Obama: Not Black? - Page 6 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 02-01-2007, 09:59 AM   #76
Blue Crack Supplier
 
Irvine511's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 30,499
Local Time: 08:06 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by INDY500


Well, a Republican would immediately be labeled a bigot in this forum for such a comment. But Biden is a liberal Democrat, which complicates matters doesn't it?


Biden is a liberal democrat?

he's one of the more hawkish democrats around.
__________________

__________________
Irvine511 is offline  
Old 02-01-2007, 01:08 PM   #77
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The American Resistance
Posts: 4,754
Local Time: 07:06 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511




Biden is a liberal democrat?

he's one of the more hawkish democrats around.
Wow, that's really saying something.

According to the latest National Journal Composite Liberal Score (2005) Joe Biden rates a 80/100.

Which to put in context.
Joe Lieberman 66
The Jr senator from DE Tom Carper rated 71
Hillary Clinton 80 (same score)
Chris Dodd 80 (same score)
Barack Obama 83
John McCain 41
Trent Lott 12

Biden is a liberal, but yes, he's more reasonable than say, Ted Kennedy(97).
__________________

__________________
INDY500 is offline  
Old 02-01-2007, 01:11 PM   #78
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
redhotswami's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Waiting for this madness to end.
Posts: 5,846
Local Time: 08:06 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by INDY500


Wow, that's really saying something.

According to the latest National Journal Composite Liberal Score (2005) Joe Biden rates a 80/100.

Which to put in context.
Joe Lieberman 66
The Jr senator from DE Tom Carper rated 71
Hillary Clinton 80 (same score)
Chris Dodd 80 (same score)
Barack Obama 83
John McCain 41
Trent Lott 12

Biden is a liberal, but yes, he's more reasonable than say, Ted Kennedy(97).

Edit: NM
__________________
redhotswami is offline  
Old 02-01-2007, 01:24 PM   #79
Blue Crack Supplier
 
Irvine511's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 30,499
Local Time: 08:06 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by INDY500


Wow, that's really saying something.

According to the latest National Journal Composite Liberal Score (2005) Joe Biden rates a 80/100.

Which to put in context.
Joe Lieberman 66
The Jr senator from DE Tom Carper rated 71
Hillary Clinton 80 (same score)
Chris Dodd 80 (same score)
Barack Obama 83
John McCain 41
Trent Lott 12

Biden is a liberal, but yes, he's more reasonable than say, Ted Kennedy(97).


oh, the NATIONAL JOURNAL! phew!

no, not unbiased or with many bones to pick at all.
__________________
Irvine511 is offline  
Old 02-01-2007, 01:38 PM   #80
Acrobat
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Petaluma, CA
Posts: 359
Local Time: 02:06 AM
I just wanted to add that on Jon Stewart (I know it's not real news) He mentioned that Hillary Clinton was not the source of the Obama story.
__________________
MissMoo is offline  
Old 02-01-2007, 01:51 PM   #81
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The American Resistance
Posts: 4,754
Local Time: 07:06 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511




oh, the NATIONAL JOURNAL! phew!

no, not unbiased or with many bones to pick at all.
There are many such ratings from many different sources and viewpoints (most of which require a subscription I don't have), but I'm curious.
How would the Democratic candidates fare on the Irvine511 Liberal Composite Score?

My subjective ratings (most liberal to least)

Kucinich
Karl Marx (if he were running)
Edwards
Dodds
Obama
H Clinton
Wes Clark
Biden
Richardson
Bayh (whom I would have voted for)

Vilsack (who knows)(who cares)

So I would rate Biden lower than all serious candidates other than Richardson.
__________________
INDY500 is offline  
Old 02-01-2007, 08:00 PM   #82
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
CTU2fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 5,366
Local Time: 09:06 PM
Ya I generally think of Biden as one of the more Con-ish Dems...him & Joe Lieberman.
__________________
CTU2fan is offline  
Old 02-03-2007, 11:38 AM   #83
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
maycocksean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: The Most Important State in the Union
Posts: 4,882
Local Time: 08:06 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by INDY500


Well, a Republican would immediately be labeled a bigot in this forum for such a comment. But Biden is a liberal Democrat, which complicates matters doesn't it?
While you would definitely find me on the liberal end of most arguments in this forum, I must agree with Indy on this. Biden's getting a pass because he's a Democrat which I think is a damn shame. We may all quietly agree that Biden is a racist but it won't fill 20 pages, that's for sure.

