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Old 11-18-2003, 09:14 PM   #16
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That's not what the stas are saying. The reservist will not be supporting Bush as they have supported Rep. in other elections.

http://www.informationclearinghouse....rticle5242.htm

18 November 2003: ( The Independent) Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, launched a stinging attack on President George Bush last night, denouncing him as the "greatest threat to life on this planet that we've most probably ever seen".

His provocatively timed comments, on the eve of Mr Bush's arrival in London tonight, threaten to create severe embarrassment for the Prime Minister. They also come with talks under way on whether to re-admit Mr Livingstone to the Labour Party before his five-year exile ends.

Although he made his many differences with the Government on a range of issues clear, he reserved his strongest comments for the American President in an interview with The Ecologist magazine.

The President's three-night trip, which will culminate on Friday with a visit to the Prime Minister's Sedgefield constituency, has sparked a flood of protests from those opposed to his foreign policy. But Mr Livingstone's outburst makes him one of the most high-profile and explicit of his critics.

Mr Livingstone recalled a visit at Easter to California, where he was denounced for an attack he had made on what he called "the most corrupt and racist American administration in over 80 years". He said: "Some US journalist came up to me and said: 'How can you say this about President Bush?' Well, I think what I said then was quite mild. I actually think that Bush is the greatest threat to life on this planet that we've most probably ever seen. The policies he is initiating will doom us to extinction."

...

The Mayor's comments will infuriate Downing Street at a time when No 10 is examining ways of bringing Mr Livingstone, who was expelled from the Labour Party for standing as an independent in the London mayoral elections of 2000, back into the fold.

AS THE PRESIDENT PREPARES TO VISIT SEDGEFIELD, TONY BLAIR'S CONSTITUENCY, WILL HE BE WELCOME?

Chris Lloyd, political editor of The Northern Echo: "The paper is Bush neutral and he has a right to visit but equally, the people here have a right to demonstrate. I hope he gets to see all, or at least some of those protests and I hope Mr Blair will explain what they are about because that's what friends are for. Despite Mr Bush's unpopularity, there is a frisson of excitement because nothing of this magnitude has ever happened there."

...

.

Mayor of London, says Bush is 'greatest threat to life on planet'

By Nigel Morris, Home Affairs Correspondent

18 November 2003: ( The Independent) Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, launched a stinging attack on President George Bush last night, denouncing him as the "greatest threat to life on this planet that we've most probably ever seen".

His provocatively timed comments, on the eve of Mr Bush's arrival in London tonight, threaten to create severe embarrassment for the Prime Minister. They also come with talks under way on whether to re-admit Mr Livingstone to the Labour Party before his five-year exile ends.

Although he made his many differences with the Government on a range of issues clear, he reserved his strongest comments for the American President in an interview with The Ecologist magazine.

The President's three-night trip, which will culminate on Friday with a visit to the Prime Minister's Sedgefield constituency, has sparked a flood of protests from those opposed to his foreign policy. But Mr Livingstone's outburst makes him one of the most high-profile and explicit of his critics.

Mr Livingstone recalled a visit at Easter to California, where he was denounced for an attack he had made on what he called "the most corrupt and racist American administration in over 80 years". He said: "Some US journalist came up to me and said: 'How can you say this about President Bush?' Well, I think what I said then was quite mild. I actually think that Bush is the greatest threat to life on this planet that we've most probably ever seen. The policies he is initiating will doom us to extinction."

Mr Livingstone, who is holding a "peace party" for anti-war groups in City Hall tomorrow, added: "I don't formally recognise George Bush because he was not officially elected. So we are organising an alternative reception for everybody who is not George Bush."

He said he supported stronger links between European Union countries only because he wanted to see a powerful bloc emerge to rival the United States. "The American agenda is sweeping everything before it, and although it's not perfect, the EU is better on environmental issues. It's a less rapacious form of capitalism."

The Mayor said he had viewed Labour's 1997 election manifesto as a "load of old guff they'd come out with because they didn't want to upset the Daily Mail" that would rapidly be ditched. "I was amazed when it transpired that Blair had been serious," he said.

Accusing Mr Blair of suffering from a "background problem", he said: "There is nothing in his past that was radicalising. He wasn't interested in all the great student activities, the radical campaigns.

