.
It's stupid to run from armed police officers under any circumstances. Period.
__________________

__________________
DaveC is online now  
Old 07-26-2005, 04:13 PM   #93
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
trevster2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 4,330
Local Time: 09:38 PM
Someone brought up an interesting point to me. If he was a suspected suicide bomber armed with a bomb hidden under his coat ( which we don't know anything about other than the phrase "bulky jacket" ) under surveillance, why did they wait so long to move in on him if he was such a threat to the public? Why not jump on him the moment he entered the street as opposed to when he was near a subway station? Something doesn't make sense here.

Dave, lots of people run from armed police in countries where the police are barbaric and incidents of police brutality are commonplace. He was from Brazil, ever see City of God, it's only a movie based on true events but their police have a history of brutality. This individuals past life experiences caused him to run, it is easy to say don't run when you are a white male sitting comfortably at your keyboard. Protesters run from armed police at every confrontation including revellers at parades and celebrations, almost every single one does not have bullets being shot at them. But if you support the right of police to shoot at citizens without legitmate reason, and I don't regard suspicion to be legitimate, that's your right. Hopefully, you will never experience such a event.
__________________
trevster2k is offline  
Old 07-26-2005, 06:54 PM   #94
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 11:08 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by trevster2k
Early reports from the inquiry say he was shot 8 times, once in the shoulder and 7 (SEVEN!!!) times in the head. This seems kind of excessive to me.
Once the decision was made to take him down, it was done. 8 shots pretty much guarantees that the threat (if it was a trigger and not a trigger release bomb) will be removed. They should half-incapacitate if the threat is present. The call was made, that is where the error was, what they did and how they dealt with that threat (which we now know was not there, but that goes back to the call itself) seems a reasonable last resort.

They did not just walk up a suspicious individual and put 7 bullets in his skull.
__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 07-26-2005, 07:04 PM   #95
New Yorker
 
sallycinnamon78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 2,977
Local Time: 02:08 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Axver


Great post. A group of twenty undercover police don't just come running after people with guns drawn - I would expect that they would have first tried to speak to him peacefully, identifying themselves sufficiently so that he knew they were law officers rather than random thugs, and I also imagine they wouldn't have pointed a gun at him until after he made a break.

The way some people are making it sound, you'd think twenty cops just randomly descended upon some poor innocent bloke with guns firing. I have a hard time believing that's the case - I would expect and hope that the police gave this man every chance to go peacefully, but he chose to ran.


I would hope so too, but I'm not counting on it. I wasn't there, nor were you, nor was Dave, so you don't know that this was the case anymore than I do. Like you I am putting forward a possibility. That much is apparent.

Nonetheless, you're both much more likely to be right than I am here, logically speaking. It would make a lot more sense if the way you describe events was the way it happened. It's certainly more rational.

Quote:
It's a shame an investigation will probably take forever, as I'd like to know what really happened before we all jump to conclusions and hang the officers.
I'm not too fond of hanging anyone metaphorically or literally...! I stand by my point that there may be myriad reasons for his legging it.

Quote:
Originally posted by Angela Harlem
Or condone the police action as if we were there.
Quite.

Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Once the decision was made to take him down, it was done. 8 shots pretty much guarantees that the threat (if it was a trigger and not a trigger release bomb) will be removed. They should half-incapacitate if the threat is present. The call was made, that is where the error was, what they did and how they dealt with that threat (which we now know was not there, but that goes back to the call itself) seems a reasonable last resort.

They did not just walk up a suspicious individual and put 7 bullets in his skull.
What happened to waiting until we have the full story?
__________________
sallycinnamon78 is offline  
Old 07-26-2005, 07:16 PM   #96
New Yorker
 
sallycinnamon78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 2,977
Local Time: 02:08 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by DaveC


It's stupid to run from armed police officers under any circumstances. Period.
Thanks for that, Sherlock - that IS obvious common sense.Have you considered that people do some odd, and frequently stupid, things when they panic? How easy is it for us to sit here and protest his actions? Were you there? Do you have any clue whatsoever as to what was going through this bloke's head when he reacted like that?

NO. Nor do I, or anyone else here. So, as I said in pretty much every post I've added to this thread - alongside almost evryone else saying the same - let's wait until we know what is going on before hedging our bets.
__________________
sallycinnamon78 is offline  
Old 07-26-2005, 07:22 PM   #97
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 11:08 AM
Quote:
What happened to waiting until we have the full story?
I am still waiting for the inquiry, but in a situation where there is a bomber running into the underground and the decision has been made to incapacitate them I think that 7 bullets to the head is an effective way to do that.
__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 07-26-2005, 07:31 PM   #98
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 40,651
Local Time: 07:08 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
I am still waiting for the inquiry, but in a situation where there is a bomber running into the underground and the decision has been made to incapacitate them I think that 7 bullets to the head is an effective way to do that.
Or just one...
__________________
BVS is offline  
Old 07-26-2005, 09:40 PM   #99
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 11:08 AM
One bullet to the head would kill the most of men, but seven guarantees it.

