Only courage can stop the spread of AIDS - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 06-17-2005, 07:07 AM   #1
Refugee
 
starsforu2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ashburn, VA (and permanently residing in u2bonogirls head!)
Posts: 2,070
Local Time: 02:04 AM
Only courage can stop the spread of AIDS

An alternative position on how to curb the spread of AIDS.

From Donald R. May M.D.
http://www.townhall.com/columnists/G...20050617.shtml


The secular approach to the containment of AIDS has been a disastrous failure. Programs that encourage the use of condoms with the assurance the users will be “safe” and “protected” in every hedonistic risky sexual encounter have not worked. The myth that condom usage will fully protect one from AIDS, other venereal diseases, and pregnancy has poured gasoline onto the raging worldwide pandemic of sexually transmitted diseases and unwanted pregnancies.

Abortion on demand provides an escape from unintended pregnancies. Current medications can relieve symptoms but are not able to cure viral sexually transmitted diseases such as genital herpes, human papilloma virus (HPV), and AIDS. Cervical cancer, caused by sexually transmitted HPV, is now the leading cause of death for African women.

Pope Benedict XVI reaffirmed to the gathered African bishops on June 10th that the Vatican’s policy of abstinence and monogamy was the only “fail-safe” method of stopping the spread of AIDS. Pope Benedict remained firm in his assertion that condom usage was not only ineffective in preventing new cases of HIV infection but also was against the teachings of the Catholic Church. This Associated Press story appeared and then almost nothing more was reported. While it is true that the Pope’s opposition to condom usage is nothing new, is it possible that little attention was given because what he said is true and is presently the only option that will work to stop the spread of AIDS.

Liberal secular society cannot bring itself to realize that their desire to have sex without consequences has disastrous and deadly results. They are unwilling to cage the demon they have nourished. Condoms fail, as much as 15% of the time or more, and are often not used. Despite all the political pressure, there are no miracle cures for AIDS and most other sexually transmitted diseases. “Safe” sex, other than a monogamous relationship with a disease-free partner, remains a myth.

Pope Benedict and President Bush are among the few World leaders who have the courage to say that “safe” sex is not working and is actually increasing the spread of AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases. There is little secular effort to change hearts, minds, and behavior. Until this is done, the spread of AIDS will continue to accelerate. Thus far, almost all efforts to stop risky sexual behavior are coming from churches, other religious groups, and people of faith.

The secular approach is to promote extramarital sex, including prostitution, and to pretend that everyone can have “protected” sex. Rather than discouraging prostitution, which is a major conduit of AIDS spread in poor countries, the World Health Organization distributes an online “sex work toolkit.” Last month Brazil rejected a $40 million US grant to combat AIDS as the US requires recipient nations to denounce prostitution.

There is no 100% “protected” or “safe” sex. Promoting “safe” or “protected” sex provides a false sense of security. This encourages increased sexual contacts and risky behavior that can result in AIDS. Leaky or failing condoms increase the risk of spreading AIDS.

In 2002 the Tanzanian government seized and destroyed a shipment of 10 million leaky condoms shipped to them by the United Nations Population Fund (UNFPA). we How could the United Nations purchase 10 million condoms without testing them? Even more, why is the United Nations providing condoms if the known failure rate of condoms in Africa may be as high as 15%?

Africa has been the hardest hit by AIDS. Poverty brought on by war and tyrants push many poor, including young children, into prostitution. We can continue to forgive debt and provide economic aid to Africa, but until people can easily buy and sell private property and be protected by the rule of law, Africa will fall deeper into poverty and despair. With injustice, poverty, and despair, little value is placed on one’s own life or the lives of others, and risky behavior and death seem of little added consequence.

Medical treatment is of benefit to those infected with AIDS but does not prevent its spread. Society has unwisely placed no constraints on AIDS patients receiving medications to keep them alive and well. They are free to infect others, receiving at most admonishment to use a condom to insure “safe” sex.

AIDS is a deadly and effective means of population control. UN statistics show that the average life expectancy in some African countries has plummeted from 61 to 47 in a short time. There are predictions that this could drop to 30 in some African countries by 2010.

