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Old 04-23-2012, 02:39 PM   #76
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Michael Savage takes credit for being the first to draw attention to this drone story, and he's the one that started making this an Obama issue. Although he takes it a step further and says it was given to them by spies that Obama planted in the White House. What this story is leaving out is that even if they really have this drone(and in working condition) and actually have the ability to replicate its technology(both pretty big ifs) they dont have the software or the OS designed to control it.
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Old 04-23-2012, 02:44 PM   #77
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Yeah, be it Obama or Romney or whomever, nobody is going to be able to clean this mess up in a few short years. The Bush administration left us with a long-term mess we have to clean up in all sorts of areas. Ten years from now we'll probably still be cleaning up the mess from 2000-2008 in some form or another, unless a serious miracle occurs.

Obama deserves criticism for the areas where he's failed to change what Bush has done, where he hasn't worked harder, and so forth. Absolutely. He's not free from blame here, either.

But anyone expecting this to be fixed in the short term, Obama included, was being very optimistic, which is certainly nice-a positive attitude should be a good motivator to get people at least starting to take care of things. However, they were also very, very naive.
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Old 04-23-2012, 02:57 PM   #78
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also, as for housing prices, let's all remember that housing from 2003-2007 or so was HUGELY inflated due to a bubble. remember that bubble? i do.
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Old 04-23-2012, 03:29 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by BoMac

I ask you, as a rational person, what opposition politician runs on a platform of "Let's Have More of the Same!" Every campaign operates under some form of "hope & change" narrative.

And I don't think any politician promises to fix everything. If voters thought Obama was going to do that, it's their fault for projecting impossible expectations on him. On election night, he also tried to dampen those expectations by cautioning people that change wouldn't happen in one term, but two.

We'll see what happens.
exactly. there's only so much he can do if the senate is going to act how they've acted, and it's unrealistic to expect someone to undo something that took eight years in just about half that.
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Old 04-23-2012, 03:34 PM   #80
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don't worry, i'll still continue to blame Bush and the Republican congress. the reason we have $5T in debt is because we have a revenue problem, not a spending problem, thanks to the Bush tax cuts. of course, his endless wars and prescription drug handout didn't help things. it shocks me to see people blame Obama for Bush's debt.
yep. each president inherits the good and bad of the one before him, so it's a bit much to expect change and a complete reversal overnight.

and for anyone who says he's been president long enough now, see my previous post. if he gets reelected and in 2016 things are still total shit and never got better? then fine. but until then it's not a fair comparison.
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Old 04-23-2012, 03:43 PM   #81
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and given that Bush inherited a SURPLUS ...
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Old 04-23-2012, 03:52 PM   #82
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say what you want
but he made short work of that surplus, (quite an accomplishment for those that want less government)
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Old 04-23-2012, 04:20 PM   #83
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You know of all the truly stupid criticisms of Obama (and there are fair ones, which I've pointed out here, like the ACA being a crappy piece of legislation open to constitutional challenge, like Geithner not being fired, etc), the gas prices has got to be one of the stupidest.

Since when do prices of oil per barrel fall under the control of the US president?? I mean did we all wake up and suddenly OPEC disappeared? Strife in the middle east no longer existed and impacted gas prices? Demand in the developing world vanished?

Just too stupid for words, honestly.
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Old 04-23-2012, 05:15 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by Earnie Shavers View Post
Why? I have no idea how the President would be at fault? Does he fly the things? Also, you could argue that his influence in relation to this was a positive. Obama is known as Drone Fan # 1. You could argue its situations like this that highlight their value. Shit like this happens from time to time, but now, there's not the added issue of a US pilot or two in a prison in Tehran. So, thumbs up?
No need to get testy with me, im a big fan of drones myself since we began deploying them in action back in 2001.

However....and yes stuff does happen....a president is judged not only on the economy but also foreign policy. As Commander in Chief of the military you are responsible for what goes down on your watch, Good Or Bad. Remember Abu Ghraib?

So yeah, we need to have this discussion. They have in their possession one of our top secret stealth drone aircrafts...they are flaunting this and they apparently have no intention on giving it back.....that's kind of a big deal. Second time this administration has lost something like this...thinking of the helicopter in the Pakistan raid.
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Old 04-23-2012, 05:18 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by Moonlit_Angel View Post
Yeah, be it Obama or Romney or whomever, nobody is going to be able to clean this mess up in a few short years. The Bush administration left us with a long-term mess we have to clean up in all sorts of areas. Ten years from now we'll probably still be cleaning up the mess from 2000-2008 in some form or another, unless a serious miracle occurs.

Obama deserves criticism for the areas where he's failed to change what Bush has done, where he hasn't worked harder, and so forth. Absolutely. He's not free from blame here, either.

