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Old 08-10-2009, 05:48 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post

how Nancy Pelosi makes the baby Jesus cry
What do you mean by this? Please explain, because I've seen nobody bring up Jesus in this discussion...

I've seen you do this a number of times- bringing up Jesus and then making wisecrack remarks. Do you do that in your daily life? Because I think it's quite telling of someone to out of the blue bring up Christianity when they're frustrated in a back-and-forth discussion and make unnecessary comments about it...

"He was out at second base!"

"No way, he was safe!"

"Oh yeah?! Well... well.... Christianity is stupid! I'm out of here!"

Uncalled for, don't you think, Irvine?
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Old 08-10-2009, 05:55 PM   #47
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Bush was democratically elected, though. So I take it once the 2012 campaign starts, you're fine with the GOP campaigning to "take the country back" from the Democrats? Glad to know you're ok with that.



Wrong. I can't believe people still say this. If you honestly Bush was the worst in history, please take an American history course. Please. I beg you.



No. No, he really isn't. Even if he was, good God he hasn't shown it during the past 2 years. I don't know why people go around saying this all the time when I've seen nothing to validate it. Why do you say he's "extraordinarily intelligent? I'm curious.
Ok yes, once the campaign starts I am fine with the GOP saying "Take the country back for us" - that is the nature of campaigning. What the people at the town halls are saying are the nature of revolutions. Huge difference.

and yes, W was the worst president because never have civil liberties, foreign respect, American standing, domestic issues ever been worse than under the past 8 years. I could go on about this but Id rather not.

Ok, He really is. The guy is brilliant. and what do you mean he hasnt showed it??? he won the campaign with brilliant strategies, he won the debates- you ask him a question, he has so much info at his fingertips... and how do I know this? well I worked on Obama's campaign. I have been on his plane and have had a face to face conversation with Obama. The guy blew me away with his intellect. If you also had a face to face conversation with Obama and talked with him for about 30 minutes, you would realize that he was one of the smartest people you have ever met. That is what happened to me. So yes, I know from personal experience. But really, even Limbaugh admits Obama is smart- you may disagree with him- but he is smart.
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Old 08-10-2009, 05:55 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by 2861U2 View Post

No. No, he really isn't. Even if he was, good God he hasn't shown it during the past 2 years. I don't know why people go around saying this all the time when I've seen nothing to validate it. Why do you say he's "extraordinarily intelligent? I'm curious.
How do you judge intelligence? What makes a man/ woman intelligent in your eyes?
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Old 08-10-2009, 06:00 PM   #49
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INDY: "Taking back America" was clearly meant as a campaign to take back the country from the repbulicans in the next election. It is 100% different than saying "I WANT MY COUNTRY BACK" and crying after a president has already been democratically elected. Obama was fairly elected and it is nonsense to believe that the country is going to become socialist.


is right.

April 29 (Bloomberg) -- President Barack Obama marked his 100th day in office by telling Americans that “we’ve begun the work of remaking America.”

Quote:
Bush was the worst president in American history. I cant believe anyone still respects him? I dont care what you think of Obama, but at least Obama is extraordinarily intelligent. Can you say the same for W?
Bush was... what's the word again BVS? Oh yeah. Unknowing.
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Old 08-10-2009, 06:06 PM   #50
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Bush was profoundly lacking in intellectual curiosity.

I believe wholeheartedly that Sarah Palin, on the other hand, is a profoundly stupid woman.
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Old 08-10-2009, 06:08 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by 2861U2 View Post
What do you mean by this? Please explain, because I've seen nobody bring up Jesus in this discussion...

I've seen you do this a number of times- bringing up Jesus and then making wisecrack remarks. Do you do that in your daily life? Because I think it's quite telling of someone to out of the blue bring up Christianity when they're frustrated in a back-and-forth discussion and make unnecessary comments about it...

"He was out at second base!"

"No way, he was safe!"

"Oh yeah?! Well... well.... Christianity is stupid! I'm out of here!"

Uncalled for, don't you think, Irvine?


oh good god. grow up.

you have yet to put forth A SINGLE ARGUMENT ON A SINGLE ISSUE.

all you do is complain about Pelosi/Reid and how they say things that are upsetting to you and you're continuously "outraged" and demanding "apologies" for this slight and that slight.
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Old 08-10-2009, 06:11 PM   #52
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is right.

April 29 (Bloomberg) -- President Barack Obama marked his 100th day in office by telling Americans that “we’ve begun the work of remaking America.”



