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Old 08-15-2007, 09:02 PM   #631
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well thanks for sharing these quotes 2861U2. swearing is such a fucking awful thing to do. it is a god damned shamed she talks like a fucking shit-kicker. it really makes her a piece of shit of a candidate. no other candidate ever swears like that. ever. and it is so much worse to swear all the fucking time instead of um...

LIE TO THE WORLD!
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Old 08-15-2007, 09:35 PM   #632
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OMFG
That is the last time I'm turning on the TV again (I don't typically watch it.) McCain has some sort of campaign thing on C-Span2 right now, and he brought up the VT incident to some dumbass. And fucknut actually said that what the media did to Richard Jewel (Olympic bombings) is the same as what happened to the victims of the VT shooting.

Fucking idiot. AND MCCAIN AGREED!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 08-15-2007, 10:51 PM   #633
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Originally posted by Irvine511


but we're done with politicians we "like."
Tell that to all the people who want to vote for Obama just because he is young, black, handsome, and a good speaker. I think it is the opposite of what you state. I think presidential elections are becoming more like American Idol.

And I would disagree with your assertion that Clinton would destroy Giuliani. It would be very close. Pretty much every poll I've seen has had them virtually tied.
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Old 08-15-2007, 11:16 PM   #634
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Originally posted by 2861U2


Tell that to all the people who want to vote for Obama just because he is young, black, handsome, and a good speaker. I think it is the opposite of what you state. I think presidential elections are becoming more like American Idol.

And I would disagree with your assertion that Clinton would destroy Giuliani. It would be very close. Pretty much every poll I've seen has had them virtually tied.


it remains to be seen, but what we have seen is Clinton significantly widening her lead over Obama, despite he being a genuine political talent and having all the "American Idol" qualities you speak of. if what you were saying were true, then Obama wouldn't be 20ish points behind, so you've essentially contradicted yourself.

it also remains to be seen what will happen in a Clinton vs. Giuliani match up -- i personally think Romney will be the nominee -- but it has been said that he is who the Clinton camp would most like to run against.

and we can't ignore the fact that the dreaded shadow of Bush is going to loom over this election. he's clearly the worst president of the past 50 years. there's really no debate about that any more. and the reason why is because he's manifestly incompetent, and whether you like her or dislike her, Clinton is manifestly competent. she's not going to run the country into the ground the way Bush has. she's a safe bet. she's a workaholic, approval-hungry, career politician.
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Old 08-16-2007, 12:24 AM   #635
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the shadow of Bush is going to loom over this election.
Well, you do have that right. However, I dont think that is going to help the Dem nominee. The candidates are attacking Bush 10 times as much as they are attacking their Republican counterparts. Clinton and the rest of them must not have gotten the memo that President Bush is not going to be running against them next year. I dont see any point in even talking about the current administration. To me, that demonstrates a lack of vision to be constantly attacking a lame duck. I think the American people are an optimistic people, and dont want to hear about the past, but rather look to the future. I dont believe an assault on Bush now will do the Dems much good in the long run. They should A) be attacking the other Dems and B) be attacking the Republicans. I dont think pounding on Bush will help them that much.
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Old 08-16-2007, 02:13 AM   #636
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Originally posted by 2861U2


Well, you do have that right. However, I dont think that is going to help the Dem nominee. The candidates are attacking Bush 10 times as much as they are attacking their Republican counterparts. Clinton and the rest of them must not have gotten the memo that President Bush is not going to be running against them next year. I dont see any point in even talking about the current administration. To me, that demonstrates a lack of vision to be constantly attacking a lame duck. I think the American people are an optimistic people, and dont want to hear about the past, but rather look to the future. I dont believe an assault on Bush now will do the Dems much good in the long run. They should A) be attacking the other Dems and B) be attacking the Republicans. I dont think pounding on Bush will help them that much.
There isn't a single first (Romney, Rudy, FT, McCain) or second tier (Brownback, Huckabee) Republican candidate who has distanced themselves from GW Bush. It would be pure stupidity not to remind voters that all of these guys more or less support the Bush foreign policy. Domestic policy is pretty much a loser issue for the Reps, unless it's some God issue and has been for a long time.

Iraq is the #1 issue, Bush's numbers are in the toilet because of Iraq, this issue isn't going anywhere, all of the 6 serious candidates left in the racce support his policy. They are beating Bush up, 1-because he is (almost inarguable) the worst President of the vast majority of our lifetimes. 2-They can easily paint anyone of these guys, just pick one, as a Bush clone. It's a winning issue for the Dems and easy to see why they'd be doing this.

It may demonstrate a lack of vision because it's just a mere political stunt just like pimping certain issues to be on ballots to turn out for example, the religous bigots, in droves.

The Dems lack a vision for several things, one of which is certainly not how to win in '08. They got a ton of help, it's not like they are geniuses or anything, Jimmy Carter helped Reagan win two elections by a landslide.

As for the last bit, we don't care much about the past?
I'll be curious if you think this way when the Republicans are trumping up the same ol' slime machine to try and sling mud at Hillary. It will happen. She'll be the nominee and they will try and swiftboat her. I don't think it will work. People have a pretty firm opinion about her anyhow. Those that believe the VInce Foster-type bullshit will continue to, and there is a good chance that undecideds might fall her way when they get to hear the Bush stump speech through a different talking head.

