Nasty Christians who care less about Poverty than they do gay marraige... - Page 3 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 01-04-2005, 02:33 PM   #31
The Fly
 
NotAnEasyThing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia
Posts: 146
Local Time: 12:58 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by icelle
i find the thread title offensive.
Isn't that the point?
__________________

__________________
NotAnEasyThing is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 02:45 PM   #32
The Fly
 
NotAnEasyThing's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Central Coast, NSW, Australia
Posts: 146
Local Time: 12:58 PM
Words are powerful, but words are imprecise. Conservative can mean many things to many people. Evangelical can be reassuring to some and terrifying to others. Rick Warren is described as conservative because he has a christian ethical framework. When you look at what that actually is (without all the cultural baggage) - it's a positive thing. The root of the word 'evangelical' means 'good news'. How sad that it has become equated with a judgemental, arogant, self righteous far right wing agenda that is anything but good news.
__________________

__________________
NotAnEasyThing is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 02:55 PM   #33
New Yorker
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 2,551
Local Time: 06:58 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by cardosino
[B]

I posted this article a few weeks ago, this is more in line with how I think, and many others too.

http://www.usatoday.com/printedition...on_two.art.htm
I can agree with a number of the points Wallis makes. Here's one problem though: Wallis is the editor for Sojourners, which is considered a liberal rag by many conservative Christians because it actually advocates having a balanced perspective as it pertains to one's faith. Right-wingers see only one way: to the right. There is only one truth for the current brand of conservative evangelical, and that is the Bush administration "truth."

Quote:
I'm sorry to see how you stereotype, but it's always the case that the media loves to report on the controversial comments of the Buchanan/Falwell (or maybe Sharpton/Jackson on the other side) rather than what might be the more mundane and positive, but less controversial actions of others.
Remember to throw James Dobson into that Buchanan/Falwell mix, and, from what I've seen and heard, Dobson is considered a strong-valued, rational, fatherly figure to most evangelical Christians --- hell, to conservative people in general. Keep in mind that Dobson has a syndicated program about "family values" that appears here in L.A. on one of the major AM news radio stations (I heard it in the middle of the news hour on KNX, if I remember correctly). This guy is considered level-headed.

You can accuse me of stereotyping. I know many Christians that fall under the umbrella of "conservative evangelicalism" and I have personal experience with that community.
__________________
pub crawler is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 02:59 PM   #34
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 40,692
Local Time: 07:58 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by NotAnEasyThing
How sad that it has become equated with a judgemental, arogant, self righteous far right wing agenda that is anything but good news.
Well to quote Radiohead; "you do it to yourself you do, and that's what really hurts"

Christians have a bad habit about not speaking out against those schmucks that claim to speak for them, maybe it's because they honestly feel the same way as the Faldwells or Robertsons and don't want to admit it or maybe not. But one thing I can say with confidence is that the majority of churches across this nation have their priorities all wrong.
__________________
BVS is online now  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:02 PM   #35
New Yorker
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 2,551
Local Time: 06:58 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by NotAnEasyThing
The root of the word 'evangelical' means 'good news'. How sad that it has become equated with a judgemental, arogant, self righteous far right wing agenda that is anything but good news.
Indeed. But that is how I view the current movement as a whole. Are there exceptions among the laity? Of course. There are plenty of good people attending evangelical churches. But the movement as a whole is making the world a less safe and more unforgiving place in which to live.
__________________
pub crawler is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:12 PM   #36
genius of compression
Forum Moderator
 
neutral's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: forty miles from atlanta, this is nowhere
Posts: 13,030
Local Time: 09:58 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by coemgen
Your father's passing away, neutral? If so, I'm praying for you and your family.
Thanks, he already has actually, this book really meant a lot to him and it was one of the last things we talked about. Yup yup gotta start reading.

I also find the thread title offensive, "sarcastic" or not.
__________________

neutral @ interference.com
neutral is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:13 PM   #37
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 10,881
Local Time: 08:58 PM
Its the people with the loudest voices that get heard in any organization, right or wrong......

Oh, and I am for gay marriage, and the title of this is not on my top ten list.
__________________
Dreadsox is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:15 PM   #38
Blue Crack Addict
 
MrsSpringsteen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 24,984
Local Time: 08:58 PM
I'm for gay marriage too

I guess it's just easier to try to tie all Christians into a neat lil bow
__________________
MrsSpringsteen is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:18 PM   #39
New Yorker
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 2,551
Local Time: 06:58 PM
I'm guessing cardosino was being sarcastic with the thread title. And actually, I'm now thinking the title is entirely appropriate.
__________________
pub crawler is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:20 PM   #40
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 10,881
Local Time: 08:58 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by pub crawler
I'm guessing cardosino was being sarcastic with the thread title. And actually, I'm now thinking the title is entirely appropriate.
most likely because I do not like it...
__________________
Dreadsox is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:21 PM   #41
Blue Crack Addict
 
MrsSpringsteen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 24,984
Local Time: 08:58 PM

um, ok
__________________
MrsSpringsteen is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:24 PM   #42
New Yorker
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 2,551
Local Time: 06:58 PM
Nope, that's not why, Dread.

