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Old 03-19-2010, 01:00 PM   #286
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right now Health Care has only 160 yes votes to 207 no votes

they need 216 to prevail

can they get 56 more yes votes in 3 days?

or will only 9 more no votes kill it?

The GOP has the advantage, can Obama and Pelosi pull it off????

Who has courage?: House health-care votes

OK,

since I posted this 20 hours ago the vote has changed
it is now: 167 yes votes to 207 no votes

that is a pick up of 7 for Obama/ Pelosi

to 0 for GOP/ Limbaugh / Beck / Tea Partiers * ( I thought public opinion and momentum was with this side?)

Check vote count here : House health-care votes

*
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:23 PM   #287
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Not sure about the source of your numbers (ie. seems like there is a big discrepancy between it and some other places) but latest from Bloomberg:

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March 19 (Bloomberg) -- U.S. House Democrats, who cleared a big hurdle in their effort to overhaul the health-care system by producing compromise legislation, are picking up fresh support for a showdown vote this weekend.

Democrats need about six more votes from House members to pass the 10-year, $940 billion bill, Obama administration officials said today. President Barack Obama and Democratic leaders aim to sway some in a pool of 14 or 15 undecided lawmakers to get to the 216 votes needed to pass the measure, according to the officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

“We are going to have the votes, when the roll is called,” House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer told reporters today. A vote is scheduled for March 21, leaders said.
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:28 PM   #288
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Washinton Post - the link is in my post

here it is again

Who's in play: House health-care vote washingtonpost.com

I guess they are only counting publicly announced positions?

Do you think Hoyer/the Administration might be padding his numbers, to sway ubdecideds?
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:40 PM   #289
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I don't know how much padding is going on - some to be sure, I'm just saying that the conventional wisdom is closer to this:

Betsy Markey Becomes Third Confirmed No-Yes Vote; Childers a No | FDL News Desk

ie. the WaPo is being extremely conservative, which is probably factually 100% but doesn't reflect the reality on the ground.

This bill will almost certainly pass (not that I think it's particularly inspiring).
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Old 03-19-2010, 02:07 PM   #290
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Markey is included in the 167 yes votes.

After reading your post, I went to Bloomberg and read all the recent 'yes' votes they listed, all were included in the 167 yes votes.


I thouhgt WaPo was missing some, I couldn't find any

I don't see why a Congressman would want to have 'riled up' tea partiers calling and picketing his office to sway an undecided vote, it it has been decided.

However uninspiring this bill is, that last thing we need is a continuation of "hands off" health care. Private sector profiteers going completely unchecked.

If this is as bad as the GOP claims, the public will hate it.

Then why is the GOP not getting out of the way and letting the Dems commit suicide?
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Old 03-19-2010, 02:19 PM   #291
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Originally Posted by deep View Post

However uninspiring this bill is, that last thing we need is a continuation of "hands off" health care. Private sector profiteers going completely unchecked.

If this is as bad as the GOP claims, the public will hate it.

Then why is the GOP not getting out of the way and letting the Dems commit suicide?
This Bill is a start, there is a long way to go, but that's the state of the USA - much like gay marriage, this will take decades to get to where it should be (if ever).

Most of the initial things that will kick in by virtue of this Bill are all "good" things the public will support, the GOP knows that. They're nothing but a party of obstructionists at this point.
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Old 03-19-2010, 02:27 PM   #292
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Most of the initial things that will kick in by virtue of this Bill are all "good" things the public will support, the GOP knows that. They're nothing but a party of obstructionists at this point.


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Old 03-19-2010, 05:37 PM   #293
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David Frum, the traitorous Republican has summed it up rather well:

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It‘s critical for everybody, and not just the President. It‘s critical for us on the Republican side, too. If this thing passes, there is going to be an accountability moment on the Republican side. We had a choice; do we negotiate and try to get some of our values in the bill? Or do we go for total defeat of the President and bet everything on that? I was one of those who said negotiate. That advice was rejected. We went for total defeat of the President. If he prevails, it is going to be a shutout of Republican views in one of the most important pieces of legislation ever passed in the United States.
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Old 03-19-2010, 06:14 PM   #294
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This Bill is a start, there is a long way to go, but that's the state of the USA - much like gay marriage, this will take decades to get to where it should be (if ever).

