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Old 10-20-2007, 04:42 PM   #421
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you left out the part that I was tempted to, and if I had acted on those impulses or temptations, who knows what could of happened.


My point is that it came down to choice for me as it has others.

Irvine demonstrated a process, from Straight to Bi to Gay.

Who knows I could have went down that path if I didn't say no to those suggestive impulses and solicitations from people with an agenda, that agenda would being to "convert the straight guy".

What happens later in life if Irvine reverts back to being Straight, are some going to castigate him for being a trader to his "true nature"?

dbs
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Old 10-20-2007, 04:43 PM   #422
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Originally posted by diamond
I chose not to experiment with something that didn't feel right
Congratulations, diamond, for reinventing the wheel.

Being gay or straight, for most people, boils down to what comes natural to them--i.e., "something that feels right."

Those who can freely move between being "gay" and "straight" are, by definition, bisexual.
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Old 10-20-2007, 04:50 PM   #423
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Originally posted by diamond
you left out the part that I was tempted to, and if I had acted on those impulses or temptations, who knows what could of happened.
What you don't understand is that if you have a genuine attraction to women--as you've stated yourself here repeatedly--that never goes away.

If you are bisexual--and, according to anthropologists and scientists like Alfred Kinsey, that is probably most of the human population to a varying degree (see the Kinsey Scale if you want to understand this further)--then so be it. Even if you have a side of you that is (mildly) attracted to men, it will not change or eliminate your existing attraction to women.

But, as Alfred Kinsey and his Kinsey Scale (I do recommend you read it) have demonstrated, sexuality may not be cut-and-dry like the dualistic categories of "heterosexual" and "homosexual," but one thing is for sure is that it is something that is not chosen. If you are truly heterosexual, you will be a lifelong heterosexual. If you are truly homosexual, you will be a lifelong homosexual. If you are truly bisexual, you will be a lifelong bisexual.

So, right there, your fears about "turning exclusively gay" or Irvine "turning exclusively straight" are downright unfounded.
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Old 10-20-2007, 05:01 PM   #424
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond
you left out the part that I was tempted to, and if I had acted on those impulses or temptations, who knows what could of happened.


My point is that it came down to choice for me as it has others.

Irvine demonstrated a process, from Straight to Bi to Gay.

Who knows I could have went down that path if I didn't say no to those suggestive impulses and solicitations from people with an agenda, that agenda would being to "convert the straight guy".

What happens later in life if Irvine reverts back to being Straight, are some going to castigate him for being a trader to his "true nature"?

dbs
If I remember correctly you've admitted to being quite the hedonist in the past. Were these mens' offers tempting because you felt attraction to them or tempting because of the sexual gratification aspect?

And Irvine never demonstrated a process from being straight to being gay. If I remember correctly, Irvine basically said that he tried to be straight but knew that he wasn't. That's a bit of a difference.
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Old 10-21-2007, 09:46 AM   #425
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Oh no, what is next?

NEW YORK — Harry Potter fans, the rumors are true: Albus Dumbledore, master wizard and Headmaster of Hogwarts, is gay. J.K. Rowling, author of the mega-selling fantasy series that ended last summer, outed the beloved character Friday night while appearing before a full house at Carnegie Hall.

After reading briefly from the final book, "Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows," she took questions from audience members.

She was asked by one young fan whether Dumbledore finds "true love."

"Dumbledore is gay," the author responded to gasps and applause.

She then explained that Dumbledore was smitten with rival Gellert Grindelwald, whom he defeated long ago in a battle between good and bad wizards. "Falling in love can blind us to an extent," Rowling said of Dumbledore's feelings, adding that Dumbledore was "horribly, terribly let down."

Dumbledore's love, she observed, was his "great tragedy."

"Oh, my god," Rowling concluded with a laugh, "the fan fiction."

Potter readers on fan sites and elsewhere on the Internet have speculated on the sexuality of Dumbledore, noting that he has no close relationship with women and a mysterious, troubled past. And explicit scenes with Dumbledore already have appeared in fan fiction.

Rowling told the audience that while working on the planned sixth Potter film, "Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince," she spotted a reference in the script to a girl who once was of interest to Dumbledore. A note was duly passed to director David Yates, revealing the truth about her character.

Rowling, finishing a brief "Open Book Tour" of the United States, her first tour here since 2000, also said that she regarded her Potter books as a "prolonged argument for tolerance" and urged her fans to "question authority."