Bush was... what's the word again BVS? Oh yeah. Unknowing.



who has that animated picture of the stick people running around screaming "OH NOES" -- because that's what you do at the word "socialism."

there are many, many countries in the world who have socialist aspects of their government and they're doing just fine. in fact, they do many things better than we do. as you've said yourself, here in the US we do not deny anyone emergency coverage, and guess what INDY, THAT'S SOCIALISM!!! THE GOVERNMENT IS PAYING FOR SOMEONE AND WE'RE PICKING UP THE CHECK!!! SHOCK!!! HORROR!!! BETTER DEAD THAN RED!!!
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Old 08-10-2009, 06:14 PM   #53
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Some questions for Republicans:

What is your ideal vision of what this country should be? Does it include health care for all? Does it include environmental regulations so companies dont contribute to the real threat of global warming? does it include a better education system? Does it include the right for people who love each other to marry? Does it include a tax code that helps everyone and not just the wealthy few? Does it include a sensible foreign policy that is based on logic and common sense rather than emotions and impulses?

so far... I have not seen any of the above nor "Small government" from conservatives. This fear of government, as government is always evil and cannot coincide with freedom is flawed logic. I believe in a free market and small government, but I am not afraid of a system that provides health care for all.

Why are you so afraid? Does it go against your principles... or does it go against your logic? Please, tell me, I do not understand.
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Old 08-10-2009, 06:15 PM   #54
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We have always been a mixture of capitalism and socialism. Medicare, the postal service, the emergency room for people who cannot afford it, etc... are all socialistic things.

We are NOT all socialists now. and Obama is not a socialist.

What obama is doing now is called "cleaning up the mess made by republicans and creating a new foundation for prosperity and humanity"

btw, most people shouting about socialism dont even know what it means!
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Old 08-10-2009, 06:25 PM   #55
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btw, most people shouting about socialism dont even know what it means!


this is exactly right.
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Old 08-10-2009, 06:57 PM   #56
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btw, most people shouting about socialism dont even know what it means!
It is my suspicion that many people confuse "socialism" with "communism", thus the fear that word generates.
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Old 08-10-2009, 07:17 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by zooropop40 View Post
Some questions for Republicans:

What is your ideal vision of what this country should be? Does it include health care for all? Does it include environmental regulations so companies dont contribute to the real threat of global warming? does it include a better education system? Does it include the right for people who love each other to marry? Does it include a tax code that helps everyone and not just the wealthy few? Does it include a sensible foreign policy that is based on logic and common sense rather than emotions and impulses?

so far... I have not seen any of the above nor "Small government" from conservatives. This fear of government, as government is always evil and cannot coincide with freedom is flawed logic. I believe in a free market and small government, but I am not afraid of a system that provides health care for all.

Why are you so afraid? Does it go against your principles... or does it go against your logic? Please, tell me, I do not understand.


If you're really curious.
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Old 08-10-2009, 07:18 PM   #58
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It is my suspicion that many people confuse "socialism" with "communism", thus the fear that word generates.
Exactly! Democratic Socialism is not inherently evil. It works great in Europe... I dont personally believe in it, nor would I think it would work in the USA but I dont believe it is evil. There is a HUGE difference between socialism and communism. I think people need to go back to their text books.... another reason we need a better education system in this country
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Old 08-10-2009, 07:18 PM   #59
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If you're really curious.
I have read that book. Really.

This is a blog post I wrote on a political blog:


Ive been reading a lot of conservative books lately and one that really stood out for me was
"Liberty and Tyranny" by Mark Levin

This book is a perfect example as to the way many conservatives think. It has been often said that conservatives see the world in Black and White and Liberals see the world in many shades of gray. This is extremely true, and is clearly seen through this book. Almost everything seen through the eyes of Mark Levin (and many other conservatives) are:

Good vs. Evil
Morality vs. Immorality
Liberty vs. Tyranny
Victory vs. Surrender
With us or Against us
etc...

In other words, in the eyes of many conservatives, there is NO middle ground (as stated recently by Dick Cheney)

The war on terror under Bush/Cheney also had an "us vs. them" mentality. Bush once stated that you are "either with us or with the terrorists" ... obviously this is not true. There are many people in other countries who do not respect the U.S. for its choices but would never support the terrorists. These people would end up in the "middle ground" or in the gray area (the area not seen by conservatives).

Even Bush believed he was on a religious crusade against evil and he thought he was acting as "good." The world is not as simple as just 2 sides. There are many facets, views, perspectives, and opinions. There is more than "I am right and you are wrong."

Unfortunately, I do not think Mark Levin sees the world or society in this way. He instead believes that if you are not successful you must be "lazy" and that if you do not believe in torture, you must agree with the terrorists. I recommend this book to anyone who wants to better understand the perspective of many conservatives
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Old 08-10-2009, 07:24 PM   #60
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I have read that book. Really.

I recommend this book to anyone who wants to better understand the perspective of many conservatives
Oh see, we ended the day agreeing on something.
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