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Old 04-23-2012, 06:07 PM   #91
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Why the fuck should Iran give it back?
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Old 04-23-2012, 06:20 PM   #92
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I could write a fairly scathing view of how I think the first term for Obama has gone...but I don't see the use. It all comes down to one thing; fiscal policy.

We have to get the deficit and debt under control for the benefit of not only U.S. citizens but the world economy.

The alternative to Obama believes we can run the American Government on 18% federal revenues relative to GDP. Proven across a twenty year span, 100% fact based numbers and math, to create deficits. Even with Republican control of everything. As long we only have two choices, that alone is reason enough to vote for Obama. Period.
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Old 04-23-2012, 07:12 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by Diemen View Post
Yes, a president is judged on foreign policy. Take a look at where the presumptive Republican nominee stands on foreign policy and then ask yourself if that would really be an improvement. And if we're going to compare losing a drone to Abu Ghraib, well, I'd rather lose 10 drones then have another Abu Ghraib incident.
Diemen, i used Abu Ghraib as an example, because we all know very well the public reaction to that one. Bush (who is not currently the GOP nominee) was certainly held accountable for that one, so im curious why losing a secret drone doesn't make the current Potus accountable? Actually, you don't have to answer that one...

Or the Secret Service Scandal with the Colombian Prostitutes
Or the GSA scandal
Or SSG Bales killing spree this year in Afghanistan
Or Maj Hassan's killing spree at Ft Hood in 2009
Or troops urinating on dead Afghans
Or the Fast & Furious Scandal
Or Solyndra Scandal

No need to answer for any of the above, Obama's not accountable for any of this right? Must be Bush's fault too


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Wait, what? They lose a helicopter (which they destroyed before leaving) while executing an extremely high-risk stealth operation that ended in the successful capture and killing of Public Enemy #1, and you're busting Obama's balls for the chopper?
I've said on here before, and i will say it again, hats off to Obama for killing Bin Laden.

It is understandable, under the consequences, that a helicopter was lost. I realize you were never in the military and probably do not realize how important it is not to leave something that sensitive behind, but believe me it is. (I can personally remember where our entire unit had a massive search lasting for hours to find a missing gas mask) It happened once...and then we have the drone missing...now this is bad.

And btw, they didn't completely destroy the helicopter as you can see from this picture:



And then we have these allegations, which i don't personally believe but will leave up to the reader to decide what to make of it:

If even some of this is true Obama is so much more dangerous than we thought � � Coach is RightCoach is Right

Quote:
If even some of this is true Obama is so much more dangerous than we thought

By Coach Collins, on April 23rd, 2012


By George Spelvin, staff writer

Years of living dangerously off of the U.S. taxpayers’ dime have certainly served the Obama-Dunham family well according to investigative journalist Wayne Madsen. Nevertheless, the downside for America is the Islamazation of Africa and Asia in a remarkable example of unintended consequences of foreign entanglements gone bad- very bad, indeed.

A Wayne Madsen 32 page pdf file is opening up a Pandora’s Box of American foreign aid money dispensed wildly and broadly overseas. The reporter cites American dollars intended to buy starving villagers rice actually going to finance foreign military weapons purchases for various wars, conflicts, and insurgencies. Our tax dollars earned through the hard work and sweat equity have not been used to our benefit but rather to further the Islamazation of these continents which is now almost complete.

The very aims and actions of politicians, faceless bureaucrats, foreign service operatives both covertly and not covertly have come back to bite America at a time when our own citizens are suffering through economic trouble. The investigative reporter’s dogged pursuit of the Obama-Dunham family odyssey in places from Jakarta to Jalalabad, and from the Ford Foundation to the Oval Office makes for fascinating reading: But how to verify it?

Rumors abound that Madsen has grown so fearful for his life that he has broken up with a long time companion and left the country. A noted author and syndicated columnist; Madsen’s reports have been widely circulated. He is the author of “Genocide and Covert Operations in Africa” and “Jaded Tasks: Big Oil, Black Ops & Brass Plates.”

A picture of Stanley Ann Dunham “visiting a Balinese duck farm officially as part of her work to secure bank loans for small businesses” is included in the five part report of international intrigue and American dollars. Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner’s father Peter Geithner acted as the Ford Foundation’s grant selector for projects in Indonesia, and President Obama’s mother worked for or with him as Madsen reports.

The report’s dizzying array of abbreviations, acronyms, NGO’s and many other groups obfuscate duties, dollars and destinies.

What a labyrinth to wade through! Lost sight of in all of this overseas stewpot are the unsuspecting U.S. citizens who pay for everything. But where is Madsen now? Is all of what he says true? He filed communiqués from the Obama Korean summit recently, that much we know, but is he safe?

What really is apropos here is the admonishment of George Washington who warned America in his Farewell Address delivered to our new nation on 17 September 1796. Washington said, “Against the insidious wiles of foreign influence the jealousy of free people ought to be constantly awake since history and experience prove that foreign influence is one of the most baneful foes of a republican government.”

