Only 25 Artifacts missing...not 50,000 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 05-11-2003, 06:07 AM   #1
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 10,881
Local Time: 05:26 AM
Only 25 Artifacts missing...not 50,000

RELICS
Most Iraqi Treasures Are Said to Be Kept Safe
By BARRY MEIER


top British Museum official said yesterday that his Iraqi counterparts told him they had largely emptied display cases at the National Museum in Baghdad months before the start of the Iraq war, storing many of the museum's most precious artifacts in secure "repositories."

The official, John E. Curtis, curator of the Near East Collection at the British Museum, who recently visited Iraq, said Baghdad museum officials had taken the action on the orders of Iraqi government authorities. When looting started, most of the treasures apparently remaining in display halls were those too large or bulky to have been moved for protection, Mr. Curtis said.


He and Neil MacGregor, the British Museum's director, were in New York for the opening of an exhibition, "Art of the First Cities," at the Metropolitan Museum of Art.

In a news conference at the museum and a subsequent interview, Mr. Curtis said he believed that American authorities now knew the locations of the artifact repositories but that as a precaution against further looting were not disclosing them.

In Iraq yesterday, American and Iraqi officials appeared to support this assessment, saying they still did not know precisely what was missing from the National Museum, because they had not yet had access to sites where art objects may have been hidden, or to rooms inside the building that were among the looters' targets.

But Mr. Curtis said the officials "certainly know" where the hiding places are.

Both he and Mr. MacGregor said a full accounting of missing artifacts would have to await the opening of the repositories.

It was previously known that Iraqi officials placed some artifacts in the vault of the country's Central Bank for safekeeping in the event of war. But Mr. Curtis's comments indicated that safekeeping measures may have been far more extensive.

Such measures would mirror actions taken in Iraq before the Persian Gulf war in 1991, primarily as a protection against bombing of Baghdad.

Mr. Curtis's remarks may help explain recent reports by both Iraqi officials and American authorities that losses at the National Museum are less extensive than previously feared. For instance, Col. Matthew F. Bogdanos, a Marine reservist who is investigating the looting, said recently that Baghdad museum officials had listed only 25 artifacts as definitely missing.

Mr. Curtis said it appeared that a vast majority of the looting at the National Museum had not taken place in its display halls but in its basement storage rooms, where more commonplace objects were kept.

Some 100,000 to 200,000 objects were stored in the basements, British Museum officials said. Many of them may never have been photographed or cataloged.

As a result, Mr. MacGregor said, they are precisely the types of objects that can easily slip into the black market for looted artifacts.

"Even if they have a little museum marking on the back of them," he said, "that can be easily removed."

The protracted debate in Washington over a United Nations resolution to lift sanctions against Iraq has included discussion of a measure to urge all nations to work toward the return of the stolen antiquities, American officials said today.

But it is still not clear whether the United States will seek a separate Security Council resolution on the issue, or include it in a larger one dealing with the sanctions. It also remains unclear whether it will include anything stronger than a plea for cooperation.

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/05/06/in...al/06MUSE.html
__________________

__________________
Dreadsox is offline  
Old 05-11-2003, 11:56 AM   #2
Blue Crack Addict
 
verte76's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: hoping for changes
Posts: 23,331
Local Time: 10:26 AM
Interesting. It's entirely possible that the time isn't right to disclose the location of the artifacts because things are still unstable in Iraq right now. I don't understand how anyone could get away with the tablets of "Gilgamesh". Maybe they are in some vault. There have been other reports that the artifacts were indeed put in vaults. I would be very happy if these things turned up in a vault and there was a report from the Iraqi Interim Government that they'd be back in the museums soon when things are calmer.
__________________

__________________
verte76 is offline  
Old 05-11-2003, 12:01 PM   #3
ONE
love, blood, life
 
FizzingWhizzbees's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: the choirgirl hotel
Posts: 12,614
Local Time: 10:26 AM
Re: Only 25 Artifacts missing...not 50,000

Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
For instance, Col. Matthew F. Bogdanos, a Marine reservist who is investigating the looting, said recently that Baghdad museum officials had listed only 25 artifacts as definitely missing.
While I'd be absolutely delighted if it transpires that only 25 artifacts were stolen, I'm also extremely sceptical of this statement: he states that only 25 artifacts are listed as missing not that only 25 have been taken. That doesn't exclude the possibility that hundreds more are missing but haven't yet been added to whatever list this individual is referring to.
__________________
FizzingWhizzbees is offline  
Old 05-11-2003, 01:41 PM   #4
Blue Crack Addict
 
verte76's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: hoping for changes
Posts: 23,331
Local Time: 10:26 AM
Re: Re: Only 25 Artifacts missing...not 50,000

Quote:
Originally posted by FizzingWhizzbees


While I'd be absolutely delighted if it transpires that only 25 artifacts were stolen, I'm also extremely sceptical of this statement: he states that only 25 artifacts are listed as missing not that only 25 have been taken. That doesn't exclude the possibility that hundreds more are missing but haven't yet been added to whatever list this individual is referring to.

Yeah, I wonder who made this list? I'm going to see if I can find anything about this in the Iraqi news. My power went out for about an hour.
__________________
verte76 is offline  
Old 05-11-2003, 07:45 PM   #5
Blue Crack Addict
 
verte76's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: hoping for changes
Posts: 23,331
Local Time: 10:26 AM
I just went back and re-read the article. The British Museum has the largest Mesopotamian/Sumerian collection outside of Iraq, so it's not that the guy is clueless. This is just vague. Maybe they are being deliberately vague for security reasons right now. Maybe they shouldn't tell the press or the public where the vaults are right now. The top U.S. officials are being shuffled right now. Maybe they are all working together.
__________________
verte76 is offline  
Old 05-11-2003, 08:25 PM   #6
Refugee
 
Klaus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: on a one of these small green spots at that blue planet at the end of the milky way
Posts: 2,432
Local Time: 11:26 AM
It would be wonderful if it was like that - we'll see in the next week or months - it should be easy to verify if the UN list of stolen goods include many things which aren't stolen or not
__________________
Klaus is offline  
Old 05-11-2003, 10:55 PM   #7
Blue Crack Addict
 
verte76's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: hoping for changes
Posts: 23,331
Local Time: 10:26 AM
On the whole I'm really happy to read this article. This guy is a big shot in Middle Eastern antiquities museum affairs. It looks like the rip-off isn't as bad as we thought it was. I know I was under the impression that every artifact in Baghdad had been ripped off. It was insanity. I'm always glad to be wrong like this. I would love to see those things some day. I hope in the future that Americans can go to Iraq with museum vouchers and discuss the artifacts with Iraqis in the local coffee shops.
__________________
verte76 is offline  
Old 05-17-2003, 02:45 PM   #8
Blue Crack Addict
 
deep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: A far distance down.
Posts: 28,501
Local Time: 02:26 AM
This is very good news.

One more example of irresponsible reporting.

The media was sensationalizing a story because it was good for ratings?

My friends on the right might see this as attacking the Administration, to make the US look bad. That is one conclusion.

I see a lot in non-factual reporting that supports the Administration. I believe it is because it is what those viewing the stories what to hear. It is ratings (money) driven.

The news we watch on television in the US has gotten progressively less accurate. They are no longer looking for actual news but are looking for content to raise their ratings.
__________________
deep is offline  
Old 05-17-2003, 06:45 PM   #9
Blue Crack Addict
 
verte76's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: hoping for changes
Posts: 23,331
Local Time: 10:26 AM
Deep, I'm actually not sure where this news came from. But John Curtis is a big shot in the museum world. He recently went to Iraq to meet with people who work with artifacts in Baghdad and other places in Iraq. While I don't rule out the U.S. media, at least some of it, wanting to put a spin on the U.S. government's role in all of this, I don't think Curtis is trying to make anyone look good, bad or indifferent. He's British and the British people as a whole are of a differing opinion of the war. They're much less approving of the whole thing than Americans are. Actually I don't think Curtis is political. He just wants to help the Iraqis get their artifacts back.
__________________
verte76 is offline  
Old 05-17-2003, 07:37 PM   #10
Blue Crack Addict
 
verte76's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: hoping for changes
Posts: 23,331
Local Time: 10:26 AM
Anyone who wants good information about the artifact situation, go to this site.

http://www.baghdadmuseum.org/


This is the site of the Baghdad Museum Project, a non-political cooperative involving scholars and supporters from the U.S, Iraq, India and other countries. I think I'd better not start another artifacts thread.
__________________

__________________
verte76 is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:26 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com