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Old 06-21-2007, 08:52 AM   #151
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I would defer to Melon/Ormus on that, i'd love to know where he gets all his great info though

My understanding is pretty basic of what the Church wants me to believe...their view of homosexuality is stuck in some medieval strain of thought...I don't know what they exactly believe whether homosexuality is natural or not, because all I hear from them at mass is 'it's evil, family destroyer etc'
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Old 06-21-2007, 09:05 AM   #152
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Originally posted by LJT
I would defer to Melon/Ormus on that, i'd love to know where he gets all his great info though

My understanding is pretty basic of what the Church wants me to believe...their view of homosexuality is stuck in some medieval strain of thought...I don't know what they exactly believe whether homosexuality is natural or not, because all I hear from them at mass is 'it's evil, family destroyer etc'
Omg go to a different mass! That's awful! My catholic church was a very different experience. Our community house was even a registered "Safe Zone" with the university, which is intended specifically for homosexuals to feel welcome, but the message is that Everyone can come and be themselves. Granted...there were members of the community who were narrowminded and judgemental, however our priest and campus minister never said anything of the sort, and even my friends said they felt welcomed.

To be fair though, I'd honestly doubt they'd go as far as to support gay marriage. But at least they aren't downright unaccepting of homosexuals as individuals. Baby steps I suppose

Oh, and Melormus is a genius. He doesn't have to dig up the info anywhere, he knows all.
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Old 06-21-2007, 09:28 AM   #153
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Originally posted by Ormus



The linguistic evidence is supportive, as the word traditionally misapplied to "sex acts" literally means "know" (yad'ah).

Wow, so you really can yada yada sex.

(Sorry 'bout that folks, couldn't help it. Carry on.... )
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Old 06-21-2007, 09:44 AM   #154
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Originally posted by unico

Omg go to a different mass! That's awful! My catholic church was a very different experience. Our community house was even a registered "Safe Zone" with the university, which is intended specifically for homosexuals to feel welcome, but the message is that Everyone can come and be themselves. Granted...there were members of the community who were narrowminded and judgemental, however our priest and campus minister never said anything of the sort, and even my friends said they felt welcomed.

To be fair though, I'd honestly doubt they'd go as far as to support gay marriage. But at least they aren't downright unaccepting of homosexuals as individuals. Baby steps I suppose

Oh, and Melormus is a genius. He doesn't have to dig up the info anywhere, he knows all.
That he does!

At the moment i'm just very disenchanted with the Church, people are scapegoating homosexuals for their own dysfuntions. Still I find the Catholic Church most represents my personal faith and i'm a tradionalist when it comes to how I feel the need to express my faith, and the Catholic mass does that for me. It is hard just to sit there and listen to a priest attack how some of my friends and people I know, lead their lives when they hurt no one. Then you hear them go on about materialism and you look at the nice silverware they are using

Belfast is quite a homophobic place though, my parents included...a few weeks back my mum compared homosexuals to paedophiles, asking me whether I would let a gay couple look after a child of mine, would I let them bath him etc I obviously replied yes, her reply 'How would they control themselves?' That really dumbfounded me. I love my mum deeply but that just struck me as so out of her character, she then asked whether I was gay, because you have to apparently be gay to defend their rights. This type of thing is what I think the Catholic Church has to answer for.
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Old 06-21-2007, 09:54 AM   #155
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That he does!

At the moment i'm just very disenchanted with the Church, people are scapegoating homosexuals for their own dysfuntions. Still I find the Catholic Church most represents my personal faith and i'm a tradionalist when it comes to how I feel the need to express my faith, and the Catholic mass does that for me. It is hard just to sit there and listen to a priest attack how some of my friends and people I know, lead their lives when they hurt no one. Then you hear them go on about materialism and you look at the nice silverware they are using

Belfast is quite a homophobic place though, my parents included...a few weeks back my mum compared homosexuals to paedophiles, asking me whether I would let a gay couple look after a child of mine, would I let them bath him etc I obviously replied yes, her reply 'How would they control themselves?' That really dumbfounded me. I love my mum deeply but that just struck me as so out of her character, she then asked whether I was gay, because you have to apparently be gay to defend their rights. This type of thing is what I think the Catholic Church has to answer for.
That must be so difficult to deal with. I guess it all depends on the community. There are actual lay ministers here in the states that minister to the homosexual community. By no means do they try to "change" them or anything, it is more of a support group type of thing. Granted, these types of ministries aren't exactly overflowing with volunteers, but they are there, and hopefully they will grow in time.