Most of the initial things that will kick in by virtue of this Bill are all "good" things the public will support, the GOP knows that. They're nothing but a party of obstructionists at this point.
Exactly.

When Anthem can just after recording record profit decide to up rates in the area of 30%, something NEEDS to be done. Obama has been gracious in listening to Republican views, but they are just sticking their fingers in their ears like petulant 2 year olds.

I hope this passes, because it's a long needed first step in reforming a corrupt system.
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Old 03-19-2010, 06:21 PM   #295
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I am in CA, we are 13+ per cent of the U S population.

The Anthem/ Blue Cross price bump is 39%.

I pay $500 a month for a high detuctable, HSA policy.

I pay the first $3500 and then 20% until I pay $5000 out of pocket a year.

That is with a $6000 a year premium.($500 a month) $6000 plus $3500 = $9500 before my insurance partially kicks in.

They still want to raise my premium $2400 a year more.

Why? Because they can. Health Ins Companies are exempt from fair trade/ anti trust laws. They have legal monopolies now.
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Old 03-19-2010, 06:49 PM   #296
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David Frum, the traitorous Republican has summed it up rather well:


The GOP are playing the part of the Sunnis.
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Old 03-19-2010, 07:13 PM   #297
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This deal is done. Deem and pass will not be needed.
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Old 03-19-2010, 07:50 PM   #298
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It's really sad that those in poverty and low income situations are made to rely on "charity" to access even a mediocre standard of health care, when in many other countries (and we manage it just fine, why can't the supposedly greatest nation in the world do it?) it's a right of all citizens, regardless of employment situation or income level.

But it's okay to demean them further. They're only poor people. They're obviously mismanaging their lives, and as such, they're not as deserving. Make them jump through hoops and beg for it!
Well that's a hoot considering the "many other countries" that provide health care do so out of the "charity" of United States citizens which pay for the security of the free world.
And you're welcome by the way.
Quote:
Rank Country Spending ($ b.) World Share (%)
— World Total 1464.0 100
1 United States 607.0 41.5%
2 China 84.9 5.8
3 France 65.7 4.5
4 United Kingdom 65.3 4.5
5 Russiaa 58.6 4.0
6 Germany 46.8 3.2
7 Japan 46.3 3.2
8 Italy 40.6 2.8
9 Saudi Arabia 38.2 2.6
10 India 30.0 2.1
11 South Korea 24.2 1.7
12 Brazil 23.3 1.6
13 Canada 19.3 1.3
14 Spain 19.2 1.3
15 Australia 18.4 1.3
And because universal health care "works" for a country of 35,000,000 does not mean it will function as smoothly in a country of 300,000,000.

Finally, if health care is a right then surely food and shelter are a right. So I take it Canada has no homeless shelters, missions, food banks, clothing drives, soup kitchens or other such degrading "hoops" as we here in the States cruelly subject our needy to?
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Old 03-19-2010, 08:31 PM   #299
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Well that's a hoot considering the "many other countries" that provide health care do so out of the "charity" of United States citizens which pay for the security of the free world.
And you're welcome by the way.
Yes, we should all contribute equally; we all have the exact same threat levels against us.

Because we Canadians have a history of meddling in other people's business, overthrowing LEGITIMATE AND ELECTED leaders overseas in coup after coup, supporting oppressive dictatorships out of our own interests, invading countries pre-emptively on false premises, and on and on. What a joke.
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Old 03-19-2010, 11:19 PM   #300
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meddling in other people's business, overthrowing LEGITIMATE AND ELECTED leaders overseas in coup after coup, supporting oppressive dictatorships out of our own interests, invading countries pre-emptively on false premises, and on and on.
The History Of United States Militarism And Imperialism

by anitram

"Finally we learn who the real evil empire is."
--Mikhail Gorbachev
"I gotta make this movie!"
--Michael Moore
"A manifesto of America's arrogance. I'm fired up and ready to go apologize around the world."
--President Barack Obama
"How's my hair look?"
--John Edwards
"I ask you Mr. and Mrs. America... how do you look in the mirror each morning? Have you no shame? No guilt? No... dare I say it... soul worth saving?"
--Keith Olbermann
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