What guns did the police use and how many were fired?
__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 07-27-2005, 06:42 AM   #100
Refugee
 
dazzlingamy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: The city of blinding lights and amazing coffee - Melbourne.
Posts: 2,468
Local Time: 12:08 PM
PUHLEASE.

I hope everyone out there never has to go through what his family will now feel for the rest of their lives after this 'accident'

I'm not saying he was totally innocent, or totally guilty, i just think that shooting someone in the middle of a crowd in such a deadly and horredous way is abbhorent no matter WHAT they guy was.

But then im against the death penalty anyway, so dont think they should shoot to kill in any situation.

And so what if he was guilty, so what if he helped pack the bag of explosives, does that deserve a bullet (or 7) to the head. As someone reported he was being followed by 20 police officers, shoot him in the leg if you must and then jump on him....what a pussy way to get out of doing your job, *just in case he was armed*
__________________
dazzlingamy is offline  
Old 07-27-2005, 07:18 AM   #101
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
randhail's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Outside Providence
Posts: 3,557
Local Time: 08:08 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by dazzlingamy
PUHLEASE.
And so what if he was guilty, so what if he helped pack the bag of explosives, does that deserve a bullet (or 7) to the head. As someone reported he was being followed by 20 police officers, shoot him in the leg if you must and then jump on him....what a pussy way to get out of doing your job, *just in case he was armed*
So basically what your're saying even if a guy has a bomb strapped to his chest, the police shouldn't take him down? If you shoot him in the leg, he can still detonate the bomb. In a situation like that, killing the guy is the right way to go. Would you rather have 50 people die if the police didn't "take the pussy way out?"

Exactly how is shooting someone the pussy way out? Police are trained to use deadly force as a last resort. Do you think they enjoy killing people?
__________________
randhail is offline  
Old 07-27-2005, 08:01 AM   #102
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
Tilli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 6,500
Local Time: 01:08 AM
I beleive that the police have adopted a policy (called operation Kratos) recently for terror suspects based on the belief that anyone believed to be carrying explosives are shot in the head. Shooting them in the chest or legs may still allow them to detonate the bomb.
__________________
Tilli is offline  
Old 07-27-2005, 08:11 AM   #103
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
Tilli's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 6,500
Local Time: 01:08 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Belle Chanson
I was in a cab the other day talking about this London police bullshit incident and the cabby said he'd be wary of sitting beside someone with a backpack and even more so if that person was a Muslim. WTF???????????? and how would one know if that person was a Muslim or not? Some people think it's as simply cut and dried as that. Fear and ignorance........a winning combination.


Belle Chanson

It is a scary thought - but that is just what appears to happen when incidents like this happen. There have already been of attacks on Mosques and on Muslims since 7/7 and the attempted bombings last week. There was even some stupid letter in my local paper after 7/7 saying that the government must now do something about the illegal immigration problem now. EH??

People become fearful of anyone who is of a differnet race or ethnic background (which i also expect is part of what terrorists want). This reaction is nearly as frightening as the threat of bombings themselves.
__________________
Tilli is offline  
Old 07-27-2005, 02:06 PM   #104
New Yorker
 
sallycinnamon78's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 2,977
Local Time: 02:08 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by randhail


So basically what your're saying even if a guy has a bomb strapped to his chest, the police shouldn't take him down? If you shoot him in the leg, he can still detonate the bomb. In a situation like that, killing the guy is the right way to go. Would you rather have 50 people die if the police didn't "take the pussy way out?"

Exactly how is shooting someone the pussy way out? Police are trained to use deadly force as a last resort. Do you think they enjoy killing people?
That much I can't argue with at all. If the police know for certain, ie have evidence and no doubt, that someone is about to blow themselves sky high and take a segment of the population out with them, they have to bring the suspect down.
__________________
sallycinnamon78 is offline  
Old 07-27-2005, 09:56 PM   #105
Refugee
 
dazzlingamy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: The city of blinding lights and amazing coffee - Melbourne.
Posts: 2,468
Local Time: 12:08 PM
well for one they DIDNT know he had a bomb under his jacket, they just assumed.

Shooting someone because you THINK they are going to do something is a lot different then if you KNOW.

As its been said heaps of times already there are numurous reasons why he ran and sadly as its been shown, none of them had to do with the bombings.

If the SAW bombs strapped to him then of course, they need to defend themselves, but when its just a THOUGHT, death is final. What do you think his final thoughts were.

god everyone here is so heartless. Don't you even care that an innocent man (in that he was not connected with the bombers or have a bomb on him as well) was shot down and died. He was a young man, with a family. Does that not sit funny in your stomach?

You need to grow a head that can LOOK BOTH WAYS before making a decision!
__________________

__________________
dazzlingamy is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:08 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com