You know, I'd say look around! If this sort of open minded catholic community can exist here, I'm sure it exists elsewhere too. You may find a community of people who share your ideals.
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Old 06-21-2007, 09:57 AM   #156
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I'm gonna ask, although I know you won't answer, but here goes:

I have had a variety of reproductive organs removed. Therefore, I cannot have children. If I continue to have sex with my male husband of 18 years, are we sinning?
Come on. Dude, answer me. School's out, the weekend's coming up. I need to know.
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Old 06-21-2007, 10:03 AM   #157
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I go off to see the Police, and still no answer. I won't be able to enjoy certain things until I know if I'm sinning.
Believe it or not, I was wrong in that aspect. After doing a little more research and looking some more in the Bible, I realized I was wrong. Unlike animals (who mate only to procreate), God made humans different than animals. Humans use sex to fulfill bodily desires as well. So, yes, I was wrong, and I truly apologize.

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And what exactly does it say about lesbians?
Huh? I could give you as many passages as you want which condemn homosexuality.


Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511

has it occured to you that your religious beliefs pretty much have to be bogus if you have to lie to yourself in order to live with them?
Please tell me how am I lying to myself.
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Old 06-21-2007, 10:06 AM   #158
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Huh? I could give you as many passages as you want which condemn homosexuality.
I'm only familiar with passages that speak to man on man action. I don't recall any regarding homosexuality in general. So I'd be interested in your sharing of them too.
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Old 06-21-2007, 10:14 AM   #159
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Originally posted by unico


That must be so difficult to deal with. I guess it all depends on the community. There are actual lay ministers here in the states that minister to the homosexual community. By no means do they try to "change" them or anything, it is more of a support group type of thing. Granted, these types of ministries aren't exactly overflowing with volunteers, but they are there, and hopefully they will grow in time.

You know, I'd say look around! If this sort of open minded catholic community can exist here, I'm sure it exists elsewhere too. You may find a community of people who share your ideals.
I shall keep a look out and thanks for the advice!
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Old 06-21-2007, 10:16 AM   #160
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Originally posted by 2861U2
God made humans different than animals. Humans use sex to fulfill bodily desires as well. So, yes, I was wrong, and I truly apologize.

Whew! Good for me, and good for you later in life.


Let the weekend begin!
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Old 06-21-2007, 11:08 AM   #161
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Originally posted by 2861U2

Please tell me how am I lying to myself.


the whole "being gay is a choice" thing.

scientists and psychologists disagree with you.

gay people disagree with you.

yet, you're not a scientist, a psychologist, or gay. but you say they're wrong. can't you admit to a little self-delusion at the very least?
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Old 06-21-2007, 11:10 AM   #162
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the whole "being gay is a choice" thing.

scientists and psychologists disagree with you.

gay people disagree with you.

yet, you're not a scientist, a psychologist, or gay. but you say they're wrong. can't you admit to a little self-delusion at the very least?
even leaders of some christian churches disagree.
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Old 06-21-2007, 11:21 AM   #163
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maycocksean, here is my response to that story. Yes, it is sad and upsetting that such thing occured. However, sorry, that doesnt change my stance.
What's your stance in relationship to the story. Do you think what happened to these women was fair? Do you think the woman should have been allowed to see her partner at her deathbed? Or is it merely sad and "unfortunate" but you'd change nothing?
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Old 06-21-2007, 11:22 AM   #164
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Why can't the anti-gay-marriage folks just be content with the fact that those evil sinning homos are bound for Hell? I mean, isn't Hell enough?

I mean, I really don't get it...why do you care if 2 men get married? It has absolutely no effect on you or your life in any way, other than denying you the chance to force your religious beliefs on somebody else.

I truly cannot understand why the "anti" crowd cares so much. Really.
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Old 06-21-2007, 11:25 AM   #165
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Believe it or not, I was wrong in that aspect. After doing a little more research and looking some more in the Bible, I realized I was wrong. Unlike animals (who mate only to procreate), God made humans different than animals. Humans use sex to fulfill bodily desires as well. So, yes, I was wrong, and I truly apologize.



Huh? I could give you as many passages as you want which condemn homosexuality.




Please tell me how am I lying to myself.
Actually I want to challenge this statement on a different point. You said you did " a little more research and looking some more in the Bible." Did you do all that on your own or are you talking to a pastor or somoene else you respect who was able to "quickly correct" you. Because to go from "oral sex is wrong" to "sex was created by God for man and woman to enjoy" in a day or two just based on your own research is pretty amazing
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