Neo-Nazi protest and riots in Ohio

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To take here the story of Kanye West now and implying such dreary gratuitous insinuations is very sad, poor, unfair, sly and really really less intelligent. In that thread I just gave my opinion about the fact that I don´t like that kind of genre to mix it with a rock band. Where´s the problem? Then you come with such improbable and weak discussions about cultural differences between America and Europe. Do you really know what culture is?It is easy to get aggregate against one when his opinion is different as the mass one. You find it funny, you feel stronger, isn´t it? Is this what closes the circle of all your well thoughts? I lived for many years in Germany, I got troubled personnaly with some nazis, unfortunately....., I was walking with a friend of mine, speaking in our language, we got into them without knowing how, we had just turned the corner, and we got hit..............I had a very bad period.........and I was trying to avoid to talk about this, but I feel it´s kinda too much now..........
But that doesn´t imply I hate Germany, I love that country because I was born there. Being ready to give anyone immediately a bull without knowing anything about him isn´t honourable at all. How do you call this, latent prejudice, latent hypocrisy? This is the kind of people I don´t want to associate, frankly................... Sometimes, before starting to think and to appear like the most impeccable thinker, make a deep conscience examination. Nice people, really.
 
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financeguy said:


Agreed. It's usually dressed up with 'I'm not racist, I just hate rap music, I have a right to my opinion', etc. Some of those Kanye West threads discourage me from even wanting to associate with some U2 fans, frankly. It must really get to some of those people that Bono actually likes black music.

Hehe...I love his music....hate his bizzare take on polics and aids.
 
Irvine511 said:
heck, i see tons of latent racism in interference, specifically regarding Kanye West as an opener for U2.

(not his politics, i'm talking about music).

I missed those threads. Is it latent racism to not like an African American artist?

I think it is equally destructive to say those who do not like rap are racist.
 
nbcrusader said:


I missed those threads. Is it latent racism to not like an African American artist?

I think it is equally destructive to say those who do not like rap are racist.


go through and read some of the threads -- they are much more concerned with not liking Kanye personally, with saying all rappers are assholes, all rap music sucks, all rappers are talentless, etc.

also, Kanye isn't rap, really; he's hip-hop.

and, while i don't know that we could call this racist, i do think it's silly to proclaim that you don't like a particular genre of music. listen more carefully -- there's beauty to be found in all kinds of music, including rap, R&B, country, opera, classical, etc.

i'll give you one example -- my dad proclaimed Eminem talentless and was actually angry that "8 Mile" was actually a pretty good movie. he thinks Eminem is an awful influence, etc., you know, typical white suburban parents concerns.

and fair enough. i wouldn't want my 11 year old listening to some of his albums. despite the fact that by the time Eminem was huge, the youngest in my family was 16.

anyway, i forced him to sit down and listen to "Lose Yourself," especially the final verse which, to my mind, is kind of breathtaking, and he was able to admit that, while he thought Eminem wasn't fit to change his oil, the boy could rap.
 
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Thanks for the summation of the threads.

And I agree that you can find enjoyable music in all genres if you are willing to listen closely.
 
nbcrusader said:


I missed those threads. Is it latent racism to not like an African American artist?



also, this sentence bothers me.

there's a rhetorical flourish to the question that implies the nonexistence of latent racism. it's kind of like when someone says that global warming is bad, and that they like U2, and then someone says that if you really cared about global warming then you shouldn't buy U2 albums because the band arrives at concerts in SUVs or rides around in a Leer Jet. it's these false choices, the inability to see shades of gray, the fact that while there might be racism embedded in attitudes or notions or language that does not mean that the purveyor of said attitudes or notions or language is by definition a racist. it's that there is racism embedded in all walks of life in all fabrics of society.
 
nbcrusader said:


I missed those threads. Is it latent racism to not like an African American artist?

I think it is equally destructive to say those who do not like rap are racist.

No, I think it's some of the reasoning people gave as to why they don't like the genre that smacks of latent racism.
 
Irvine511 said:
also, this sentence bothers me.

there's a rhetorical flourish to the question that implies the nonexistence of latent racism. it's kind of like when someone says that global warming is bad, and that they like U2, and then someone says that if you really cared about global warming then you shouldn't buy U2 albums because the band arrives at concerts in SUVs or rides around in a Leer Jet. it's these false choices, the inability to see shades of gray, the fact that while there might be racism embedded in attitudes or notions or language that does not mean that the purveyor of said attitudes or notions or language is by definition a racist. it's that there is racism embedded in all walks of life in all fabrics of society.