Not everyone likes her work, Rowling said, likely referring to Christian groups that have alleged the books promote witchcraft. Her news about Dumbledore, she said, will give them one more
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Old 10-21-2007, 10:17 AM   #426
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Originally posted by diamond
y
What happens later in life if Irvine reverts back to being Straight, are some going to castigate him for being a trader to his "true nature"?

dbs


and what happens when we meet, and then we start to make out, and then you start to like it?
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Old 10-21-2007, 03:04 PM   #427
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and what happens when we meet, and then we start to make out, and then you start to like it?
Can I be there when that happens?
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Old 10-22-2007, 05:19 PM   #428
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Quote:
Originally posted by melon


What you don't understand is that if you have a genuine attraction to women--as you've stated yourself here repeatedly--that never goes away.

scientists like Alfred Kinsey..

But, as Alfred Kinsey..

So, right there, your fears about "turning exclusively gay" or Irvine "turning exclusively straight" are downright unfounded.
Alfred Kinsey-wasn't there a movie about him recently that won awards?
I think Liam Neeson played the part.

About my sexual journey:

I think as a child I was always curious about girls, because they were different from me, matter of fact I got in trouble peeking on my big sister and female cousin , both about 15-I was about 6-7, while they were changing in the bathroom.

When I hit puberty I was more open to anything sexual, but wouldn't act on it, but I was curious. (Could i be "gay or Bi" according to Dr Kinsey?) Who cares. I think Kinsey was raised in a strict and religious enviornment that made him feel shame for sexual impulses when those impulses were God given, and needed to be marshalled. Because Dr Kinsey was made to feel shame he rebeled, became an avowed Atheist and Bi Sexual and was "off to the races" to explore and report on any and every sexual fetish he thought that supported his new found "freedom" and views.

When the first time I finally had the sex it was with my first love a girl across the street-it was awkward, it didn't feel right because I was taught pre marital sex was wrong.

I was also approached by Gay ppl and felt it was wrong for the aforementioned reasons.

So sex to me was really meant to be when you're to be married to someone of the opposite sex, anything else like mere pleasure isn't what sex was meant for. That's my spiritual belief system, so you can attempt to condemn me for it, but I don't think it would be productive for you to do so.

So that's all I have for you guys.

ttyl

dbs
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Old 10-22-2007, 05:23 PM   #429
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Quote:
Originally posted by diamond

so you can attempt to condemn me for it, but I don't think it would be productive for you to do so.

But it's ok for you to condemn people left and right?

Ok, as long as I'm clear on this.

It's ok for diamond, but not productive for the rest of us.

Everybody got that?
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Old 10-22-2007, 05:26 PM   #430
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Originally posted by diamond


When I hit puberty I was more open to anything sexual, but wouldn't act on it, but I was curious. (Could i be "gay or Bi" according to Dr Kinsey?) Who cares?


i am so going to turn you gay when i finally meet you.
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Old 10-22-2007, 06:07 PM   #431
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Originally posted by Irvine511
i am so going to turn you gay when i finally meet you.

You could turn me straight.
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Old 10-24-2007, 11:15 AM   #432
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511




i am so going to turn you gay when i finally meet you.

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Old 10-24-2007, 02:59 PM   #433
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Irvine demonstrated a process, from Straight to Bi to Gay.
Uh ... when? I could've sworn he'd said it was a realization, not some kind of change of heart.
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Old 10-24-2007, 03:21 PM   #434
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Irvine demonstrated a process, from Straight to Bi to Gay.
um no, Irvine went through stages of identity development. we never really change who we are as a person. throughout life we grow and develop and learn more about who we are. that is something we all go through. your outlying of this is contrary to all the theories and research i've studied. i suggest you read some Cass and Gilligan. what you are trying to state as fact is based on your own belief system and has more to do with confining to specific values of an organization than it does what has actually been studied.

in a way, it irks me that you are trying to state something is true when i've actually studied this myself. and your conclusions aren't based on any studying you've done in the field.

if you want, i'd be more than happy to show you flow charts of identity development theories.
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Old 10-24-2007, 05:47 PM   #435
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Quote:
Originally posted by unico


um no, Irvine went through stages of identity development. we never really change who we are as a person. throughout life we grow and develop and learn more about who we are. that is something we all go through. your outlying of this is contrary to all the theories and research i've studied. i suggest you read some Cass and Gilligan. what you are trying to state as fact is based on your own belief system and has more to do with confining to specific values of an organization than it does what has actually been studied.

in a way, it irks me that you are trying to state something is true when i've actually studied this myself. and your conclusions aren't based on any studying you've done in the field.

if you want, i'd be more than happy to show you flow charts of identity development theories.
unico
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you are no Judi Reisman.


dbs
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