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Old 09-12-2007, 10:54 AM   #16
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And about freaking time.


fair enough.

i cannot take issue with this logic.

(though, honestly, you do see how this imposes an anxiety over size)
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Old 09-12-2007, 10:54 AM   #17
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basically, if it becomes commonplace, we'll know who's hung and who's not.
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Old 09-12-2007, 10:58 AM   #18
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Absolutely. Although not genitalia, it's certainly an anxiety women have had to live with forever, in many ways almost our sole definition and worth. Kind of brings it down to our level a tad. So my sympathy is tempered.

Besides I'm curious.
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Old 09-12-2007, 11:03 AM   #19
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i was in the pool!!!
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Old 09-12-2007, 11:03 AM   #20
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Absolutely. Although not genitalia, it's certainly an anxiety women have had to live with forever, in many ways almost our sole definition and worth. Kind of brings it down to our level a tad. So my sympathy is tempered.


yes, but one can diet and work out.

one cannot improve on one's penis.
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Old 09-12-2007, 12:02 PM   #21
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Then they'll have to hope they are being judged for their acting skill and not their penis size. If we're going for a more realistic cinema, then an audience will have to grow up enough to know there are variations. Women certainly do.
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Old 09-12-2007, 12:11 PM   #22
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Then they'll have to hope they are being judged for their acting skill and not their penis size. If we're going for a more realistic cinema, then an audience will have to grow up enough to know there are variations. Women certainly do.


fair point.

harvey keitel, for example, seems perfectly fine with this.
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Old 09-12-2007, 12:13 PM   #23
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Perfect example.
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Old 09-12-2007, 12:24 PM   #24
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Originally posted by Irvine511
yes, but one can diet and work out.
Only to a point. Much of what's conventionally seen to make a naked female body highly attractive (large perky boobs, long legs with the "right" curvature, a tight rounded butt) is in fact genetically determined--simply being toned and thin won't give you those things. Of course there are surgical "enhancements" available for breast and butt "problems" but then there are for penises too.
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Old 09-12-2007, 12:29 PM   #25
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Only to a point. Much of what's conventionally seen to make a naked female body highly attractive (large perky boobs, long legs with the "right" curvature, a tight rounded butt) is in fact genetically determined--simply being toned and thin won't give you those things. Of course there are surgical "enhancements" available for breast and butt "problems" but then there are for penises too.


i'm sure there are things that can be done to "enhance" the size of a penis, especially on celluloid, but i can lose 20 lbs, i can't gain 3 inches, and i'd argue that there's a wider variety of "right" female forms -- we've talked about Beyonce and J-Lo -- than there is for a penis where either it's big, or it isn't. (and then there's the whole circumscision issue).

i also don't think you can compare breast implants to penile implants, in terms of success or safety. maybe if there were a sudden demand for men to have tight jeans and bursting packages you might see some advancements, but the way it is right now, breast implant are relatively safe and common and as such are well-researched and funded by doctors who know what they are doing. penile implants are not.
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Old 09-12-2007, 12:47 PM   #26
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Agreed about the difference in safety of implants (though the differential "demand" factor you mentioned may itself play into that) and the circumcised aesthetic. And true, some starlets are quite voluptuous--though as you've noted elsewhere, in practice there seems to be a racial component to who can "get away with" that. But what makes you assume there's not a corresponding variety of admired male forms? Certainly I think straight women appreciate more than one type of male body shape (so long as it's toned, if we're talking celluloid "ideals") and of course that includes more components than just penis length--butt shape, torso shape, shoulders and arms for example.
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Old 09-12-2007, 12:48 PM   #27
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icky.

dbs
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Old 09-12-2007, 12:58 PM   #28
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icky.

dbs


you know you're curious.
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Old 09-12-2007, 01:05 PM   #29
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But what makes you assume there's not a corresponding variety of admired male forms? Certainly I think straight women appreciate more than one type of male body shape (so long as it's toned, if we're talking celluloid "ideals") and of course that includes more components than just penis length--butt shape, torso shape, shoulders and arms for example.

i thought we were talking about penises?

as for male forms, i think there are a wide variety of "types" that are appreciated -- one just has to peruse, for example, gay culture to learn all about twinks, daddies, bears, geeks, A&F boys, jocks, etc. -- and i think that's also true for women.

i'd argue that there are a great variety of women wit a great variety of shapes -- from swanlike Gwyneth to voluptuous Catherine Zeta-Jones or Rachel Weisz -- to other women who are attractive, certainly, but not pin-ups, nor do they have to be (Cate Blanchette, Jodie Foster, Meryl Streep) because they are all considered thespians first and foremost. since they are on stage and on camera, there's a basic level of attractiveness, of course, and that's true for men as well -- hello, Daniel Day-Lewis -- but their looks are secondary to their talents.

what we're getting at, i think, and what i think many women justly feel irritated by, is the pin-up tits-n-ass type girl who's on al the magazine covers. what Britney was. what Jessica Alba is. and the reason why we see more of this type of girl is because men are more visual (like why there's more pornography). but these women aren't usually taken seriously as artists. these women are there to mostly provide masturbation material for men.
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Old 09-12-2007, 01:25 PM   #30
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I just want to know how many men who think the full frontal male nudity is "icky" would also say that the full female nudity is icky. Is the icky strictly looking at another guy's penis? I guess the disempowering would involve losing that control, women have had to lose it for years.

Personally I think what is left to the imagination is always the sexiest. After shows like that HBO show (I am going by the description, I am HBOless unfortunately), what is left? I prefer love scenes that are more discreet and nudity that is the same. If not done a certain way it all starts to look like porn and just so mechanical and lacking in a certain humanity. I saw Viggo on GMA this morning and as he explained it, his full frontal nudity was necessary for the story. There is a fight in a bathhouse, and the towel would not stay on during a fight. And Viggo strikes me as the type of guy whose sense of manhood is not at all tied into his size-for whatever that's worth. That is a man.
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