martha
Blue Crack Supplier
Ask more if you want!
------------------
She's a little lightheaded, so check on her in a few minutes -- my podiatrist, about me (again), 2-11-02
Other religions
- Thread starter AM
- Start date
The friendliest place on the web for anyone that follows U2.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
Ask more if you want!
------------------
She's a little lightheaded, so check on her in a few minutes -- my podiatrist, about me (again), 2-11-02
80sU2isBest
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2000
- Messages
- 4,970
Do satanists believe in the afterlife?
HeartlandGirl
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Actually, yes there is. There is a relatively new theory out, proposed by a physicist whose name starts with the letter G. Guth, maybe. Discover magazine did a cover story about it. Unfortunately, I left the magazine at my office and can't remember how to spell the man's name. Anyway, his theory is called the "inflation theory" and describes how the universe may have spontaneously created itself. He has already won an award that is often the pre-cursor to the Nobel.
If anyone has questions about it, I can answer them when I bring the magazine home.
And answering the original question of this thread, I consider myself "Catholic-Buddhist."
------------------
U2 @ The Blooming Heart
Anthony
Refugee
It still doesn't change it from being a theory, not actual irrefutable evidence. Its a theory that happens to fit the facts maybe, but most widely recognised theories do that anyway.
Ant.
80sU2isBest
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2000
- Messages
- 4,970
But that's a theory. There's always been the theory that God doesn't exist. There is no evidence anywhere that God doesn't exist. Such evidence cannot exist. It's like trying to prove that love does not exist. it can't be done.
OP
OP
AM
Refugee
Catholic-Buddhist? Can you tell me more about this? How do you combine those two quite different religions?
------------------
I'm a bass player. That's a "singer" question. Lord Adam Clayton
"The bass player's got it. The bass player's fucking got it." Bono, Boston 6-9-01
80sU2isBest
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2000
- Messages
- 4,970
Ravenstar,
I do not wish to "hijack" this thread. But I feel I must say something to you. I have something to tell you, and I'm not saying it out of anger, but out of concern for you. Please know that I am not attacking you in this post, only warning you of the truth about your religion, because I feel that if you continue down the road of satanism, you are headed for a fall. I prayed for you last night, as I always pray for those who do not know Christ. But my prayer last night was specifically for you; I prayed that you would see exactly where your master is leading you. Your master was defeated 2000 years ago, and ever since then, his work has been to take as many souls with him as he can. This satanistic religion of selfishness, greed, and sin may be what you think you want, but it's actually very destructive in this life and the life to come. You told me you don't believe in the afterlife; okay, let's look at the religion's effect on this world. How can having your own needs as #1 priority be any good for this life? That's where crime finds its roots. That's where hatred finds its roots. That's where sickening sin find its roots. I know the world isn't perfect, but I thank God for people who put others' needs before their own. If everyone was concerned with themselves first, a lot more people would have died on Sept.11. Thank God for those heros, and for present, past and future heros that put others as their number one priority instead of themselves.
In the final analysis, I DO believe in the afterlife, and my honest belief is that your master does too; he just doesn't want you to believe in it. Satan has already lost the war, and one day it will be final, and his eternal home will be one of torment and fire. And if he goes, be assured he will take his followers with him. My master, my friend, my Lord and my God (Jesus Christ)offers something that is exactly the opposite. He offers His love; He died on a cross and rose from the dead because of His love for you. He offers his Heaven as an eternal residence. It is a free gift; we can't earn it. Please accept His gift. You can still break away from the sadistic creature upon which your religion is based.
I do not wish to "hijack" this thread. But I feel I must say something to you. I have something to tell you, and I'm not saying it out of anger, but out of concern for you. Please know that I am not attacking you in this post, only warning you of the truth about your religion, because I feel that if you continue down the road of satanism, you are headed for a fall. I prayed for you last night, as I always pray for those who do not know Christ. But my prayer last night was specifically for you; I prayed that you would see exactly where your master is leading you. Your master was defeated 2000 years ago, and ever since then, his work has been to take as many souls with him as he can. This satanistic religion of selfishness, greed, and sin may be what you think you want, but it's actually very destructive in this life and the life to come. You told me you don't believe in the afterlife; okay, let's look at the religion's effect on this world. How can having your own needs as #1 priority be any good for this life? That's where crime finds its roots. That's where hatred finds its roots. That's where sickening sin find its roots. I know the world isn't perfect, but I thank God for people who put others' needs before their own. If everyone was concerned with themselves first, a lot more people would have died on Sept.11. Thank God for those heros, and for present, past and future heros that put others as their number one priority instead of themselves.