At an October 1999 UNFPA briefing, a demographer and former representative, Jan Fransen, said to “increase mortality” was one of three choices to limit population growth in Africa. He went on to joke “that AIDS was helping to do the work of population control in Africa.” Apparently none present thought the humor inappropriate. There are undoubtedly those on the left who view AIDS as a means of decreasing the human population and do not want to decrease the spread of AIDS.

Common sense tells us the only way to curb the unbridled spread of AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases is with monogamous relationships and the elimination of risky sexual behavior. This is not about to happen until people’s hearts change. Until they are held financially responsible for the children they produce and the diseases they contract and spread by risky behavior, the problems will not subside.
__________________

__________________
starsforu2 is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:09 AM   #2
Blue Crack Addict
 
U2democrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: England by way of 'Murica.
Posts: 22,140
Local Time: 06:04 AM
I wish it were that simple.
__________________

__________________
U2democrat is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:22 AM   #3
Refugee
 
starsforu2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ashburn, VA (and permanently residing in u2bonogirls head!)
Posts: 2,070
Local Time: 02:04 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by U2democrat
I wish it were that simple.
Hi U2Dem Great answer! Have people simply given up on trying to reform attitudes because it's too daunting? Is it a pie in the sky ideal that just doesn't work when tried?

Is simplicity required to solve a problem of this magnitude? What Bono has done to get Governments to begin relieving debt was not simple. It has taken a lot of hard work, and principally his hardest job was to change the hearts and minds of those who would normally be resistant to it.

Just because it might take a generation for a population to change it's behavior, doesn't mean that it isn't worthwhile to try.
__________________
starsforu2 is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:24 AM   #4
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
dandy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: styrofoam peanut commune
Posts: 4,310
Local Time: 03:04 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by starsforu2
... There are undoubtedly those on the left who view AIDS as a means of decreasing the human population and do not want to decrease the spread of AIDS.
come again?

Quote:
Originally posted by starsforu2
Common sense tells us the only way to curb the unbridled spread of AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases is with monogamous relationships and the elimination of risky sexual behavior. This is not about to happen until people’s hearts change. Until they are held financially responsible for the children they produce and the diseases they contract and spread by risky behavior, the problems will not subside.
wait, is his point about reducing the spread of HIV or stopping what he calls "risky sexual behaviour"? sounds like he's laying blame instead of offering a plausible argument.
__________________
dandy is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:25 AM   #5
Blue Crack Supplier
 
Irvine511's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 30,499
Local Time: 01:04 AM
Re: Only courage can stop the spread of AIDS

Quote:
Originally posted by starsforu2
Liberal secular society cannot bring itself to realize that their desire to have sex without consequences has disastrous and deadly results. They are unwilling to cage the demon they have nourished. Condoms fail, as much as 15% of the time or more, and are often not used.


yes, condoms don't work if you don't use them.

the 15% line is garbage, a deadly lie. condoms work over 99% of the time WHEN THEY ARE USED CORRECTLY. to discard condoms as, perhaps, the most effective weapon you have in the battle against both HIV/AIDS and nearly all other STDs is so irresponsible that i have a difficult time even finishing the article.

is there such a thing as "safe" sex? no. is there such a thing as "safer" sex? absolutely. and condoms are, without question, the best weapon we have. changing behavior is a good thing, but that takes time, and you're battling extremely complex forces and cultures no matter how sunny your outlook is. and the best thing you can do, besides make condoms free and EDUCATE people on how to use them correctly, is to EDUCATE AND EMPOWER WOMEN.

that's the secret.
__________________
Irvine511 is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:28 AM   #6
Blue Crack Addict
 
U2democrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: England by way of 'Murica.
Posts: 22,140
Local Time: 06:04 AM


wonderful post, irvine. as usual.
__________________
U2democrat is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:29 AM   #7
Blue Crack Supplier
 
Irvine511's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 30,499
Local Time: 01:04 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by starsforu2


Hi U2Dem Great answer! Have people simply given up on trying to reform attitudes because it's too daunting? Is it a pie in the sky ideal that just doesn't work when tried?

