My friends Random Rant on Religion and the US

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Justin24

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i kinda think (keyword kinda meaning not positvely sure) but the U.S wants democracy acroos the globe other than oil and resorces and all that. i believe that but who says democracy is what we should have, meaning we were raised with rights and freedoms some weren't in other countries. the bible says...and i can show you in any bible you want me to, that females are supposed to serve man, learn in silence and never hold high positions in society and especially never preech the word, you see all of that here in the U.S but none of that in the Islamic countries because one has the bible and the other has the Coran which both derived by the Torah written by Abraham


He does not feel like signing up so please give me your opinions.
 
I'm going to be good and not even touch that one. Excuse me while I go bang my head against the wall.
 
OK, done headbanging. I'm assuming your friend believes possibly the country should be run on an interpretation of Biblical (specifically Paulist) directives. Does he believe that a democracy is conflictive with the Bible then? Does he wish a Christian theocracy here? Particularly a Christian theocracy that marginalizes women since that seems to be his highest concern?
I'm not providing an opinion. Just asking for clarification.
 
Here is the Thing he is Atheist. And for some reason he just started this rant while I was chatting with him on Yahoo Messenger.
 
From My friend.

"i think we as a country shouldn't judge them in the middle east because of there religious views because what is normal to our society may not be normal to there's, out "norms" differ between time and place one of the rules of sociology. a society is based on norms, values and a dominant culture such as religion"
 
Atheist? Why is this a concern of his then? Poor you, in the middle here.
 
Well, I don't think we ought to be invading countries simply on the grounds that they're undemocratic and/or formally bar women from positions of power, so I suppose to that extent I agree with your friend. Other than that though, it sounds to me like he's making religious law out to be more innately confining and stagnant than it actually is. For example, there is nothing in Jewish law explicitly barring women from positions of power. It is true that the pattern of religious duties which devolve specifically on Jewish women, compared to those which devolve specifically on men, clearly reflect a society of origin in which the going assumption was that a woman would be devoted to raising a family, period. But Jewish law does not actually require that, and so the Orthodox position that (for example) women cannot be rabbis is in fact based on tradition, not Jewish law. I don't know what the case is with Islamic law, but it's certainly not universal in countries which incorporate Islamic law into their Constitutions that women can't hold political office or work outside the home. So clearly there is room for change there, and every reason for us to encourage that by peaceful means.
 
Justin24 said:
the bible says...and i can show you in any bible you want me to, that females are supposed to serve man, learn in silence and never hold high positions in society and especially never preech the word...

He does not feel like signing up so please give me your opinions.

Confining my thoughts on your atheist friend's troll-like sentiments to the role of women in the church, since he can't be bothered to post in the forum himself, I'm curious to know if your friend -- who seems eager to tar all Christians with the same brush -- has actually read the Bible he so casually speaks of? Specifically, the book of Esther? The book of Ruth? The story of Deborah in Judges? Of Mary, the mother of Jesus, in the NT? Of Priscilla, wife of Aquila and generally regarded as one of the most significant women of the early church (and perhaps the author of the book of Hebrews)? Of Mary, the mother of John Mark, who in all likelihood bankrolled the first church in Jerusalem? Of Lidia, whose entrepreneurialism and faith paved the way for early Christians in Europe? Of the women who gathered at Jesus' cross while the men fled? Of Dorcas, the first person raised from the dead after Jesus? Of Elizabeth, the mother of John the Baptist, who had more faith than her husband? And that's only thinking off the top of my head.
 
I'm having trouble understanding what the question/issue is here....

Is your friend complaining about Christians? or Muslims?

He doesn't seem to have a very good grasp of the Bible (ie. what's important and what's not) or the context of the passages he's referring to.
 
Ah, you weren't asking us to answer his questions. Just figuring out whether we thought he made any sense.

No.:huh:
 
hahah. Thank You. He said how people are dumb and gullibale for believing a fake person. How the info in Loosechange.com is what really happened on 9/11. etc.... More and more mummble jumble
 
From my friend again.

o.k, i'm gonna shut you up Justin and all the other people that doubt me look this up:

1 Corinthians 14:34

"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law".

1 Timothy 2:11-14

11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.

12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

13 For Adam was first formed, then Eve.

14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.


1 Corinthians 14:29-36


29 Let the prophets speak two or three, and let the other judge.

30 If any thing be revealed to another that sitteth by, let the first hold his peace.

31 For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted.

32 And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets.

33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law.

35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

36 What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only?

YOU HAPPY DAMMIT..LOL.. check thses scripyures with any Cristian bible (King James, the most famous one).

thank you!!!!
:mad:
 
While we´re talking about this, I think that if the president of the US has the power to launch a war that will "liberate" my country than I should be able to vote for the US president candidate of my choice.,
 
Justin, what is his issue with these passages? I'm not seeing what the question is here...

I don't know as much about the Gospels as others here, but it was my understanding that when the church leaders were giving these commands, it was because they were establishing a common ground between two cultures. I may have these backwards, but I believe one culture was only monogamous, but allowed both men and women to be church leaders; the other culture was polygamous AND monogamous, but ONLY allowed men to be leaders. In an effort to become more unified and move beyond cultural disputes, the decision was that the church would support monogamy and men as leaders, kind of a compromise.

But, since I have no clue what point your friend is trying to make, I can't really relate this to his posts, other than to say that Christianity was not founded on compromises between cultures but on the examples set by Christ himself. Christ did not treat women as subordinate.
 
Justin24 said:
I agree with you.

On what? I still don't get what the issue is with your friend. What I stated regarding the Bible verses he's quoting is common knowledge. If he disagrees, he needs to take more Bible study or something.
 
From the NT (again, off the top of my head):

" 'In the last days, God says, I will pour out my Spirit on all people. Your sons and daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, your old men will dream dreams.'" ~ Acts 2:17 (Peter's first sermon)

"I commend to you our sister Phoebe, a deaconess of the church in Cenchrea." ~ Romans 16:1 (Paul's letter to the church in Rome)

"Deacons, likewise, are to be men worthy of respect, sincere, not indulging in much wine, and not pursuing dishonest gain. They must keep hold of the deep truths of the faith with a clear conscience. They must first be tested; and then if there is nothing against them, let them serve as deacons. In the same way, deaconesses are to be women worthy of respect, not malicious talkers but temperate and trustworthy in everything." ~ 1 Timothy 3 (Paul's letter)

"I plead with Euodia and I plead with Syntyche to agree with each other in the Lord. Yes, and I ask you, loyal yokefellow, help these women who have contended at my side in the cause of the gospel, along with Clement and the rest of my fellow workers, whose names are in the book of life." ~ Phil. 4:2-3

Pretty clear here that women operated with at least some level of authority in churches Paul supervised, and that he approved of it. There is a huge difference between Paul addressing specific problems in the Corinthian church and laying down laws that all churches were/are to follow.
 
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