So, Bono can have his SUV, but I can't have mine :angry: :wink:



The problem with the "shades of gray" argument is that the charge of latent racism becomes more vocal when it can achieve a political end.

I wouldn't dismiss the notion of latent racism, but the uneven use of the concept is often driven by political expediency, not to achieve racial harmony.
 
nbcrusader said:
The problem with the "shades of gray" argument is that the charge of latent racism becomes more vocal when it can achieve a political end.

I wouldn't dismiss the notion of latent racism, but the uneven use of the concept is often driven by political expediency, not to achieve racial harmony.



yes, well most things can be exploited for political gain; though i would wonder why this is a greater concern for you than for the role that exposing latent racism has in achieving racial "harmony" -- by understanding how the unspoken messages sent by society operate on us and our understanding of people different from ourselves, aren't we moving closer to being able to relate to people as individuals and not as representatives of monolithic cultures?

what does racial "harmony" mean and look like?
 
Irvine511 said:
yes, well most things can be exploited for political gain; though i would wonder why this is a greater concern for you than for the role that exposing latent racism has in achieving racial "harmony" -- by understanding how the unspoken messages sent by society operate on us and our understanding of people different from ourselves, aren't we moving closer to being able to relate to people as individuals and not as representatives of monolithic cultures?

what does racial "harmony" mean and look like?

I guess I used it as somewhat of an ambiguous term. Perhaps we should tie it to the elimination of true latent racism. If that is really a goal or even possible.
 
nbcrusader said:


I guess I used it as somewhat of an ambiguous term. Perhaps we should tie it to the elimination of true latent racism. If that is really a goal or even possible.



i guess i don't think there's an endpoint or a goal, it's simply a process.
 
A process to do what? If the process only increases political power, the inherent result will be to divide (I think we can see that at many levels in our country).
 
nbcrusader said:


I missed those threads. Is it latent racism to not like an African American artist?

I think it is equally destructive to say those who do not like rap are racist.

You don´t like rap?

:sad:

why?

:sad:
 
nbcrusader said:
A process to do what? If the process only increases political power, the inherent result will be to divide (I think we can see that at many levels in our country).


why is your concern only the political?

this is getting way too meta ... basically, a process of understanding how language is embedded with assumptions, much of it racist, sexist, etc.

when i get home, i'll crack open my Cultural Studies reader and explicate.

but then again, i've got tix tonight and tomorrow for the MCI center, so i might not get around to it ...

:hyper:
 
the iron horse said:
"Keith White, a black resident, criticized city officials for initially allowing the march."

I do not agree with the Nazis, but I do believe that all of us should have freedom of speech and the right to protest.

There's a difference between utilising free speech and inciting a riot.

I'm just a fool who still thinks the Bill of Rights is a good idea.

Maybe I'm just a fool who believes there's slightly more to this case than the age-old and very tired debate on free speech vs. censorship.

:shrug: My opinion.

melon said:


Considering I have lived near Toledo most of my life and that I'm working there right now, realize that the Nazis did not march in a Catholic or Jewish neighborhood. In fact, the Nazis did not even go downtown, where crowd control would have been better. They purposely picked a heavily black neighborhood that had a relatively high crime rate.

In other words, the Nazis purposely provoked a bad neighborhood, just so they could sit back and say, "See? Those black gangs really ARE attacking white people." It's really a pity, overall.

Melon

Quite.
 
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nbcrusader said:


I figured someone would make that assumption.

Its wrong.

But then again, this is FYM.

Now, now.. Im tha hiphop so I had to check up on this. Seriously. ;)

See if you like tha hiphop, you´re my buddy-buddy :hug:

DONTCHA DIS ME RAP MUSIC NO MO, BOY :D
 
nbcrusader said:
Have fun - I hope you get into the ellipse :up:



sadly, i have seats tonight -- nosebleed -- and tomorrow -- first tier, which is cool.

i was on the floor for Elevation Paris, so i'll always have that.

i do wish i could get into the ellipse, though.

oh well.
 
whenhiphopdrovethebigcars said:


Now, now.. Im tha hiphop so I had to check up on this. Seriously. ;)

See if you like tha hiphop, you´re my buddy-buddy :hug:

DONTCHA DIS ME RAP MUSIC NO MO, BOY :D

I've got quite a bit of rap (going back to the East Coast - West Coast feud days in the 80's). Plenty of hip hop (which seems like the pop music of rap) and some funk. I'm trying to find some good samples of trip hop as well.
 
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