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Old 01-04-2008, 09:22 PM   #151
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Dennis Kucinich just filed a complaint against the FCC because ABC has excluded him and Mike Gravel from ABC debates. This is just ridiculous. Not only in all previous debates do people like Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich not get enough speaking time, but as if that wasn't already insane enough, ABC and FOX has the nerves to exclude the candidates all together.

Just ridiculous.
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Old 01-04-2008, 11:21 PM   #152
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You know Kucinich and Gravel make sense at least, as they have virtually no support out in the polls and even less money. You can make an argument that at this point they would be little more than a distraction. I don't agree with excluding them, but it makes more sense with them than with Ron Paul. He has outraised all the other Republican nominees in the last quarter and although he's not polling high nationally, didn't he just pick up some 10-12% over in Iowa, which is a state he wasn't going to do well in anyway. Lame.
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Old 01-05-2008, 12:07 AM   #153
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Saw this on another forum...made me keekle...

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Old 01-05-2008, 12:16 PM   #154
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Vote RON PAUL!!!

Good ol' Fox News. Some reporters try to save Fox some face. They have to now for obvious reasons or they come off 100% biased. How can they sell if people know that they are 100% one way?

Even now, Fox News still attempts to say Ron Paul "won't be president". They will keep saying it until the sheep start believing it or the pigs are too distracted to care. It is possible that Ron Paul won't be elected, but it is also possible that 17 out of 18 other candidates won't be elected president either. Ron Paul won't be president if people start believing that he won't be.
Your vote counts and you vote for what you believe in, not for what the media sells to you. Your vote says something and therefore it can not be wasted. Vote for what you think is right, just, and American and its very roots and it will not be wasted.

I had a discussion tonight with some friends and I concluded in my own mind after the subject changed and that one of the major if not the biggest problem in this country is that people would rather talk about something else rather than this fading Republic. On one hand I don't blame them for their lack of apathy because they have become part of the legion of people that think they have to vote for the "lesser of two evils" and they are sick of it so they don't care to vote at all. They would rather talk about the weather, but on the other hand you have people that believe that they have to vote for the "lesser of two evils". So then I ask, Why wouldn't either group think that nothing truly changes in this country while they conform to the system that eats them up!? One group of people perpetuate this illegitimate belief that we can't vote beyond the lesser of two evils, even while some other option is available that is wholeheartedly constitutional and American, while the other group is disgusted and can't vote at all because they don't want to vote for the "lesser of two evils". Where does that put us? It only gives us more of the same and every four years we find ourselves either deciding between the "lesser of two evils" or we don't vote at all. Nothing changes. Nothing changes. Nothing changes. Nothing changes. Hasn't anyone heard of the phrase, "Break out of the Box!"?

Break out of the mold! You obviously do not hold the cast that shaped you to conform to the fences that contain you. Don't stand in one of two lines just to conform to the stockade that loves to taunt you and drive you in.
Break the mold! I sincerely believe that the future Americans envisioned by the founders of this country weren't so easy to taunt and manipulate. Don't take offense. That is just my opinion. Here we are over 200 years after the constitution was drafted and yet, our vision has the eyesight of sheep driven to the slaughter house, or pigs that binge on the trough directly in front of them and kneel to the farmhand whose sole job is to provide us slop.

When will we learn that we the people OWN THE FARM. WE THE PEOPLE force the candidates to conform to OUR constitutional beliefs and not us to their views or the media manipulation or special interest endpoints, endgame, or profit margins?
We need to stop thinking that we have to choose the path of the sheep or the pig or nothing and start believing again that we OWN THE FARM.

I challenge everyone I email to read the Declaration of Independence. Even if you have read it before. Search google "Declaration of Independence" , Sit down and read it, Study why it was written and what drove men without a country to write a document that would raise up men to fight for what would become a republic. Then contemplate, what did they fight to become free and what were they subjected to versus what they gained by risking their own wealth and lives? Then contemplate the constitution that was written that concluded that we should live free to do what we please and enjoy our lives freely and peacefully with one another and without intrusion. It is a short and a rather simple document, but it was the document that established the greatest Republic to ever exist in the history of the world. Then contemplate how far we have back-pedaled against the grain of what they risked their lives for. The free people that wrote that document did not sit down to watch the news at night. They were the news. They did not answer to anyone, just themselves, they did not fight for anyone else's freedom but their own, which paved the way for generation upon generation upon generation to inherit and "keep" what they envisioned for each of us. The founders were brilliant, learned, well read, experience filled and articulate. Yet, our own vision is perceived through a box we sit down in front of night after night after night when all we need to do is refer to the constitution and our declaration to understand what course of action we need to take. The box in front of us with shiny flashing lights and colors is far from perfect. It is not absolute. The words spewing from biased news voices on "the tube" were not drawn from men who risked their lives, their families, their wealth, and their freedom. They are words of men who are a part of system governed by wealth with little risk. I suppose I shouldn't say "little risk". The one "little risk" they take is to stumble upon viewers who choose to turn them off, turn to the words of Washington, Jefferson, Madison and who start to wonder what founded this country. What tyranny and injustice did the founders of this country face that was to such an extent that cornered them to a belief that either they fought for freedom, justice, peace, and prosperity or they fought for nothing, because they may as well not have anything, because they in essence had nothing without freedom?!