Things would be A LOT different if Newt Gingrich or Ron Paul were electable. Those guys can/could seriously distance themselves.

Meanwhile, the Dems will be saying "Sick of Bush-esque policy?"
Vote for us. How would this not make sense?
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Old 08-16-2007, 03:39 AM   #637
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Originally posted by 2861U2


Well, you do have that right. However, I dont think that is going to help the Dem nominee. The candidates are attacking Bush 10 times as much as they are attacking their Republican counterparts. Clinton and the rest of them must not have gotten the memo that President Bush is not going to be running against them next year. I dont see any point in even talking about the current administration. To me, that demonstrates a lack of vision to be constantly attacking a lame duck. I think the American people are an optimistic people, and dont want to hear about the past, but rather look to the future. I dont believe an assault on Bush now will do the Dems much good in the long run. They should A) be attacking the other Dems and B) be attacking the Republicans. I dont think pounding on Bush will help them that much.


you don't think that maintaining connections between the Republicans -- since we don't have a nominee yet -- and the most consistently unpopular president in modern history isn't a good political strategy? Bush is beyond assaulting; he's a pile of goo in the Oval Office and the Republicans know this, and witness how little he is mentioned in their debates and the lengths to which the candidates are going to distance themselves from him (and just look what Bush has done to McCain). they themselves have been pounding, politely, on Bush -- a sitting president from their own party!
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Old 08-16-2007, 03:44 AM   #638
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Originally posted by 2861U2


Well, you do have that right. However, I dont think that is going to help the Dem nominee. The candidates are attacking Bush 10 times as much as they are attacking their Republican counterparts. Clinton and the rest of them must not have gotten the memo that President Bush is not going to be running against them next year. I dont see any point in even talking about the current administration. To me, that demonstrates a lack of vision to be constantly attacking a lame duck. I think the American people are an optimistic people, and dont want to hear about the past, but rather look to the future. I dont believe an assault on Bush now will do the Dems much good in the long run. They should A) be attacking the other Dems and B) be attacking the Republicans. I dont think pounding on Bush will help them that much.
You can tell you are a fresh new voter... But you can also tell you've done little to no research...

You are the scary demographic!!!
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Old 08-16-2007, 08:55 AM   #639
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2861U2, this is why most of us disagree with you about your claims of Clinton being far left:

The political compass is a web site where you answer a number of questions and it tells you where you fit in terms of being left, right, authoritarian, and libertarian. Based on the candidates' platforms, they've determined where these candidates lie in the compass. Haha I said candidates lie.

Quote:
In response to many requests - and not only from the US - here are most of the prominent names to date in the primaries. If your favourite is not yet included, please remember that we'll be adding others along the way. We'll also be charting the presidential candidates for all the parties when the race begins.

Please keep in mind that The Political Compass is a universal tool, reflecting the full spectrum of political thought, and applicable to all democracies. US politics are generally fought within a more confined space. While in mainstream America, Clinton, for example, may be seen as left leaning, in the overall political landscape, she is a moderate conservative. Someone like Kucinich, while seen by his severest opponents as an extreme left winger, would qualify as a typical social democrat in a European context.


http://www.politicalcompass.org/usprimaries2007


i don't see how anyone in the blue can call themselves a democrat.
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Old 08-16-2007, 10:17 AM   #640
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


You can tell you are a fresh new voter... But you can also tell you've done little to no research...

You are the scary demographic!!!
Ok.....?

Please elaborate.
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Old 08-16-2007, 11:24 AM   #641
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Ok.....?

Please elaborate.
You just know very little about politics and the little that you know you take from Rush or antihillary sites. Nothing to scratch your head over, I think it's a bubble that you consciously live in.
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Old 08-16-2007, 11:51 AM   #642
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You just know very little about politics and the little that you know you take from Rush or antihillary sites. Nothing to scratch your head over, I think it's a bubble that you consciously live in.
Well that's your opinion, but it is a dumb one. I dont live in any bubble, I follow politics closely and know more than any other 19 year old I know. And FYI, I have visited that Anti-Hillary site once. I was searching for something on Google and it brought me there. I do not get my news there, so you are, once again, incorrect.
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Old 08-16-2007, 12:31 PM   #643
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Well that's your opinion, but it is a dumb one. I dont live in any bubble, I follow politics closely and know more than any other 19 year old I know. And FYI, I have visited that Anti-Hillary site once. I was searching for something on Google and it brought me there. I do not get my news there, so you are, once again, incorrect.
I know some very well informed 19 year olds, and you may follow politics but it's how you follow politics that is disturbing. Anyone who believes we have satellite footage because "Rush wouldn't lie", lives somewhat in a bubble. If you paid any attention outside of that news source you would have known he's a liar.

Well then why post a website you've only visited once? Don't trust everything you read just because it fits your bias. Question everything!!!
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Old 08-16-2007, 12:35 PM   #644
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Well then why post a website you've only visited once? Don't trust everything you read just because it fits your bias. Question everything!!!
That site wasnt the only place you can find those quotes. I could give you dozens of websites that have that same list.
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Old 08-16-2007, 12:53 PM   #645
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That site wasnt the only place you can find those quotes. I could give you dozens of websites that have that same list.
I'm sure you could but I'm not interested. I'm not interested in out of context unsourced quotes from any politician.

We could dedicate half the internet to Bush quotes but what would be the point?
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