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Old 02-18-2004, 09:47 AM   #256
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Originally posted by Dreadsox


There are MANY laws that do this. That does not make the laws bad.
They are bad laws when the application of them is arbitrarily based on gender, sexual orientation, color, race, or religion.
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Old 02-18-2004, 09:50 AM   #257
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The problem is that some people, here or not, try to codify into law what they feel is "the norm" for all.
I agree with you thoughts on this issue entirely Martha and you are right. The one thing I wanted to just highlight was though, that some people in here are seemingly being attacked and thought to agree wholeheartedly with this very view that one view fits all. I dont think anyone ever said it did. In here at least. To refer in a roundabout way to the person in question...

Dread...pick your topic sonny!!


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Old 02-18-2004, 09:51 AM   #258
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I really hate going back to this argument......I do not bring it up to argue about Polygamy but to make a point that this could be viewed as a restriction upon religion.

Laws against Polygamy could be viewed as laws against a persons right to religious freedom.
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Old 02-18-2004, 11:30 AM   #259
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
I really hate going back to this argument......I do not bring it up to argue about Polygamy but to make a point that this could be viewed as a restriction upon religion.

Laws against Polygamy could be viewed as laws against a persons right to religious freedom.
Polygamy is never a truly consentual relationship, therefore does not fall into the definition of consenting adults. Therefore can be argued outside the religious argument. The one piece of evidence offered so far on banning gay marriage that was not religious was falliable because it also eliminated many heterosexual marriages. This is why the question still gets posed because there has not been any evidence given.

So then the debate turns into technicalities as to what is the true definition of "separation of church and state"? It's gotten ridiculous. This whole issue is built of straw, yet people keep grasping.
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Old 02-18-2004, 11:39 AM   #260
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
Polygamy is never a truly consentual relationship, therefore does not fall into the definition of consenting adults.
I am not sure this is true.

If we are trying to define marriage without religious sources, what are the purely securlar historical sources that define marriage? And what was the rational for any limitations placed on a secular marriage?
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Old 02-18-2004, 11:48 AM   #261
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Polygamy is never a truly consentual relationship, therefore does not fall into the definition of consenting adults.
What? I agree with NB....how can you say this? Again...I am not interested in another Polygamy debate...maybe if you want to discuss this in the Polygamy thread we can.

Mormons in the late 1800's would view the restrictions upon Polygamy as a violation of the separation of church and state.

That was my point.
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Old 02-18-2004, 12:03 PM   #262
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Here's my explanation from the polygamy thread.

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There's no way it could be consenting 100% of the time. Most polygamy marriages is one man and many wives. The wives usually have their own bedrooms and he sleeps with one wife at a time. Let's say three of his wives wanted him on the same night, two of them are going to have to be denied. In that case it's always the man's choice and there is no true consent.
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Old 02-18-2004, 12:10 PM   #263
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But the women consent to that form of relationship.
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Old 02-18-2004, 12:13 PM   #264
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Originally posted by nbcrusader
But the women consent to that form of relationship.
So you only have to consent at the formation of the relationship?
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Old 02-18-2004, 12:18 PM   #265
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Mormons in the late 1800's would view the restrictions upon Polygamy as a violation of the separation of church and state.

That was my point.
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Old 02-18-2004, 12:24 PM   #266
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
So you only have to consent at the formation of the relationship?
For marriage, yes. Besides, in your example, each of the wives are empowered to deny their husband as well.
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Old 02-18-2004, 12:30 PM   #267
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For marriage, yes. Besides, in your example, each of the wives are empowered to deny their husband as well.
So anything goes after the vows?

Only having the power to say yes or no doesn't make it 100% consentual in my book. But hey I don't write the laws.
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Old 02-18-2004, 12:33 PM   #268
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Mormons in the late 1800's would view the restrictions upon Polygamy as a violation of the separation of church and state.

That was my point.
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Old 02-18-2004, 12:35 PM   #269
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
Mormons in the late 1800's would view the restrictions upon Polygamy as a violation of the separation of church and state.

That was my point.
Hey Dread, was this your point?
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Old 02-18-2004, 12:35 PM   #270
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Well, now we are looking at regulating the lifetime of a marriage. I bet there are instances during the course of any marriage, civil union, domestic partnership, life mate relationship where things are not 100% consentual according to your example.
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