It is boggling. It is absolutely mind numbing that we live in an age, when our country has become the very entity that our founders fought against; an empire. a greedy, militaristic, tax craving, war mongering, discriminating empire. I do not speak of the people of this country or even the soldiers that fight for what their country (numbingly) asks, but those farmhands in power who have driven us behind fences. Those farmhands that slop down a handout to keep us satisfied or who draw us into a state of security to only drive us through the stockade as sheep searching for comfort of boundaries and confines that grow ever so tighter until we are lamb chops.
So, I am tired of hearing people say that they don't vote because they refuse to vote for the "lesser of two evils". My simple answer to them is "great! don't vote for the lesser of two evils, simply vote for a person who reflects our constitution and who desires peace, prosperity and freedom for all while he can ARTICULATE to us how that is possible-through our constitution". I am also tired of the people who say, "I can't vote for him because the farmhand only gives me two choices, the slaughterhouse or the slop trough". My answer to them is to accept neither and take back the farm!

In my opinion, it isn't so complicated. Our founders made it easy for us. They wrote a universal and simple Declaration of Independence and then they wrote a simple and yet encompassing Bill of Rights (our original constitution) that is the essence to everything that has provided us freedom, prosperity, and peace (when it hasn't been hijacked from us). It is our willingness to accept the one of two lines or no line at all that has lead us to a road of lameness or bitter end or apathy and it is only our willingness to dust off our founding documents that will allow us to perhaps see that we do in fact own the farm. We own the Title! The Deed! The Estate! We are the overseers and it is the representatives and leaders that we elect that are the workhorses. It is their task to answer to us through our constitution, while we protect our freedom, prosperity, and peace, by living our days free, peaceful, while pursuing whatever makes us happy.

Our country's situation will only get worse if we don't make the right choice. Read the Declaration and Constitution. Things get simple that way and if we're lucky we can peer into the hearts and minds of the founders who were brave enough to defeat an empire that was greedy, militaristic, tax craving, war mongering, and discriminating.
History repeats itself. Will we be on the side of the falling empire, or the side of the people that rose up and fought for peace, freedom, and prosperity for all? (If we follow the examples of our founders we should understand that we do this within our own country and not within the borders of other countries)

Our country is a "baby" in the world. Just over 200 years old is less than a blink of an eye by the standards of written history. We are not infallable, nor do we know what is best for the world. It is obvious that we don't know what is best for ourselves when we are so willing to trade the farm in exchange for stockades and troughs. I have a bit of hope that things will change and the sooner they change, then perhaps we all will be able to brag to our grandchildren or great grandchildren that we were among the many who fought back and restored our republic. Perhaps we can look a grandchild or great grandchild in the eye one day and say that our founders weren't the only ones who had the courage to stand up for what they believed in. Perhaps we can restate in clear terms that "the price of freedom is eternal vigilance". Freedom isn't guaranteed. It is not an entitlement. It is fought for and then it is fought for eternally.

Will our children inherit a world where they believe that they have the choice of one of two lines or no lines at all? Will we leave them with the options of the trough or the slaughterhouse? Or will we pass on a truth that they inherit this country and all of its freedom, peace, and prosperity?

"Sheep, pig, or the rightful and right filled owner?" That will be my eternal question to those who tell me that they have to vote for the "lesser of two evils" or that they refuse to vote because they believe that can't vote beyond the "lesser of two evils". If they choose between these "options" then, nothing changes, nothing changes, nothing changes, and nothing changes. Glorious will be the day that Americans decide again to elect someone who is not of the cast. Someone who breaks from the mold and gives them hope that they can break from the mold too. Someone that can get the country moving toward a point where grandfathers and grandmothers can say, "I did something that the founders of this country would be proud of, I voted for the constitution of all things, I voted for peace, freedom, and prosperity, I voted for your future, and I voted for my country".
It has a nice ring to it, much better than the news box with flashing lights and colors that spews and sells and numbs us into submission.

Sincerely

JM
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Old 01-05-2008, 12:21 PM   #155
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Plus, he has a blimp.
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Old 01-05-2008, 12:28 PM   #156
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I miss the Similar Threads feature.
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Old 01-05-2008, 12:29 PM   #157
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I'm Ron Paul, and get off my lawn!
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Old 01-05-2008, 12:31 PM   #158
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Originally posted by martha
I miss the Similar Threads feature.
Who cares when the new "who has friended me?" feature lets me know that Sicy actually secretly loves me.
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Old 01-05-2008, 01:07 PM   #159
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Who cares when the new "who has friended me?" feature lets me know that Sicy actually secretly loves me.
Sicy's secret love.
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Old 01-05-2008, 02:36 PM   #160
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I'll say this again, for purposes of clarity.

