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Old 12-04-2002, 07:21 PM   #16
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Re: Marriage

Quote:
Originally posted by Lara Mullen
Really is there any need to get married anymore?

what does it really prove?

Even though you make your vows and everything your partner doesnt have to stay loyal to you they could still leave you.

I think its just an excuse to waste lots of money on relatives you'll never see again

Am I just very cynical?
no, i agree with all those things and i am not cynical.

I did get married though.

and i'll tell you why: it was the only way to really get all the family and friends together for a big party.

We didn't go overboard, but they all came because it was a "wedding."

I'm not fooling myself. It doesn't mean this partnership is somehow now irrevocable because we had a wedding. but we did have a damn fine time at our big party!!
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Old 12-04-2002, 11:28 PM   #17
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Re: Re: Marriage

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Originally posted by martha

Marriage isn't about the wedding and the relatives. Marriage is about love and commitment. It's about supporting someone you love when he tries something new, celebrating his success and comforting him through the failures. Then he does the same for you. You can get the same from a relationship, but a marriage means that you've made the commitment to each other.

I've been married for 13 1/2 years. It hasn't been all butterflies and roses, but it's been wonderful! My husband and I are committed to each other's growth as people. We love each other no matter what.
This is perhaps the greatest post that has ever been posted on a message board in the history of the internet. I could not sum up my own views on marriage any better. I know marriage isn't "cool" anymore, but call me out of style. It does mean a lot to my wife and me. It proves our love and loyalty by solidifying our commitment.

If you don't like marriage, don't get married; but people who choose to make such a commitment usually have better reasons than spending money.

~U2Alabama
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Old 12-05-2002, 01:21 AM   #18
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I couldn't agree with martha and bama more.
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Old 12-05-2002, 10:22 AM   #19
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Sure, marriage should be about love, but is that a reason to get married before the state? No. The reason people get "married" in the face of the state and the church is because of all the perks that are given to married couples. Health Insurance, Life Insurance, Hospital visitation rights, blah blah blah.

If it weren't for these things, people would never get married. Therefore, lawyers wouldn't make a killing on divorce cases, child custody hearings, etc. People could still remain loyal without signing a document, but because we are all looking out for #1 and trying to get through life a little bit easier, we bit the line....
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Old 12-05-2002, 11:26 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by Danospano
The reason people get "married" in the face of the state and the church is because of all the perks that are given to married couples. Health Insurance, Life Insurance, Hospital visitation rights, blah blah blah.

If it weren't for these things, people would never get married.
Sorry, Dano, but you're wrong about the majority of people who get married. Those things never crossed my mind when I was contemplating marriage.





PS Thanks, Bama.
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Old 12-05-2002, 11:39 AM   #21
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Sometimes I think after experiencing what marriage was all about I've pretty much became cynical about it, but I wouldnt knock it to other people. I didnt think much about those things Dano mentioned...I was in love. Now, I can hardly wait to be divorced.
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Old 12-05-2002, 12:06 PM   #22
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You disagree that those are main factors? Maybe you're right, but I honestly believe that there would be no REASON to get married before the STATE if those incentives were not included.

Afterall, marriage is a contract between two people, not the government. When you pledge your vows before the courts, you are in a sense playing by their rules. How does love fit into THAT? It seems that by the logic we've agreed upon (see Bama's former post) that love transcends all boundaries. If this is true we certainly do not need a judge or a priest to verify our social contracts......

Let me say it again....the only reason to get MARRIED before the STATE is to reap the benefits it bestows upon it parts.
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Old 12-05-2002, 03:13 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by Danospano
Let me say it again....the only reason to get MARRIED before the STATE is to reap the benefits it bestows upon it parts.
People get married before the state (or church) because it is the way to formally recognize a marriage. How exactly do you "marry" otherwise?
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Old 12-05-2002, 05:28 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by ThatGuy


People get married before the state (or church) because it is the way to formally recognize a marriage. How exactly do you "marry" otherwise?
common-law.
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Old 12-05-2002, 06:54 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by Danospano

Let me say it again....the only reason to get MARRIED before the STATE is to reap the benefits it bestows upon it parts.
Obviously you've never heard of the marriage tax penalty. Single people living together get at least $1000 greater tax credit than married people. Also there is a big Social Security loss if two older people marry. I have a great Aunt that is 89 and she can't marry the man that has lived with her for 5 years because on their limited income they cannot afford the SS cut they would take. The gov't is always taking the moral high ground but doesn't follow up. If Bush really wanted to make a tax cut - this is where he should have started (not the millionaires club, but I digress)

I couldn't agree more with Martha (not suprisingly) and U2Bama (not so surprising either). I've been married for over 15 years and while life has not been Wine & Roses (do I hear Herb Albert & the Tiajuanna Brass), it has been two people trying to survive in this world, trying to reach their goals individually and collectively, and hopefully make a difference while loving each other. Oh yea and pass on a moral and environmental conscience to my offspring. Do I hear an Amen, lol.

