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Old 09-13-2004, 02:48 PM   #106
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Originally posted by nbcrusader
But, as a constitutional scholar, you would realize that limits on rights must pass strict scrutiny - thus a limit should only apply to the public safety goal (no criminal use of assault weapons) instead of a general ban.
OK, the military has weapons and the civilians have the right to bear arms. Military weapons such as bombs and tanks are not available to civilians. I think that assault weapons should never have been available to civilians in the first place.

We have seen the results of allowing these weapons to be available to civilians, it didn't work out so great and now we realize we should have had more rules regarding sophisticated guns in the first place.

So let's just reclassify them as military weapons instead of banning them.
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Old 09-13-2004, 02:53 PM   #107
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So let's just reclassify them as military weapons instead of banning them.
smart idea
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Old 09-13-2004, 04:29 PM   #108
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So let's just reclassify them as military weapons instead of banning them.
The name "assault weapons" is given to a category of military weapons downgraged for civilian use.

The primary difference is that these weapons cannot fire in full automatic mode.
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Old 09-13-2004, 06:08 PM   #109
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The name "assault weapons" is given to a category of military weapons downgraged for civilian use.

The primary difference is that these weapons cannot fire in full automatic mode.
Well, it was a mistake to downgrade military weapons. We can't predict that all of the civilians will be responsible with them and shouldn't take that risk anymore. How do you suggest that we correct this mistake if banning is so offensive?
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Old 09-13-2004, 06:38 PM   #110
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It's like there is a segment of the population which is unable to or unwilling to compromise on this at all, and it will probably remain that way until 6 guys from overseas or somewhere in the US walk into a McDonalds with AK-47 and obliterate the people dining inside. Then you bet your ass we'll be banning assault weapons faster than you can fry a McNugget.

If you can pre-emptively engage in fullout WAR with a sovereign nation, you should also pre-emptively ban these weapons. That there is any discussion here baffles me at all. If the government has a right to know what book you're taking out of the library, then they should also have a right to tell you where to stick your uzi.
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Old 09-13-2004, 06:55 PM   #111
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NbC, you haven't answered ThatGuy's question--I thought it was a good one.
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Old 09-13-2004, 07:22 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally posted by anitram
It's like there is a segment of the population which is unable to or unwilling to compromise on this at all, and it will probably remain that way until 6 guys from overseas or somewhere in the US walk into a McDonalds with AK-47 and obliterate the people dining inside. Then you bet your ass we'll be banning assault weapons faster than you can fry a McNugget.

It has happened.

http://www.student.oulu.fi/~hmikkola/shootout.html


Quote:
the suspects fired an estimated 1,110 rounds from three fully automatic AK-47s, a .223 fully automatic Bushmaster rifle, a .308 semiautomatic H&K and a semiautomatic 9mm Beretta handgun. One squad car sustained 57 hits. A sidewalk kiosk, used for cover by officers on the scene, was perforated with 150 bullets.

After the shooting stopped, more than 2,000 live rounds were found in the suspects' vehicle. Drums loaded with additional ammunition were found on the suspects' bodies. Eleven police officers were injured. One officer went down in an exposed area. He was in jeopardy of execution until another officer, defying incoming rounds, drove a squad car to the downed officer and rescued him. Fortunately, none of the officers were killed.
These guys were so heavily armed, the LAPD was totally unprepared. This shoot out took place right in the middle of North Hollywood, California in the middle of the day. People were horrified at the fire power these bank robbers had yet that small segment of the population who wants these guns for "fun" will blame it on "bad men" not "bad guns"

I guess the 73% of us who don't want this ban to expire don't matter for sqat over that small group.
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Old 09-13-2004, 09:08 PM   #113
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So you're againt knives and box cutters being confiscated before flights, then? After all, they have many other purposes besides potentially being used as weapons during a flight.
Are you comparing the constitutional right to carry a box cutter (?) with the limited prohibition to carrying one in a narrowly defined circumstance (on a commercial airline)?


Note that ALL potential weapons are banned from aircraft, not just ones that we can vilify

Restrictions on personal freedoms, in such limited context, are not uncommon as long as they are well defined, needed, and give individuals an option (i.e., you don't have to go through the metal detector at the airport - you can take a bus instead).
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Old 09-13-2004, 09:19 PM   #114
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Originally posted by paxetaurora
NbC, you haven't answered ThatGuy's question--I thought it was a good one.
Sorry, I was out with my son this evening
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Old 09-14-2004, 12:53 AM   #115
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader
The name "assault weapons" is given to a category of military weapons downgraged for civilian use.

The primary difference is that these weapons cannot fire in full automatic mode.
I'm sorry, I'm not a weapons expert, but when is it not in full automatic mode. From the information I've seen, some of the weapons that are available from today on include those that can fire 600 to 800 rounds per minute. How can that not be automatic?

Here's the picture from the BBC where I got my information:


BTW, anyone wants to bet when the first killings with these weapons occur? I wanted to say today, but I'll take a conservative guess and say this week.

C ya!

Marty
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Old 09-14-2004, 12:57 AM   #116
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Why are we debating the legality of a ban while that obviously wasn't a problem in 1994?
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Old 09-14-2004, 12:59 AM   #117
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader

Note that ALL potential weapons are banned from aircraft, not just ones that we can vilify
You're telling me they are stripping constitutional rights during flights?
If yes, it makes 100% sense - and forbidding these weapons in general would be a good idea.
Maybee weapons can be allowed to people who have a kind of "driver licence" to weapons so that we can maximize the chance that these people have a responsible personality and aren't in the mood, being inspired by games like "Doom", to bring this "action" into their neighbourhood - which could be our neighbourhood.
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Old 09-14-2004, 01:36 AM   #118
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Wow, arent gun owners in the USA required to license each gun?
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Old 09-14-2004, 05:26 AM   #119
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I feel sorry for the police who will be up against these weapons

What is that Charlton Heston quote again?
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Old 09-14-2004, 06:10 AM   #120
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LOL, NBC, probably having much more fun that we were here, too.

Thanks for keeping this thread civil, too, everyone.
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