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Old 07-13-2006, 09:46 PM   #46
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Why is most of the Mid East brave enough to keep picking on Israel?

I'm no expert on these countries' military power r anything, but from what I've seen and heard it seems like Israel could kick some major arse. Are these countries simply attacing them because they think they can get away with it, or are they possibly slitting their own throats?
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Old 07-13-2006, 09:58 PM   #47
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Somehow, I knew this was Israel’s fault

Resorting to fraudulent allusions of previous incidents (shelling the beach) as a means to ignore a large population’s active and passive support of terrorist organizations is appalling.

Israel has every right to take the actions it has. Allowing placement of rockets so close to the border is by itself an act of aggression. It has nothing to do with being a “democratic” country. It has everything to do with a country surrounded by enemies (who would love to kill all the Jews) trying to keep its citizens safe from indiscriminate rocket attacks.

If we were so concerned with Israel’s response to international criticism, perhaps we would hear something more than silence concerning terrorist “governments” before Israel is forced to deal with another attack.

Besides, Hezbollah (likely at Iran’s direction) is merely taking the attention away from Iran’s continued nuclear development.
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Old 07-13-2006, 10:09 PM   #48
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Nothing will change, the attacks will continue and frankly, the only way Israel will stop the terrorist attacks from Arab states is to wipe out every man, woman and child from those regions. Sorry, but that is the only solution which would guarantee their safety.

I agree with financeguy that Israel's response is way out of proportion to the incident which sparked it. I'm tired of the terrorists and the government backed killings of innocents by Israel. How many innocent civilians will suffer in the coming weeks and months as a result of the attacks on the civilian infrastructure? How many Israelis will die as a result of this offensive manouver? Is it worth it cause at the end of the day, there will be more terrorist attacks in Israel and it will go on and on and on from both sides.

Regarding punishing the Lebanese or Palesitinians for "allowing" terrorism, what are we gonna do, take away their tents? These people are already in a desperate position which is probably half the reason they are so willing to use extreme measures to attack Israel.
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Old 07-13-2006, 10:43 PM   #49
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Israel does have a well trained military. I think we underestimate the collective military power of the surrounding states and the innate hatred these states have for Israel.
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Old 07-13-2006, 10:46 PM   #50
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Collectively they may be able to destroy Israel, but these states seem to be banking on the idea that each other state will be there to support them if Israel decides to fight back in a big way, which seems dangerous to me.
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Old 07-14-2006, 01:12 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally posted by shart1780
Collectively they may be able to destroy Israel, but these states seem to be banking on the idea that each other state will be there to support them if Israel decides to fight back in a big way, which seems dangerous to me.
Collectively, these states can't do worth shit, as has been proven time and time again...'56, '67, and '73. Oh, and Israel has 'nukes, not to mention the best damn military and airforce of all other middle east countries combined.
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Old 07-14-2006, 01:47 AM   #52
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Originally posted by shart1780
Collectively they may be able to destroy Israel,

maybe yes, maybe no

but Israel sure seems to be capable of self-destruction
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Old 07-14-2006, 03:58 AM   #53
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It's all a bit too discomfitingly reminiscent of Israel's 1982-85 war with Lebanon. That war was also entered into with the goal of putting an end to (PLO) raids and rocket attacks staged from south Lebanon, and it also widened almost immediately into a broader conflict, involving the bombing of Beirut, the military involvement of Syria, the further destabilization of the already fragile Lebanese government, the deaths of almost 18,000, and the emergence of Hezbollah out of a loose federation of Shiite groups focused on driving Israel from south Lebanon (Hezbollah is not a Palestinian group). And it did not succeed in decisively curbing PLO militancy as hoped. Militarily speaking--not an encouraging precedent.

On the other hand, politically speaking, melon's point is hard to get around. A failed state is probably the worst kind of enemy to have, certainly worse than any one armed faction that takes root in it, because as soon as one is taken out, another will rise in its place. It cannot control its own armies, it cannot resist outside manipulation and, as such, it cannot hope to keep any treaty promises it might make, to anyone. Of course the people who suffer most from this are its own citizens.
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Isn't the land Israel is currently based on land that "God"gave to his chosen people.
You might want to take a look at the Wikipedia entry on Zionism. Zionism is first and foremost a spinoff of 19th-century European nationalist thought, not a Bible-based ideology, and it gained widespread international support among Jews only following the Holocaust, and the subsequent failure of the Allies to provide an internal solution for the resulting refugee crisis of Central and East European Jews who could not be safely repatriated.
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Old 07-14-2006, 08:41 AM   #54
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Originally posted by nbcrusader Besides, Hezbollah (likely at Iran’s direction) is merely taking the attention away from Iran’s continued nuclear development.
I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it is Iran's pre-G8 summit posturing to force their nuclear deal close to the top of the agenda and (attempt to) control some of the terms in their favour (with 2 Israeli hostage soldiers among the cards).
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Old 07-14-2006, 10:25 AM   #55
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Originally posted by yolland
On the other hand, politically speaking, melon's point is hard to get around. A failed state is probably the worst kind of enemy to have, certainly worse than any one armed faction that takes root in it, because as soon as one is taken out, another will rise in its place. It cannot control its own armies, it cannot resist outside manipulation and, as such, it cannot hope to keep any treaty promises it might make, to anyone. Of course the people who suffer most from this are its own citizens.


all too true, and it seems as if the Middle East can welcome yet another failed state -- Iraq!
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Old 07-14-2006, 10:58 AM   #56
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Originally posted by yolland
It's all a bit too discomfitingly reminiscent of Israel's 1982-85 war with Lebanon.
Exactly what I was thinking.

The whole thing is so upsetting.
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Old 07-14-2006, 11:48 AM   #57
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Originally posted by nbcrusader
Somehow, I knew this was Israel’s fault


i've been thinking about this statement for a bit, and as someone who does believe in Israel's right to exist and defend itself while at the same time acknowledging that it often goes to absurd lengths to do so, i think it's fair to say that it's in Israel's long-term interest to refrain from polarizing the region more than necessary for its self-defense.

the actions of the past few days do seem, at this point, to be out of proportion to the events that precipitated them.
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Old 07-14-2006, 12:01 PM   #58
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Originally posted by Irvine511




i've been thinking about this statement for a bit, and as someone who does believe in Israel's right to exist and defend itself while at the same time acknowledging that it often goes to absurd lengths to do so, i think it's fair to say that it's in Israel's long-term interest to refrain from polarizing the region more than necessary for its self-defense.

the actions of the past few days do seem, at this point, to be out of proportion to the events that precipitated them.
Well said.
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Old 07-14-2006, 12:22 PM   #59
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Originally posted by Irvine511 the actions of the past few days do seem, at this point, to be out of proportion to the events that precipitated them.
Perhaps because at stake is the UN deal regarding nuclear development in Iran...this is Israel sending a strong message to the UN (and US) that they will not take kindly to concessions in Iran's favour.

Am I the only one here on that wavelength? lol
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Old 07-14-2006, 12:29 PM   #60
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Perhaps because at stake is the UN deal regarding nuclear development in Iran...this is Israel sending a strong message to the UN (and US) that they will not take kindly to concessions in Iran's favour.

Am I the only one here on that wavelength? lol


actually, i posted in another thread about Iran's involvement and how it is now pulling the strings in the Middle East and is as dangerous as Saddam ever was.

i'm quite certain that Israel is well aware of how powerful and defiant Iran has become in recent years.
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