But anyone expecting this to be fixed in the short term, Obama included, was being very optimistic, which is certainly nice-a positive attitude should be a good motivator to get people at least starting to take care of things. However, they were also very, very naive.
So Bush owns 2000 - 2008 yet somehow Obama is not accountable for 2009 - present?

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Old 04-23-2012, 05:25 PM   #86
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And this can't be good!



Quote:
..

North Korea issues unusually specific threat


North Korea's military vowed a new and unusually specific threat to its neighbors, saying it would reduce South Korea "to ashes" in less than four minutes.

The statement, released Monday when programming was interrupted on North Korea's state TV by a special report, comes amid rising tensions on the Korean peninsula.

Earlier this month, North Korea was unsuccessful in a long-range missile launch, prompting worries that North Korea may conduct another nuclear test. South Korean officials say new satellite images show that North Korea has been digging a tunnel in what appears to be preparation for a third atomic test.

According to the Associated Press, the statement from North Korea was unusual in promising something soon and in describing a specific period of time.

The North Korean military threatened to "reduce all the rat-like groups and the bases for provocations to ashes in three or four minutes, (or) in much shorter time, by unprecedented peculiar means and methods of our own style."

For months the North has castigated South Korean President Lee Myung-bak and the conservative administration for insulting their leadership and criticizing a new cruise missile capable of striking anywhere in the south.

South Korean officials responded, urging North Korea to end the threats. "We urge North Korea to immediately stop this practice," Unification Ministry spokesman Kim Hyung-suk said, according to the Associated Press. "We express deep concern that the North's threats and accusations have worsened inter-Korean ties and heightened tensions."

Meanwhile, in a meeting Sunday with a North Korean delegation in Beijing, China's senior official on foreign policy praised the leadership shown by North Korea's new young leader, Kim Jong Un.

The meeting follows the April 13 launch of what the United States called a disguised ballistic missile test by North Korea. The rocket disintegrated minutes after launch.

-- With reporting by Ron Recinto
North Korea issues unusually specific threat | The Envoy - Yahoo! News

Ive posted before in another thread about my experiences in South Korea, and how much they had grown even from 1992 - 1997 when i returned. I seriously hope this is just more of the same old sabre rattling from the North, hoping to get some food aid or something like that. If they ever did launch something it would be utterly devastating and a complete disaster for the entire region...and i suspect we would be right smack dab in the middle of it all.

So much shit goes on over there that we don't hear about...so something like this is specifically alarming.

Lets hope people come to their senses...
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Old 04-23-2012, 05:30 PM   #87
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Originally Posted by Mrs. Garrison View Post
No need to get testy with me, im a big fan of drones myself since we began deploying them in action back in 2001.

However....and yes stuff does happen....a president is judged not only on the economy but also foreign policy. As Commander in Chief of the military you are responsible for what goes down on your watch, Good Or Bad. Remember Abu Ghraib?
Yes, a president is judged on foreign policy. Take a look at where the presumptive Republican nominee stands on foreign policy and then ask yourself if that would really be an improvement. And if we're going to compare losing a drone to Abu Ghraib, well, I'd rather lose 10 drones then have another Abu Ghraib incident.

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Second time this administration has lost something like this...thinking of the helicopter in the Pakistan raid.
Wait, what? They lose a helicopter (which they destroyed before leaving) while executing an extremely high-risk stealth operation that ended in the successful capture and killing of Public Enemy #1, and you're busting Obama's balls for the chopper?
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Old 04-23-2012, 05:31 PM   #88
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And this can't be good!





North Korea issues unusually specific threat | The Envoy - Yahoo! News

Ive posted before in another thread about my experiences in South Korea, and how much they had grown even from 1992 - 1997 when i returned. I seriously hope this is just more of the same old sabre rattling from the North, hoping to get some food aid or something like that.
Given how spectacularly their last missile launch failed, I'd go with the sabre rattling.
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Old 04-23-2012, 05:38 PM   #89
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Second time this administration has lost something like this...thinking of the helicopter in the Pakistan raid.
It's like we're reaching new levels of ridiculousness.

Did the crew of that helicopter not DESTROY it after it was damaged in a "hard landing"? Can you imagine if this kind of criticism was leveled against Bush? We'd all be accused of being terrorist-sympathizing haters of the troops.
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Old 04-23-2012, 05:43 PM   #90
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As Commander in Chief of the military you are responsible for what goes down on your watch, Good Or Bad. Remember Abu Ghraib?
Abu Ghraib, the discussion was about how far up the chain of command were these orders made and allowed to happen?

Losing a drone comes down to a technical defect(Obama didn't design the drone) and/ or a faulty pilot. From what I've read, it was both.

So how are these the same?
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