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Old 09-26-2006, 12:55 PM   #1
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Pius attacked for not confronting evil, Benedict attacked for confronting evil

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Pius attacked for not confronting evil, Benedict attacked for confronting evil
By Dennis Prager
Tuesday, September 26, 2006

http://www.townhall.com/columnists/D...nfronting_evil

...

But recently the critics have lost credibility. If the same people who attack Pope Pius XII for his silence regarding the greatest evil of his time are largely the same people who attack Pope Benedict XVI for confronting the greatest evil of his time, maybe it isn't a pope's confronting evil that concerns Pius's critics, but simply defaming the Church....
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Old 09-26-2006, 12:58 PM   #2
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No way. He was condemning "evil" but didn´t choose his words wisely and offended another religion. End of story.

He deserves all the outrage.
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Old 09-26-2006, 01:02 PM   #3
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Originally posted by BrownEyedBoy
No way. He was condemning "evil" but didn´t choose his words wisely and offended another religion. End of story.

He deserves all the outrage.
(Fill in the blank)

_________________ offends Muslims.
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Old 09-26-2006, 01:58 PM   #4
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Re: Pius attacked for not confronting evil, Benedict attacked for confronting evil

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Originally posted by Macfistowannabe


soooo ... "confronting Islam" is the same thing as confronting the Holocaust?



Benedict was talking about Islam, not about "Islamofacism" or whatever new word the Bush administration has focus-grouped to describe this shadowy enemy we need to give a face to in order to justify the wild expansion of executive power (evildoers? jihadists?).
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Old 09-26-2006, 02:10 PM   #5
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Benedict was quoting a fourteenth century manuscript, not giving his own opinion. He's a smart guy but gosh did he ever screw up.
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Old 09-26-2006, 05:09 PM   #6
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Ah, missed this one before replying to the other Pope thread.

Yep, he screwed up but at least he's trying to fix it...that in itself is huge progress for the Vatican.
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Old 09-26-2006, 06:02 PM   #7
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Originally posted by AliEnvy
Ah, missed this one before replying to the other Pope thread.

Yep, he screwed up but at least he's trying to fix it...that in itself is huge progress for the Vatican.
Yeah, it's not exactly the standard practice for the Vatican for the pope to admit he screwed up.
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Old 09-27-2006, 09:20 AM   #8
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Re: Re: Pius attacked for not confronting evil, Benedict attacked for confronting evil

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Originally posted by Irvine511
soooo ... "confronting Islam" is the same thing as confronting the Holocaust?



Benedict was talking about Islam, not about "Islamofacism" or whatever new word the Bush administration has focus-grouped to describe this shadowy enemy we need to give a face to in order to justify the wild expansion of executive power (evildoers? jihadists?).
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The pope could have chosen a better way to warn about Islamic violence in God's name than by citing a Byzantine emperor's sweeping indictment of Muhammad and Islam.
I agree, there was a better way to confront the horrors of Islamic Jihad than to knock the prophet of Islam. That's why he outraged most every devout Muslim.

In any event, the pope was directing his quotation of the Byzantine emperor towards those who live by the sword. The pope was informing you about the history of Islamic Jihad - conversion by the sword - even if he did sight a quote about the prophet Muhammad. Why is it relevant, you ask? Because it's become the biggest issue of our time.

But those who condemn the pope for speaking out against Islamic Jihad are being hypocritical because they are the same crowd that accuses Pope Pius of aiding and abetting the Nazi party, when in fact, he did the opposite - he saved a lot of European Jews from the horrors of the Holocaust.
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Old 09-27-2006, 09:36 AM   #9
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How do you think the Byzantine Empire (a.k.a., "East Roman Empire") expanded? Through multiparty democratic elections? He's just as guilty of "living by the sword" as the Muslims he condemned, and he was pissed off by the fact that he was less successful than the Ottomans who eventually relegated his empire to ancient history.

Manuel II Palaiologos and his descendants would have been bitter, because not only were the Ottomans easily eating away at their empire, but the West also had nothing but contempt for them. In fact, the only reason it's called the "Byzantine Empire" is because that's what an 18th century philosopher called it--deeming it unsuitable to be the "Roman Empire," the name that the empire called itself while it existed.

Trying to apply modern politics to 15th century Europe is really quite futile.

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Old 09-27-2006, 11:53 AM   #10
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Originally posted by melon
How do you think the Byzantine Empire (a.k.a., "East Roman Empire") expanded? Through multiparty democratic elections? He's just as guilty of "living by the sword" as the Muslims he condemned, and he was pissed off by the fact that he was less successful than the Ottomans who eventually relegated his empire to ancient history.
Good point, another reason to believe that the Pope could have made his point differently.

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Originally posted by melon
Trying to apply modern politics to 15th century Europe is really quite futile.
On this I disagree - many truths are eternal. I for one am a strong believer in the Socratic Method - ask the hard questions, tie the opponent in verbal knots, and baffle them with their own hypocrisy.

Thomas Jefferson believed this to be true as well. Don't mind me quoting this one again and again.

"Shake off all the fears of servile prejudices, under which weak minds are servilely crouched. Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call on her tribunal for every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear."

On the other hand, existentialism has also stood the test of time. We now call it postmodernism.
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Old 09-27-2006, 01:08 PM   #11
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Reason is overrated. So are "facts" that come from it. There are very few facts and alot of theory and grey areas.
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Old 09-27-2006, 01:18 PM   #12
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Originally posted by verte76
Reason is overrated. So are "facts" that come from it. There are very few facts and alot of theory and grey areas.
If I abandon my reasoning, I abandon the merits of my opinions.
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Old 09-27-2006, 01:27 PM   #13
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Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
If I abandon my reasoning, I abandon the merits of my opinions.
Then again if there was no reasoning or at least faulty reasoning to begin with, then not abandoning your opinion is just stubborness. Something we all need to be careful of...
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Old 09-27-2006, 01:42 PM   #14
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Then again if there was no reasoning or at least faulty reasoning to begin with, then not abandoning your opinion is just stubborness. Something we all need to be careful of...
Or - finding faulty reasoning on the other side is another way to question reasoning.

"The truth behind the lies" is unfathomable unless people are willing to use the Socratic Method and put aside their irrational fears.
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Old 09-27-2006, 01:47 PM   #15
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Yeah, you missed my point.
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