Ron Paul is precisely an example of how Americans vote on image, rather than substance, not an exception to the rule.

Ron Paul has excellent marketing behind him, so much so that there was a time where I found him interesting too. The details, though, make him far less attractive, and, in fact, make him completely undesirable.

1) The details of his economic policies are unsupported by mainstream economists, and, in fact, are completely reactionary. And I'm not even talking about his interest in reducing spending and cutting taxes. Paul's interest in eliminating the Federal Reserve completely and returning to the gold standard is the most dangerous aspects of his economic policy. However, if he did eliminate the income tax and institute a 20%+ national sales tax, it would have a devastating effect on our economy. Ask Canada and the U.K. about how popular the GST/VAT is. Don't forget, too, that a 20%+ sales tax will be in addition to any state or local sales taxes (ask Canadians about that too).

2) His social stances are, again, rather abhorrent. Treating issues of civil rights as issues of "states' rights" hark back to the days of slave versus free states, and, in the 20th century, states with racial segregation laws. No, I don't think Ron Paul wants to reinstitute either specifically, but when Paul states that the states should be able to determine their own level of civil rights, it is literally no different when 19th century U.S. President John Tyler advocated that a state's "free" or "slave" status should be determined at the state level, with no input from the federal government.

In short, despite the marketing, Paul is not progressive at all. He is probably the most reactionary of all the candidates in this election--Huckabee included. Sure, I am personally quite interested in a candidate who would be serious about cutting spending, balancing budgets, preserving individual freedom, etc., but Paul is most definitely not the right man for this job. His specific stances do not live up to the hype whatsoever.

Here's hoping that a future election can someday find a candidate that takes the spirit of Ron Paul with actual substance behind it.
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Old 01-05-2008, 06:59 PM   #161
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^I understand what you are saying. But I don't think that the Federal or State government would ever allow any type of segregation. In all honesty, I don't think he would even be able to eliminate the federal reserve. And about eliminating the income tax, I know he would try his best to do it, but even if he can't do that, i'll be happy with any tax cut. But I don't think anyone agrees 100% with any of their candidates of choice. Nor do I think any of the candidates have all completely rational stances. That is why I vote based on the issues that matter to me the most.

Right now there are generally two issues that matter to me the most:

Taxes and the War in Iraq

Ron Paul is the only candidate from either side that is both against the war and wants to pull our troops out without any bullshit like Hillary Clinton AND who is for lower taxes. Pretty much every other candidate that is for lower taxes supports the war and every other candidate that is against the war is for raising some sort of taxes. That is why I picked Ron Paul.

Now I'm not just blindly listening to him when he says he will cut taxes and pull out of Iraq. I have done my work on his voting record. He never voted for approval to go into Iraq. He has always been against America's policing the world. He has never voted for a tax hike. He does not seem like a greedy politician because he has never voted for a Congressional pay raise. He has always voted against an unbalanced budget. He is willing to cut a big chunk of the half trillion dollar military budget by closing down bases all over the world and bringing our troops home from all countries (South Korea, Germany, Iraq). So this proves to me that he is:

a) Serious about NOT policing the world.
b) By not policing the world he will cut big spending.
c) By cutting big spending, our taxes will also be lowered.

That is what matters to me and that is why I'm supporting him. And he doesn't really have much marketing at all. The media doesn't give him much airtime. It is the American people who looked up Ron Paul after the first Republican debate after he destroyed Rudy Giuliani about the causes of 9/11. We all searched him up, we did our research and liked what we saw. It was his foreign policy stance that drew me in, not his fiscal policy.
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Old 01-05-2008, 07:24 PM   #162
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Plus, he has a blimp.
I think that damn blimp is stalking my friends and I. Last week, we were joking about it and my friend saw it driving home. Today, he mentioned that. Then I saw it driving home.

The blimp knows y'all
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Old 01-05-2008, 07:51 PM   #163
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Ron Paul is making a lot of sense to me in this debate.
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Old 01-05-2008, 09:05 PM   #164
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I actually was very impressed with him. I didn't know much about him other than his position on the war, which I've admired. I really like this guy. It's a shame he won't get the nomination because he won't the nomination because I could live with this guy being president. I disagree with him fundamentally on a lot of issues, but he was the only one up there who actually made sense, and who strayed from the typical Republican response on the issues. It takes guts to criticize the Bush administration as much as he did and to point out what he did on the war and the U.S. as the "world police." I was very impressed by him.
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Old 01-05-2008, 09:17 PM   #165
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I actually was very impressed with him. I didn't know much about him other than his position on the war, which I've admired. I really like this guy. It's a shame he won't get the nomination because he won't the nomination because I could live with this guy being president. I disagree with him fundamentally on a lot of issues, but he was the only one up there who actually made sense, and who strayed from the typical Republican response on the issues. It takes guts to criticize the Bush administration as much as he did and to point out what he did on the war and the U.S. as the "world police." I was very impressed by him.
Exactly. He does not play politics. He sticks to the truth. He does have a lot of support in New Hampshire and maybe, just maybe he can win.
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