In the final analysis, I DO believe in the afterlife, and my honest belief is that your master does too; he just doesn't want you to believe in it. Satan has already lost the war, and one day it will be final, and his eternal home will be one of torment and fire. And if he goes, be assured he will take his followers with him. My master, my friend, my Lord and my God (Jesus Christ)offers something that is exactly the opposite. He offers His love; He died on a cross and rose from the dead because of His love for you. He offers his Heaven as an eternal residence. It is a free gift; we can't earn it. Please accept His gift. You can still break away from the sadistic creature upon which your religion is based.
speedracer
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
- Joined
- Feb 3, 2001
- Messages
- 7,604
HeartlandGirl, a couple of points, if you don't mind:
1. The physicist you're talking about is Alan Guth. He probably isn't going to win a Nobel for his theory of inflationary cosmology, though. He's a very nice man (I was an undergraduate at MIT, and I've met him personally).
2. Even inflationary cosmology or string theories, theories that propose that the universe could have created itself, don't answer the question of whether a God must have created the universe. They merely displace the question. If the universe created itself out of "quantum foam", how did the quantum foam come to exist? etc. It's similar to the refutation of the "design argument" for God's existence--if God designed everything in the universe, who designed the Designer? At this point, you must either say "the Designer was not designed by anybody" or give up on the argument.
1. The physicist you're talking about is Alan Guth. He probably isn't going to win a Nobel for his theory of inflationary cosmology, though. He's a very nice man (I was an undergraduate at MIT, and I've met him personally).
2. Even inflationary cosmology or string theories, theories that propose that the universe could have created itself, don't answer the question of whether a God must have created the universe. They merely displace the question. If the universe created itself out of "quantum foam", how did the quantum foam come to exist? etc. It's similar to the refutation of the "design argument" for God's existence--if God designed everything in the universe, who designed the Designer? At this point, you must either say "the Designer was not designed by anybody" or give up on the argument.
martha
Blue Crack Supplier
Compassionate, so the name works out to be Compassionate Father. His followers tend to call him Baba.
------------------
She's a little lightheaded, so check on her in a few minutes -- my podiatrist, about me (again), 2-11-02
OP
OP
AM
Refugee
does he claim to be a prophet send by God?
------------------
I'm a bass player. That's a "singer" question. Lord Adam Clayton
"The bass player's got it. The bass player's fucking got it." Bono, Boston 6-9-01
------------------
I'm a bass player. That's a "singer" question. Lord Adam Clayton
"The bass player's got it. The bass player's fucking got it." Bono, Boston 6-9-01
martha
Blue Crack Supplier
No, He is God.
------------------
She's a little lightheaded, so check on her in a few minutes -- my podiatrist, about me (again), 2-11-02
CannibalisticArtist
War Child
good display of self control RavenStar.
An honest inquiry...
Isn't Satanism little more than a more intricate atheism? Isn't it more of a rejection of the existence of God and Christian religion than it is about worshipping Satan?
Melon
------------------
"Still, I never understood the elevation of greed as a political credo. Why would anyone want to base a political programme on bottomless dissatisfaction and the impossibility of happiness? Perhaps that was its appeal: the promise of luxury that in fact promoted endless work." - Hanif Kureishi, Intimacy
Isn't Satanism little more than a more intricate atheism? Isn't it more of a rejection of the existence of God and Christian religion than it is about worshipping Satan?
Melon
------------------
"Still, I never understood the elevation of greed as a political credo. Why would anyone want to base a political programme on bottomless dissatisfaction and the impossibility of happiness? Perhaps that was its appeal: the promise of luxury that in fact promoted endless work." - Hanif Kureishi, Intimacy
joyfulgirl
Blue Crack Addict
- Joined
- Apr 11, 2001
- Messages
- 16,690
It's really great to see all these wonderful spiritual paths and religions represented here.
martha
Blue Crack Supplier
Yes, both ways. He is the Avatar; like Jesus, Mohammed, Moses, the Buddha.
------------------
She's a little lightheaded, so check on her in a few minutes -- my podiatrist, about me (again), 2-11-02
80sU2isBest
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2000
- Messages
- 4,970
If I may ask, then why call yourself a satanist? Doesn't that imply worshipping satan?
80sU2isBest
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2000
- Messages
- 4,970
CannibalisticArtist,
I have a question for you. Would you have lost self-control over someone sharing (in a loving spirit, I might add) what they thought was a truth that could save you some trouble?
CannibalisticArtist
War Child
no i wouldn't actually, i'm just commending RavenStar on his self control. so many people nowadays snap at each other for so much as even the mention of something that they don't like.
[This message has been edited by CannibalisticArtist (edited 04-09-2002).]
80sU2isBest
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2000
- Messages
- 4,970
That's okay then. Thank you.