Even on this thread, the silence in regards to Biden's quote is deafening (except for the lone voice of Mrs. S calling a spade a spade regardless of political party affiliation).

As to Biden's comment itself, I'd always thought that the first black president would be a Republican because the Dems would never stoop to using racist tactics to scare white people away from voting for him the way the Republicans would. But I guess I was wrong.
__________________
maycocksean is offline  
Old 02-03-2007, 01:09 PM   #84
She's the One
 
martha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Orange County and all over the goddamn place
Posts: 42,338
Local Time: 05:06 PM
The silence could be the result of crushing embarrassment and disappointment.
__________________
martha is offline  
Old 02-03-2007, 02:07 PM   #85
Forum Moderator
 
yolland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 7,471
Local Time: 02:06 AM
For better or for worse, when threads on such topics run to high page counts, it's generally because one or more posters disagree with the premise, and the resulting debate is what draws things out--e.g. the Allen thread (where the very first reply was to disagree), the Virginia slavery resolution thread, the Grey's Anatomy thread, Mel Gibson etc. Speaking for myself, and since the Allen thread seems to be the point of comparison here, I never personally called Allen a "bigot" and only posted in that thread to get people who disagreed with its premise to explain what "macaca" meant, if not a racial slur (and I didn't feel I ever got a convincing response). I suppose if someone regularly posts simply to express unadorned judgments like "Disgusting" or "What a bigot" in threads featuring alleged Republican racists, but not Democratic ones, then yes that would be hypocrisy. But not everyone makes posts of that type. Biden wouldn't get my vote and I agree his comments were repulsive, however, for FYM purposes I really don't have anything substantive to say about them, unless and until there's something to be analyzed and debated in either his words or someone's reactions to them.

However, if MrsS is willing, I'd be happy to separate out the posts about Biden's Obama comments into a new thread and see if anyone wishes to deny that his comments were racist (or critique that labeling of them, etc.). Other than that, I agree with MrsS' response--by all means, go ahead and start threads on Biden or whatever other Dems you think are bigots if you feel that gets chronically short shrift. I think that would get the message across more effectively than only bringing it up as a tangent in threads about 'incidents' involving Republicans. Perhaps it boils down to a question of what you think threads like that are 'for'--I tend to see FYM as "Sit down and discuss" not "Stand up and be counted" so personally, I wouldn't conclude much of anything if I posted, without argument, an article about someone making a racist/sexist/anti-Semitic/etc. comment and hardly anyone replied. IMHO, it's a little silly to treat an online forum as some foolproof barometer of what people "really" stand for, for good or for bad.
__________________
yolland [at] interference.com


μελετώ αποτυγχάνειν. -- Διογένης της Σινώπης
yolland is offline  
Old 02-03-2007, 02:11 PM   #86
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 10,881
Local Time: 08:06 PM
I heard a politcal analyst on good morning America say that the Biden comments were a good thing for Obama.....because the African American community does not see him as being black.

I guess Biden is relevant to the thread.

That said, damn, I liked Biden up until he spoke this week. I was there in 1988 when his campaign got in trouble for plagiarizing speeches from a british politician if I am not mistaken. LOL He is done.
__________________
Dreadsox is offline  
Old 02-03-2007, 05:26 PM   #87
Blue Crack Addict
 
verte76's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: hoping for changes
Posts: 23,331
Local Time: 01:06 AM
Biden stuck his foot in his mouth. I never thought he'd say such trash. But he's just another politician.
__________________
verte76 is offline  
Old 02-04-2007, 06:12 AM   #88
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
maycocksean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: The Most Important State in the Union
Posts: 4,882
Local Time: 08:06 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by yolland
For better or for worse, when threads on such topics run to high page counts, it's generally because one or more posters disagree with the premise, and the resulting debate is what draws things out--e.g. the Allen thread (where the very first reply was to disagree), the Virginia slavery resolution thread, the Grey's Anatomy thread, Mel Gibson etc. Speaking for myself, and since the Allen thread seems to be the point of comparison here, I never personally called Allen a "bigot" and only posted in that thread to get people who disagreed with its premise to explain what "macaca" meant, if not a racial slur (and I didn't feel I ever got a convincing response). I suppose if someone regularly posts simply to express unadorned judgments like "Disgusting" or "What a bigot" in threads featuring alleged Republican racists, but not Democratic ones, then yes that would be hypocrisy. But not everyone makes posts of that type. Biden wouldn't get my vote and I agree his comments were repulsive, however, for FYM purposes I really don't have anything substantive to say about them, unless and until there's something to be analyzed and debated in either his words or someone's reactions to them.