Is simplicity required to solve a problem of this magnitude? What Bono has done to get Governments to begin relieving debt was not simple. It has taken a lot of hard work, and principally his hardest job was to change the hearts and minds of those who would normally be resistant to it.

Just because it might take a generation for a population to change it's behavior, doesn't mean that it isn't worthwhile to try.


so toss condoms out the window for the next 30 years while people try to "change behavior"?!?!?!

i'm sorry, but i saw a devestating documentary last night called "Darwin's Nightmare." the factors that lead to the spread of HIV/AIDS to empidemic proportions in sub-Saharan Africa are so mindnumbingly complex, and so tied to issues like globalization, free trade, the exploitation of African resources for (mostly) European consumers, that to simply tell millions of people that they should "just say no" is like a slap in the face. it's myopic, sunny, hugely naive, and really just a recycling of racist colonialist attitudes that screwed over the continent in the 19th century to begin with.

i'm sorry, i'm not mad at you, i'm just mad at everything.



if you can, see the film. it's playing at film festivals, and might never make it to an art house theater (let alone a multiplex). but see it if you can.
__________________
Irvine511 is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:30 AM   #8
pax
ONE
love, blood, life
 
pax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Ewen's new American home
Posts: 11,412
Local Time: 02:04 AM
Re: Only courage can stop the spread of AIDS

Quote:
Originally posted by starsforu2
Common sense tells us the only way to curb the unbridled spread of AIDS and other sexually transmitted diseases is with monogamous relationships and the elimination of risky sexual behavior. This is not about to happen until people’s hearts change. Until they are held financially responsible for the children they produce and the diseases they contract and spread by risky behavior, the problems will not subside.
What exactly does "held financially responsible for the children they produce and the diseases they contract and spread" mean? Does he mean we're going to assess some kind of fee or tax on, say, an HIV-positive single mother already struggling to make ends meet?

Gooooooood idea.
__________________
and you hunger for the time
time to heal, desire, time


Join Amnesty.
pax is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:32 AM   #9
Blue Crack Supplier
 
Irvine511's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 30,499
Local Time: 01:04 AM
Re: Re: Only courage can stop the spread of AIDS

Quote:
Originally posted by pax


What exactly does "held financially responsible for the children they produce and the diseases they contract and spread" mean? Does he mean we're going to assess some kind of fee or tax on, say, an HIV-positive single mother already struggling to make ends meet?

well, she should be punished for having sex.

er, i mean she should "take responsibility for her actions."

er, we need to "help her out of a system of dependency."

um ... er ... um ...
__________________
Irvine511 is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:34 AM   #10
Blue Crack Addict
 
U2democrat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: England by way of 'Murica.
Posts: 22,140
Local Time: 06:04 AM
we really do live in a complicated world. and that's an understatement.
__________________
U2democrat is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:45 AM   #11
Refugee
 
starsforu2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ashburn, VA (and permanently residing in u2bonogirls head!)
Posts: 2,070
Local Time: 02:04 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511




so toss condoms out the window for the next 30 years while people try to "change behavior"?!?!?!

i'm sorry, but i saw a devestating documentary last night called "Darwin's Nightmare." the factors that lead to the spread of HIV/AIDS to empidemic proportions in sub-Saharan Africa are so mindnumbingly complex, and so tied to issues like globalization, free trade, the exploitation of African resources for (mostly) European consumers, that to simply tell millions of people that they should "just say no" is like a slap in the face. it's myopic, sunny, hugely naive, and really just a recycling of racist colonialist attitudes that screwed over the continent in the 19th century to begin with.

i'm sorry, i'm not mad at you, i'm just mad at everything.



if you can, see the film. it's playing at film festivals, and might never make it to an art house theater (let alone a multiplex). but see it if you can.
Don't worry I'm not offended. I've read enough of what you've written to realize though passionate, you aren't a jerk.

I also want to dispell the notion that Conservatives want Condoms off the table. I don't know of any reasonable policy that doesn't contain condoms, but when you include them, they need to be presented truthfully. Otherwise people will believe that as long as they use it, they are safe, which is only partly true.