HeartlandGirl
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
First, let me say that I am not arguing that Guth's theory proves that God doesn't exist. Ergo, everything else you said is really not relevant to what I wrote. In your first message, you said that there was no scientific evidence that the universe was created without some creative force behind it. Guth's theory, which is based on evidence, does argue that the universe could have come from nothing, which was my original point. Perhaps God created that nothing. I don't know, and as someone else said, it is a difficult point to prove or disprove, which was not my goal. I simply wanted to refute the statement that their had to be a creative force behind the universe. And in response to Anthony's remark that good theories "fit" the evidence...well, if it didn't fit the evidence, it wouldn't be a good theory, now would it?
Now that I've got the article with me, perhaps I can shed some light on the obscure explanation I tried to give, in response to several replies to what I wrote.
Guth's theory is based on scientific evidence. I do not claim to be a particle physicist, but it does take some knowledge of the field to understand his theory, and to explain the entire thing here would be far too cumbersome. I will quote a bit from the article, though.
"This...is more than a theory. Observations are consistent with the idea, and calculations totaling up all the matter and all the gravity in the observable universe indicate that the two values seem to precisely counterbalance. All matter plus all gravity equals zero. So the universe could come from nothing because it is, fundamentally, nothing."
The article goes on the describe specific tests and data that validate Guth's theory, including an explanation of vacuum fluctuation which is important, but hard to explain. I can understand everyone's aversion to such a theory, especially Christians. Even Guth himself says, "It is rather fantastic to realize that the laws of physics can describe how everything was created in a random quantum fluctuation out of nothing..." "Most people really want to know where we came from. I like to strongly push the scientific answer. We have evidence. We no longer have to rely on stories we were told when we were young."
As a sidenote, I find in incredibly interesting that many people think science and religion, or science and God, are mutually exclusive. Getting into the nitty-gritty of the workings of our universe, to my mind, only offers a greater chance for worship and reverence. Scientists, including Einstein, have said the same thing. I read about a geneticist who says that his study of biology brings him closer to God and the wonders of His creations. I encourage others to consider whether or not their beliefs can be reconciled with science. Asking myself that question, I was surprised by the answer.
As for my Catholic-Buddhism, all I can say is that it works for me. I was raised in the Roman Catholic Church, and I hold most of its tenets to be true, excluding such things as birth control and homosexuality as a sin. I have also been trying to learn about other religions and have found many of the Buddhist tenets to be very true and enlightening in my own quest for truth, aka my life. I have found Catholicism and Buddhism to go hand in hand so many times. For example, whether I meditate by saying the Rosary or by chanting, I feel peace. I think in the end, we're all worshipping the same God, just in different ways, and we often get bogged down by the details. But that's just my opinion, and I care not how people will judge me for it. I never try to convert others to my belief system or be judgmental by saying "These people are going to hell and these people aren't." I take care of my own business, and if I change people by presenting different viewpoints, or simply by example, that's alright with me.
And I am in agreement with joyfulgirl. It is wonderful to see so many people sharing their differing points of view so that we can all gain a greater understanding of each other.
Whoa, sorry for the rambling!
------------------
U2 @ The Blooming Heart
[This message has been edited by HeartlandGirl (edited 04-09-2002).]
foray
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Questions for Ravenstar
very sincerely:
1stly, do those 9 Satanic principles come with the exclamation mark? (I'm not trying to be funny)
2ndly, do you know exactly why it is called Satanism if it has nothing to do with Satan?
Finally, I am just curious. What do Satanists do when they are confronted by selfish people? Do they then adopt Statement V and exercise vengeance on the person? But how is that fair, if the selfish person was exercising Statement I & VIII?
Thanks!
foray
very sincerely:
1stly, do those 9 Satanic principles come with the exclamation mark? (I'm not trying to be funny)
2ndly, do you know exactly why it is called Satanism if it has nothing to do with Satan?
Finally, I am just curious. What do Satanists do when they are confronted by selfish people? Do they then adopt Statement V and exercise vengeance on the person? But how is that fair, if the selfish person was exercising Statement I & VIII?
Thanks!
foray
Anthony
Refugee
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but Satanism sounds awfully similar to Existentialism, doesn't it?
Ant.
Ant.
RavenStar~
I appreciate you sharing your beliefs...it seems quite interesting.
------------------
"I'm nearly great, but there's something missing..."
I appreciate you sharing your beliefs...it seems quite interesting.
------------------
"I'm nearly great, but there's something missing..."
OP
OP
AM
Refugee
but there is only one God, Moses, Jesus, Mohammed, Baha?u?ll?h etc. are his messengers. No human being can claim to be God! They can be prophets send by God but never be God!!!
------------------
I'm a bass player. That's a "singer" question. Lord Adam Clayton
"The bass player's got it. The bass player's fucking got it." Bono, Boston 6-9-01
[This message has been edited by AM (edited 04-10-2002).]
Similar threads