However, if MrsS is willing, I'd be happy to separate out the posts about Biden's Obama comments into a new thread and see if anyone wishes to deny that his comments were racist (or critique that labeling of them, etc.). Other than that, I agree with MrsS' response--by all means, go ahead and start threads on Biden or whatever other Dems you think are bigots if you feel that gets chronically short shrift. I think that would get the message across more effectively than only bringing it up as a tangent in threads about 'incidents' involving Republicans. Perhaps it boils down to a question of what you think threads like that are 'for'--I tend to see FYM as "Sit down and discuss" not "Stand up and be counted" so personally, I wouldn't conclude much of anything if I posted, without argument, an article about someone making a racist/sexist/anti-Semitic/etc. comment and hardly anyone replied. IMHO, it's a little silly to treat an online forum as some foolproof barometer of what people "really" stand for, for good or for bad.
I see your point, but I still maintain there is an element of basic human hypocrisy. . .I'm not necessarily saying that something should be "done about it", just pointing it out. I think conservative and liberals are just as likely to gloss over, ignore, or explain away the failings of those on "their" side. I think it often comes of attaching the person's failing to a general excoriation and condemnation of the other side. (i.e. "Allen's a horrible racist and this just proves what the 'racist-religious-right-Republican crowd is doing to our country etc" ) When it's your own guy being a racist you're obviously not going to use that as an opportunity to tear down Democrats/liberals as a whole. So you're left the perfunctory "what a jerk" or silence. And again, I do think it works vice versa.
__________________
maycocksean is offline  
Old 02-04-2007, 02:04 PM   #89
Blue Crack Addict
 
anitram's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: NY
Posts: 16,297
Local Time: 08:06 PM
I've been overseas so I missed this bit.

I've always been very negative about Biden on this site, years ago, and let's face it, he has no chance anyway. He's an opportunistic old windbag at best. I can't believe anyone would even take his candidacy seriously.
__________________
anitram is offline  
Old 02-09-2007, 05:10 PM   #90
Blue Crack Addict
 
MrsSpringsteen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 24,994
Local Time: 08:06 PM
He's on 60 Minutes Sunday

Acknowledging that his presidential campaign has opened a racial debate, Sen. Barack Obama, who has a white mother and an African father, says if you look African-American, you are treated like one. Obama and his wife, Michelle, who also addresses the race issue, appear in an interview with Steve Kroft to be broadcast on 60 MINUTES, Sunday Feb. 11 (7:00-8:00 PM, ET/PT) on the CBS television Network. If, as expected, Obama declares his formal candidacy for the Democratic presidential nomination tomorrow, it will be his first interview to be broadcast after that event.

When asked by Kroft if growing up in a white household had caused him to make a decision to be black, Obama replies, "I'm not sure I decided it. I think... if you look African American in this society, you're treated as an African-American "It's interesting though, that now I feel very comfortable and confident in terms of who I am and where I stake my ground. But I notice that... I've become a focal point for a racial debate," says Obama.

Obama's wife also addresses the race issue when asked by Kroft whether she fears for her husband's life as a black candidate. "I don't lose sleep over it because the realities are that... as a black man... Barack can get shot going to the gas station," says Michelle Obama. "You can't make decisions based on fear and the possibility of what might happen."

Will being African-American hold him back as a candidate? "No.... If I don't win this race it will be because of other factors --[that] I have not shown to the American people a vision for where the country needs to go that they can embrace," Obama tells Kroft.

There's some video on their site

http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/60mi...main3415.shtml
__________________

__________________
MrsSpringsteen is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:06 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com