Could any of our politicians look into the eyes of America’s founder and say they have followed his advice when it comes to foreign aid? Mightily served by our founding fathers, America has been miserably served by her politicians!

To contact your Congressional Representative use this link: Contacting the Congress: A Citizen's Congressional Directory

To read more about this story use these links:

http://exopolitics.blogs.com/files/w...he-company.pdf

"George Washington's Farewell Address">
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Old 04-23-2012, 07:14 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by Earnie Shavers View Post
Why the fuck should Iran give it back?
If you are talking to me, please do not use this type of language towards me.
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Old 04-23-2012, 07:22 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by Mrs. Garrison View Post
Diemen, i used Abu Ghraib as an example, because we all know very well the public reaction to that one. Bush (who is not currently the GOP nominee) was certainly held accountable for that one,

who in the Bush administration went to jail over this?
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Old 04-23-2012, 07:27 PM   #96
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Given how spectacularly their last missile launch failed, I'd go with the sabre rattling.
I hope so, but technically the country is still at war / cease fire

And North Korea has a history of aggressive behaviour to include artillery they launched at Yeonpyeong island back in Nov 2010. There are also fence-line shootings between the north and south that occur along the DMZ quite often...yet we never hear about them.

Spies defecting, assassinations, subs running ashore with a crew dead by execution...all spooky stuff that doesn't make the 5 o'clock news.

and during a full scale war, they were pretty brutal:

Quote:
Total civilians killed/wounded: 2.5 million (est.)[2]
South Korea: 990,968
373,599 killed[2]
229,625 wounded[2]
387,744 abducted/missing[2]
North Korea: 1,550,000 (est.)[2]
Their army:

Quote:
North Korea is the most militarized country in the world today,[6] having the fourth largest army in the world, at about 1,106,000 armed personnel, with about 20% of men ages 17–54 in the regular armed forces.[7] Military service of up to 10 years is mandatory for most males. It also has a reserve force comprising 7,700,000 personnel.[8] It operates an enormous network of military facilities scattered around the country, a large weapons production basis, a dense air defense system,[9] the third largest chemical weapons stockpile in the world,[10] and includes the world's largest Special Forces contingent (numbering 180,000 men).[11] While the aging equipment,[12] deriving from the economic plight of the country, is seen as major defect of the North Korean military capability, it is nevertheless regarded as a significant threat due to its size and proximity to major civilian areas.
The terrain is mountainous, rugged, and very hot and humid in the summers with a monsoon season and also very very cold in the winters. There is NO good time to fight a war on this peninsula. It is estimated that the tens of thousands of US troops stationed between the DMZ and Seoul (2ID) would be nothing more than "speed bumps" in the wake of an all out invasion...and that North Korea has the potential to pummel Seoul with its long range artillery.

So yeah, their rockets might not work very well, but their million + man army fighting in the trenches along with the heavy artillery is enough to inflict massive casualties. Not good.
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Old 04-23-2012, 07:28 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by Mrs. Garrison View Post
And then we have these allegations, which i don't personally believe but will leave up to the reader to decide what to make of it:

If even some of this is true Obama is so much more dangerous than we thought � � Coach is RightCoach is Right



this is insane and irresponsible, and you're "i report, you decide" "gawsh, i'm just a guy askin' questions" disclaimer doesn't change the fact that this is even farther out there than Birther territory. why don't you start posting the articles that claim that Obama is a trained KGB operative? that's at least more entertaining.
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Old 04-23-2012, 07:29 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by Mrs. Garrison View Post
Diemen, i used Abu Ghraib as an example, because we all know very well the public reaction to that one. Bush (who is not currently the GOP nominee) was certainly held accountable for that one, so im curious why losing a secret drone doesn't make the current Potus accountable? Actually, you don't have to answer that one...

Or the Secret Service Scandal with the Colombian Prostitutes
Or the GSA scandal
Or SSG Bales killing spree this year in Afghanistan
Or Maj Hassan's killing spree at Ft Hood in 2009
Or troops urinating on dead Afghans
Or the Fast & Furious Scandal
Or Solyndra Scandal
You've turned into a Hannity wannabe throwing shit and hoping some of it sticks. You haven't engaged one person in here trying to speak to the specifics of any of these, or why one event is different from another.
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Old 04-23-2012, 07:41 PM   #99
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Blaming the Bush Administration for Abu Ghraib seems silly to me; no one really knows how far that went up the chain of command.

Blaming Bush for pro-cyclical fiscal policy that helped to manufacture the recession? Probably partially true. The 2002 tax cuts were probably a pretty bad idea. The Fed's loose monetary policy in the early 2000s were also probably a bad idea, although they did start raising interest rates eventually. That's not directly Bush's fault, but he did appoint Alan Greenspan (just like Reagen, Bush 41, and Clinton). An out-of-control financial sector and a public that proved itself less than financially competent were major problems too. The latter can't really be regulated. The former can, and lack of regulation can be blamed on the Bush Administration and Republicans, but it can also be blamed on Democrats for not making any effort to change anything.