I think the title is now appropriate because of the way the discussion has headed.


*edited for typo, while still not knowing if my grammar is correct.
__________________
pub crawler is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:33 PM   #43
War Child
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: OC
Posts: 711
Local Time: 01:58 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by pub crawler

I can agree with a number of the points Wallis makes. Here's one problem though: Wallis is the editor for Sojourners, which is considered a liberal rag by many conservative Christians because it actually advocates having a balanced perspective as it pertains to one's faith. Right-wingers see only one way: to the right.

And Left-wingers see only way: to the left ?

Don't be so quick to pigeonhole. I've personally called right wing AND left wing, it's all a matter of perspective. I may hold right-leaning opinions on some matters, and left on others. Most people I know I know are not 100% right-wing or left-wing.

Quote:
Originally posted by pub crawler

Remember to throw James Dobson into that Buchanan/Falwell mix, and, from what I've seen and heard, Dobson is considered a strong-valued, rational, fatherly figure to most evangelical Christians --- hell, to conservative people in general. Keep in mind that Dobson has a syndicated program about "family values" that appears here in L.A. on one of the major AM news radio stations (I heard it in the middle of the news hour on KNX, if I remember correctly). This guy is considered level-headed.
I left him out as he's not as well known, and personally I, and many others, don't need a Dobson tellig me what is/is not appropriate for myself or my kids to watch/listen to, etc.


Quote:
Originally posted by pub crawler

You can accuse me of stereotyping. I know many Christians that fall under the umbrella of "conservative evangelicalism" and I have personal experience with that community.
As do I, my in-laws for example, but I assure you many do not either. I have incredibly heated debates with them, my father-in-law with his "Promise Keepers" (which I sometimes think is a major scam specifically designed to sell t-shirts) and his Dobson/Focus on the family stuff, but many of my fellow members of Saddleback and even within my old congregation of the Catholic and Episcopal Churches (Yes, it was a long and interesting journey before I found what I consider my spiritual home) I've attended are considerably more "tolerant" and liberal than you might think.
__________________
cardosino is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:34 PM   #44
War Child
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: OC
Posts: 711
Local Time: 01:58 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by pub crawler
I'm guessing cardosino was being sarcastic with the thread title

And we have a winner !!!!!!!!!!
__________________
cardosino is offline  
Old 01-04-2005, 03:49 PM   #45
New Yorker
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 2,551
Local Time: 06:58 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by cardosino
[B]

And Left-wingers see only way: to the left ?
Sure, but the problem lies in extremism. The current right wing is extreme without even knowing it. A parallel would be if the left was currently holding power in the White House and was successfully instituting communism as a way of life in the U.S.

Generally, I don't have a problem with conservatives, but that all changed after 9-11 and Bush decided he would wage pre-emptive strikes on any country or people he deemed a "terrorist threat." Like I said, many conservatives in this country drank Bush's koolaid and are falling in line behind him like good soldiers.
Quote:
Don't be so quick to pigeonhole. I've personally called right wing AND left wing, it's all a matter of perspective. I may hold right-leaning opinions on some matters, and left on others. Most people I know I know are not 100% right-wing or left-wing.



...personally I, and many others, don't need a Dobson tellig me what is/is not appropriate for myself or my kids to watch/listen to, etc.
I'm not arguing with you. I wrote that you do not come across as the typical conservative evangelical. I don't think you're typical at all. I actually agree with a lot of what you've written.



Quote:
As do I, my in-laws for example, but I assure you many do not either. I have incredibly heated debates with them, my father-in-law with his "Promise Keepers" (which I sometimes think is a major scam specifically designed to sell t-shirts) and his Dobson/Focus on the family stuff, but many of my fellow members of Saddleback and even within my old congregation of the Catholic and Episcopal Churches (Yes, it was a long and interesting journey before I found what I consider my spiritual home) I've attended are considerably more "tolerant" and liberal than you might think.
No, I think I have an idea of how "tolerant" and "liberal" they are. I've pretty much taken the reverse path that you have and I suspect that I could easily have a civil and interesting/enlightening discussion with you.
__________________

__________________
pub crawler is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:58 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com