Marriage is not a picnic but the rewards are many.

And this is just my .02
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Old 12-05-2002, 07:41 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by RavenStar


common-law.
That's just a legal label imposed by ...? Oh, yes, the STATE! And those states who do recognize commonlaw marriages also afford those couples various rights based on their legal union. Isn't that what Danospano was decrying in the first place?

Besides, the usual way to recognize a change in status is with some sort of ceremony. When you graduate from school do they send you your diploma in the mail and thank you for your time? No, they have a ceremony. Death brings another ceremony, though you won't get to enjoy it very much. When people get married they like to have a ceremony to make it "official," presided over by someone of authority (clergy member, judge, etc.). Since they are presided over by someone with the legal power to marry people, that makes them the legal, state-recognized ceremonies that we were discussing here.


Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine

Obviously you've never heard of the marriage tax penalty. Single people living together get at least $1000 greater tax credit than married people.
Although married folks do get a tax break when they have kids. I've often wondered if the reason for this is to give couples another incentive to reproduce. Maybe that's being too cynical ...
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Old 12-05-2002, 10:54 PM   #27
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To be honest, Danospano, I didn't give any more thought to this "state" concept that you are on to than the 10 minutes my wife and I spent at the courthouse filling out the paperwork. Sure, the Christian/religious ceremony was important to us, but not for the reasons that you mentioned.

~U2Alabama
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Old 12-06-2002, 08:13 AM   #28
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First, I agree 100% with Martha. You said everything that was on my heart regarding this subject.

Second, I´d like to tell you from my own wedding. Luckily enough, we don´t have to do the state thing. The govenment excepts a bahá´í wedding. You might need to know that there are no priests in the bahá´í faith, so when you get married, you do it yourself in front of two witnesses and God. The Baha'i marriage ceremony itself is very simple. All that is required is that the bride and groom each say, in front of witnesses, "We will all, verily, abide by the will of God".

And this is what we did. We rented a small cottage and invited about 12 friends. So it was very personal, intimate. We didn´t want a big, fat wedding, just a small one, because this was for us, not for others. A union between the two of us
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Old 12-06-2002, 06:01 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine
Marriage is not a picnic but the rewards are many.
Very well said.

The world doesn’t promote selfless commitment very well (actually, not at all). As we approach 13 years of marriage, I realize how blessed I am to have a wife who is as equally committed to the marriage as I am.
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Old 12-07-2002, 12:57 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by AM
We didn´t want a big, fat wedding, just a small one, because this was for us, not for others. A union between the two of us

I think my earlier post wasn't really clear on my feelings, and I am afraid people will misinterpret my perspective and think evil thoughts about me! I read a lot of these posts, and AM and I are friends from another room that some people scorn, so I want to state right off the bat I DON'T think this perspective is wrong.

But I do want to say I don't think having a big wedding (with the *right* (<~~~~loaded word) intentions) is wrong either.

My husband and I did want to have a "Big" wedding because we did want to celebrate our union with all our family and friends. We wanted to have the people we loved (all of them from wherever they were in the world) to come and celebrate with us. We had great food, music, everyone partied really late. Yes, it was expensive, and yes many things were a bit frivolous, but we avoided the really commercial stuff like napkins stamped with our names...

Now, I don't think the fact that we had a big party means marriage is some easy fun thing. There are disagreements all the time and we have to work together. But we love each other a lot, and we've been dating since were 16 (we're 27 now) so we had a lot of mutual friends. So while the marriage is just between me and my man, the wedding was something we wanted to share with everyone who had helped us get and stay together.

I hope that sounds like a positive endorsement for marriage for those who feel comfortable with that institution in their private life.

my perspective on the relationship between married couples and the state is a completely different matter.....
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