"He did not get involved in politics until the 1970s, when the high point was passed. So you have someone of the summer of '68 generation who actually wasn't part of it."

On GM foods, he said: "If the Government ignores public opinion, then civil disobedience on this issue is legitimate, as long as it's not violent.

"But the most important thing that affects a government is not peaceful protest, but fear of the ballot box.

The Mayor's comments will infuriate Downing Street at a time when No 10 is examining ways of bringing Mr Livingstone, who was expelled from the Labour Party for standing as an independent in the London mayoral elections of 2000, back into the fold.

AS THE PRESIDENT PREPARES TO VISIT SEDGEFIELD, TONY BLAIR'S CONSTITUENCY, WILL HE BE WELCOME?

Chris Lloyd, political editor of The Northern Echo: "The paper is Bush neutral and he has a right to visit but equally, the people here have a right to demonstrate. I hope he gets to see all, or at least some of those protests and I hope Mr Blair will explain what they are about because that's what friends are for. Despite Mr Bush's unpopularity, there is a frisson of excitement because nothing of this magnitude has ever happened there."

Lucy Hovvels, vice-chairwoman of Sedgefield constituency and Labour councillor in Trimdon: "I've had local people asking where they can get Union Jacks and American flags because they think it's an exciting and historic visit. I really believe Bush will get a warm welcome in Trimdon and the mood is one of excitement. We have the two most important people in the world coming to us - no one would otherwise know where Trimdon is."

Richard Wanless, co-ordinator of the 'Sedgefield Against War' protest: "The visit is a massive security risk and for those living in the area, it jeopardises our safety. No matter where he goes, there will be protests from London to the North-east to make sure he knows he is not welcome. To me, he is a war criminal that has illegal occupation of Iraq. To add to the insult, there are families here who lost their children to the war."

The Rev Martin King, rector of Sedgefield: "A lot of people here are very angry with the way the US administration is putting itself above the law. One person in my congregation said if President Bush wanted to look around the church, he would be welcome because it is a place for sinners, but he hoped his henchmen would leave their ironware at the door. His policies are very unwelcome in the region - I have not heard anyone voicing support for him."
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Old 11-18-2003, 10:20 PM   #17
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And just watch as Bush's military approval rating crashes as Iraq becomes more and more like Vietnam with every passing day. As unfortunate as this will be, I can see a US military body count over 1000 before this is through if the terror tactics continue as they have been. For our insulated and soft generation (which has not known intensive warfare, and with it's high standard of life makes death and killing that much more traumatic) combined with the pride of the US military this could turn sour on Bush very quickly.
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Old 11-18-2003, 10:22 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine
That's not what the stas are saying. The reservist will not be supporting Bush as they have supported Rep. in other elections.

http://www.informationclearinghouse....rticle5242.htm

18 November 2003: ( The Independent) Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, launched a stinging attack on President George Bush last night, denouncing him as the "greatest threat to life on this planet that we've most probably ever seen".

Um, 6 million Jewish souls may have something to say about that. Let's keep things in perspective. Enough of the vicious liberal rhetoric.
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Old 11-18-2003, 11:14 PM   #19
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The Military as whole strongly voted for Bush in the 2000 election and has continued to support him ever since. Bush's strongest voting block of any group is the Military, especially the Marines. Two of my Marine Corp Officer friends, both Combat veterans of the latest war in Iraq, talked at length 3 weeks ago with me about their disdain for the unobjective reports by liberal media about their work in Iraq, and their disdain for the Democratic Presidential Candidates who opposed the war. They both hope that Bush is re-elected and are shocked that he has a tough battle ahead of him to be re-elected, especially considering his excellant policies in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Bush has signifcant opposition to him, but it does not come from the US Military which is probably his #1 base of support.

As for the Mayor of London, with comments like that, he is, sucking up to someone politically, a Joker, or not very well informed on international issue's.
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Old 11-18-2003, 11:21 PM   #20
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Originally posted by STING2
As for the Mayor of London, with comments like that, he is, sucking up to someone politically, a Joker, or not very well informed on international issue's.
It's more than that. Comments like that from the mayor of a world capitol are sensational and irresponsible.
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Old 11-18-2003, 11:22 PM   #21
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"And just watch as Bush's military approval rating crashes as Iraq becomes more and more like Vietnam with every passing day. As unfortunate as this will be, I can see a US military body count over 1000 before this is through if the terror tactics continue as they have been. For our insulated and soft generation (which has not known intensive warfare, and with it's high standard of life makes death and killing that much more traumatic) combined with the pride of the US military this could turn sour on Bush very quickly."


