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Old 08-17-2009, 04:10 PM   #346
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Who has the kind of money to invest in HSAs, 529 plans for each of your child's college educations, and 401K plans for retirement?

There is a reason why so many elderly people lived in poverty prior to the introduction of the 1930s welfare state. That kind of self-centered conservative fantasy is wholly unrealistic.
And most people didn't go to college then, so there wasn't even that expense.
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:11 PM   #347
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Why do people fear that word so much? I bet that 90% of people don't even know what it really means.
Ya-huh, we do so know. It means NAZI! Duh!
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:16 PM   #348
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Who has the kind of money to invest in HSAs, 529 plans for each of your child's college educations, and 401K plans for retirement, in the face of stagnating wages and uncertain long-term market returns? Chains of violent market bubbles and bursts aren't exactly good for long-term investors.
And it's only going to get harder as we pile more and more debt on future generations.
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:22 PM   #349
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And it's only going to get harder as we pile more and more debt on future generations.
Gotta pay for that war somehow.

Oops, wrong thread.
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:23 PM   #350
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Very good point and one that is often forgotten. I was reminded of it when Wal*Mart of all companies came out in favor of mandatory employer-provided health care insurance. Why Wal*Mart? Well, they know they can absorb the costs better than smaller companies and should those smaller companies go under that's less competition for Wal*Mart. Yes it's true, big business loves to use big government to limit competition.
Of course big business also loves to use small government to limit competition (they generally like deregulation of a given industry right? Doesn't this go back to the days of Teddy Roosevelt and his trustbusting?). Big buisness could care less about ideology--at the end of the day its all about the bottom line, as I suppose it should be in business.

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Interesting that the AMA, Pharma (a coalition of drug companies) and the insurance industry is all onboard with Obama and a larger government role.
Really? I didn't know this. In what sense would you say they are on board with Obama? Because a lot of the stuff I read on some of the current proposed legislation would not be good or insurance companies. I imagine they're definitely "on board" now that Obama has started backpedaling away from a public option. Mandatory health insurance is something they WOULD love as long as it didn't involved some massive government run competitor.

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So why not cut out the middleman or third-party, be it the inefficiencies and lobbyists of government or the profit model of private insurance, and buy most of your health care directly with your own money?
This sounds a bit like one of Melon's ideas--getting rid of the insurance industry all together. I found it intriguing but I doubt it would ever happen and even if it did, it would be a bumpy painful road to get there.
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:26 PM   #351
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Ya-huh, we do so know. It means NAZI! Duh!
Nazi, also known as the National Socialist German Workers' Party I believe.
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:32 PM   #352
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Nazi, also known as the National Socialist German Workers' Party I believe.


but, seriously though, you do know that facism and socialism aren't the same thing though. It's like the old name for East Germany--the German Democratic Republic. Just because it had the words "democratic" and "republic" in it didn't mean that's what it was actually about.
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:34 PM   #353
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Nazi, also known as the National Socialist German Workers' Party I believe.
Oh, c'mon. Anybody with any political knowledge whatsoever knows that the Nazi party is far right while socialism, specifically democratic socialism, is moderately left. What one party in Germany decided to call themselves doesn't change that.
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:35 PM   #354
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You heard it here young, healthy Obama supporters. HSA's are "great" for you -- but guess who wants to legislate them out of existence?
Guess how practical they are? How much were you able to set aside day one out of college?

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Unless you've been contributing to one for 20 years and now have that reserve should you need it. The stock market sucks too if you've only been in it the past 5 years. But if one has been making steady contribution for the past 30 years you're still way ahead.
Oh the privelaged few...
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:41 PM   #355
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Oh, c'mon. Anybody with any political knowledge whatsoever
Just stop right there. Rush claimed just today that the left shares with Hitler more than anyone else, so any historical knowledge or what you call "facts" are useless.
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:42 PM   #356
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Just stop right there. Rush claimed just today that the left shares with Hitler more than anyone else, so any historical knowledge or what you call "facts" are useless.
I don't even know what to say to that.

How do people swallow this shit? Seriously?
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:44 PM   #357
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Rush claimed just today that the left shares with Hitler more than anyone else
Then it must be true.
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:44 PM   #358
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Just stop right there. Rush claimed just today that the left shares with Hitler more than anyone else, so any historical knowledge or what you call "facts" are useless.
He did not.

Did he really say that?

Seriously?
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:45 PM   #359
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He did not.

Did he really say that?

Seriously?
Yep, he did indeed.
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Old 08-17-2009, 04:49 PM   #360
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Well, Rush may have said it, but I still wonder what Indy's point was. He knows that it's two different ends of the political spectrum (he does know, right?), and he knows that we're more politically aware than your average person out there, and that we know too...so what was the point of that statement?
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