And from personal experience, I have broken more than a few condoms. So I know that they are not 99% effective. And I presume I put them on correctly, but who knows?

In the TMI department I believe that the sizes of the two participants is a big factor on the amount of bad friction that can cause a condom to tear.
__________________
starsforu2 is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:48 AM   #12
pax
ONE
love, blood, life
 
pax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Ewen's new American home
Posts: 11,412
Local Time: 02:04 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by starsforu2


In the TMI department I believe that the sizes of the two participants is a big factor on the amount of bad friction that can cause a condom to tear.
As we go from FYM to the #1 Christian porn site...

Seriously, I see what you're saying about condoms, Tim. Of course it does need to be said that condoms aren't 100% effective. But they are the best tool people have to prevent the spread of HIV outside of total abstinence or a totally monogamous relationship between 2 negative people. You're right that condoms need to stay on the table--and people need to be encouraged to use them, not discouraged.
__________________
and you hunger for the time
time to heal, desire, time


Join Amnesty.
pax is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:51 AM   #13
Refugee
 
starsforu2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ashburn, VA (and permanently residing in u2bonogirls head!)
Posts: 2,070
Local Time: 02:04 AM
Re: Re: Only courage can stop the spread of AIDS

Quote:
Originally posted by pax


What exactly does "held financially responsible for the children they produce and the diseases they contract and spread" mean? Does he mean we're going to assess some kind of fee or tax on, say, an HIV-positive single mother already struggling to make ends meet?

Gooooooood idea.
You assume that he suggests that the penalty be put upon the woman. He doesn't specify, but I assumed that the responsibility would be on the man. He should have been more specific.

I think that he meant that Men couldn't keep going around spreading disease and children and not be held responsible for it. I think he's calling for what we have in this country in terms of child-support and bringing people to trial for knowingly transmitting HIV or other veneral diseases without the consent of the other party. I think it would be harder to enforce anything like this at this stage, particularly if people lack basic protections from the current law.
__________________
starsforu2 is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:55 AM   #14
Refugee
 
starsforu2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ashburn, VA (and permanently residing in u2bonogirls head!)
Posts: 2,070
Local Time: 02:04 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by pax


As we go from FYM to the #1 Christian porn site...

Seriously, I see what you're saying about condoms, Tim. Of course it does need to be said that condoms aren't 100% effective. But they are the best tool people have to prevent the spread of HIV outside of total abstinence or a totally monogamous relationship between 2 negative people. You're right that condoms need to stay on the table--and people need to be encouraged to use them, not discouraged.
I didn't know how to explain how I know

I think we're in total agreement that the most convenient way is to distribute condoms, but even with condom distribution, you have to teach people to adopt it. For a while, I think I read that some places Men refused to wear it because it was deemed dishonorable. So no matter what you teach people in terms of sex, it's going to be a hard slog. I know many friends who won't wear condoms, and they know the facts.
__________________
starsforu2 is offline  
Old 06-17-2005, 07:59 AM   #15
Blue Crack Supplier
 
Irvine511's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 30,499
Local Time: 01:04 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by starsforu2


And from personal experience, I have broken more than a few condoms. So I know that they are not 99% effective. And I presume I put them on correctly, but who knows?

In the TMI department I believe that the sizes of the two participants is a big factor on the amount of bad friction that can cause a condom to tear.


that's why they make Magnum condoms. seriously. and that we would file under "using condoms correctly." also, if you're gay, or simply engaging in anal sex (straight people do it too!) in no way should you use condoms with spermacide, nor should you use the "ultra sensitive" kind. (that could probably go for vaginal intercourse as well).

also, while oral sex is relatively safe (especially if you don't swallow), and the risk of HIV transmission is virtually impossible (you can get other things, however), they also make flavored condoms.

i also use two methods -- condoms, and then withdrawal before ejaculation. so long as the stuff stays outside the human body, you're in pretty good shape. volume and incubation period also has a lot to do with HIV transmission.

other things would be the expiration date, and where the condoms are stored (cool dry place, NOT in your wallet).

gosh ... maybe i should teach a class ...
__________________

__________________
Irvine511 is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:04 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com