I still wrestle with the problem of stimulus. The Keynesian in me (generally the overwhelming force) says that, without that stimulus, we probably would have seen a much deeper recession and probably significantly worse deficit-to-GDP ratios in the long term. The Keynesian in me also says that, without stricter regulation and active monetary and fiscal policy to cool the economy whenever it starts booming again, this will all be for naught and the next recession will be deeper than this one and more money will be spent in recovery... and that is unsustainable. And maybe it is politically impossible for the United States to cool its economy while it grows; maybe that's just an inherent flaw in Keynesianism, that Keynesianism cannot ever actually be truly implemented, because of how politically tough it is for a democracy to attempt to cool its economy when it is booming. Another boom-recession cycle like this one would probably damage Keynesianism in my eyes, because Keynesian recessionary policy does not account for the potential impossibility of Keynesian boom-time policy. I am not totally sure. But without the stimulus spending of the Obama Administration (and the late Bush Administration, and their respective Congresses), I do fear that the US economy could be in a significantly worse position with worse long-term deficit prospects, in terms of potential to raise revenue.
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Old 04-23-2012, 07:46 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by Mrs. Garrison View Post
And btw, they didn't completely destroy the helicopter as you can see from this picture:

Is it your claim then that the troops involved in the Bin Laden raid were incompetent?

That's certainly a surprising take.
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Old 04-23-2012, 08:05 PM   #101
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Well, maybe if no one makes eye contact or responds to Mrs. Garrison, she'll eventually get tuckered out and wander back to her nearest local newspaper website comment thread to yammer into the abyss.

Or not. But she's basically just spitting out random codewords at this point.

Anyway, Social Security! It's in the news again, with reports that the "trust fund" will run out at an even earlier projected date. But don't worry! A really key, critical thing everyone should understand:

Social Security checks are scheduled to increase in real terms over the next several decades. After the trust fund "expires" in 2033, if nothing changes, there would still be enough income to give retirees 70-80% of scheduled benefits, which would still represent an increase over present benefits.

That represents the "crisis". Lower, higher future benefits. If we do nothing, people's benefits will be cut....which means, according to sensible pundits, we must cut people's benefits today in order to avoid that fate!
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Old 04-23-2012, 08:47 PM   #102
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Yes, recession only describes when an economy is shrinking. The economy stopped shrinking in 09 but the depth of the recession was such that it will take years to return to pre-recession employment levels, if ever.
Maybe the road back to robust economic growth isn't Cash For Clunkers, a 2,000 page healthcare law, expanded food stamps rolls, petrophobia, and raising the capital gains tax on millionaires to pay for "targeted investments" while completely ignoring entitlement reform.
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Old 04-23-2012, 09:13 PM   #103
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NBC Politics - Social Security trustees see earlier fund depletion date

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Social Security trustees see earlier fund depletion date

The trustees of the Social Security system said Monday the fund that helps sustain retiree and survivors’ benefits will become exhausted in 2033, three years sooner than they projected last year.

In their annual report, the trustees also estimated that Social Security’s Disability Insurance fund will be exhausted in 2016, two years sooner than last year’s estimate. Congress will need to take action to avert that outcome, with the most likely remedy being a reallocation of the payroll tax between the part of the tax that supports Social Security’s retirement and survivors’ benefits and the part of the tax that pays for disability benefits.

The Social Security system does have assets in the form of $2.7 trillion in Treasury bonds -- but those assets must be redeemed – cashed in – in order to pay benefits.

“The redemption of those bonds can only occur out of current income,” explained Senate Budget Committee chairman Kent Conrad last year. “The general fund has been borrowing from Social Security and we've borrowed well over $2 trillion,” he said. “That money has got to be paid back. How's it going to be paid back? It's going to be paid back by the other general expenditures of the federal government having to be reduced to make way for the payments that we're going to have to make on those bonds.”Separately, the trustees, who are also the trustees of the Medicare program, reported that the Medicare fund that pays hospital costs for older and disabled Americans will be exhausted by 2024, the same forecast as they made last year.

House Democratic leader Nancy Pelosi said, “Despite the repeated efforts of Republicans to privatize Social Security and end the Medicare guarantee, these vital initiatives remain strong. Today’s Trustees’ report affirms that Social Security and Medicare will continue to provide critical benefits to seniors and other Americans.”
Nancy says these programs "remain strong" and the president's plan to reform entitlements is to demonize anyone that attempts it.

Leadership
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Old 04-23-2012, 09:23 PM   #104
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Nancy says these programs "remain strong" and the president's plan to reform entitlements is to demonize anyone that attempts it.

Leadership
Who out there is actually trying to reform these programs? I just see people cutting without tackling the real issues. Guess what that does long term...

Cut and run will cause major long term issues. Where will these people go?
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Old 04-23-2012, 09:57 PM   #105
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Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to pick options to fill the 1.4% of GDP that the Social Security deficit will be by 2040.

It should be pretty clear that relatively minor changes will preserve the program. Taxing all income above the $100,000 existing cap, while still capping benefits to that level removes an enormous amount of the shortfall (.9!). Raise the payroll tax rate by 1% and we're suddenly home free.
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