63% of Americans still support the removal of Saddam from power with US Military force. Only under the most GROSS of all Generalizations could one compare the current conflict in Iraq with Vietnam. Over the past 8 months, 295 US Military personal have been killed by hostile fire in Iraq. When my Father was in Vietnam in 1968, 300 US Military personal were killed every WEEK!
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Old 11-18-2003, 11:31 PM   #22
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Originally posted by wolfwill23
Enough of the vicious liberal rhetoric.
Welcome back Mr. Limbaugh.
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Old 11-18-2003, 11:46 PM   #23
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Originally posted by sue4u2


Welcome back Mr. Limbaugh.
How else would you define that statement? Is it vicious? Yes. Is it a liberal point of view spoken by a liberal? Yes.
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Old 11-19-2003, 12:07 AM   #24
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While we have your attention, Mr President...

From The Guardian Webpage


60 Brits and Americans write letters to George on the eve of his 1st state visit....


My favorite....

Dear Mr President,

Today you arrive in my country for the first state visit by an American president for many decades, and I bid you welcome.

You will find yourself assailed on every hand by some pretty pretentious characters collectively known as the British left. They traditionally believe they have a monopoly on morality and that your recent actions preclude you from the club. You opposed and destroyed the world's most blood-encrusted dictator. This is quite unforgivable.

I beg you to take no notice. The British left intermittently erupts like a pustule upon the buttock of a rather good country. Seventy years ago it opposed mobilisation against Adolf Hitler and worshipped the other genocide, Josef Stalin.

It has marched for Mao, Ho Chi Minh, Khrushchev, Brezhnev and Andropov. It has slobbered over Ceausescu and Mugabe. It has demonstrated against everything and everyone American for a century. Broadly speaking, it hates your country first, mine second.

Eleven years ago something dreadful happened. Maggie was ousted, Ronald retired, the Berlin wall fell and Gorby abolished communism. All the left's idols fell and its demons retired. For a decade there was nothing really to hate. But thank the Lord for his limitless mercy. Now they can applaud Saddam, Bin Laden, Kim Jong-Il... and hate a God-fearing Texan. So hallelujah and have a good time.
Frederick Forsyth
Novelist
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Old 11-19-2003, 01:31 AM   #25
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Welcome to the forum SouthPark(R)
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Old 11-19-2003, 03:33 AM   #26
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Originally posted by STING2
"Saddam is out of power in Iraq and he is not coming back." Sorry "if" that bothers anyone.
Oh I love it, the "if you oppose Bush then you must support Saddam" crowd are back. For the record though, many of us demonstrating against Bush were opposing Saddam back when Rumsfeld was shaking his hand and promising him weapons.

And Sting, you know as well as anyone that he's not just here to discuss international issues, he's done that on two previous occassions. He's here for a state visit which serves no purpose other than giving him some nice pics for his re-election campaign.
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Old 11-19-2003, 07:07 AM   #27
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Seems like there are more armed men from Scotland Yard (almost all men from Scotland Yard) and Policemen (50% of Londons Policemen) necessary to protect Mr. Bush than there are British troops (or even non US troops?) in Iraq. And the costs for the british tax-payer are approx 8.450.000 $.
43 % Think that Mr. Bush should come, immerhin 36% would prefer if he didn't come -- imho still a extremely high number if you keep in mind that Britain is the closest ally of the US and the question wasn't if they support him, but just if they want him to visit their country.
Mr Bush welcomes free speech, but only in the prepared free speech zones, so that he dosn't have to see or to hear the protests. And yes, Mr. Bush dosn't want to speak in front of the British parliament because protests are likely.
So i think when the visit was planed several months ago it might have bin planed as a victory-celebration of the Iraq-war, they maybe wanted to show the TV audience that they were right. Now they have to hide from public because AlQuaida is a bigger threat to the US president than 1 year ago.

I hope that noone gets hurt during this visit.

Klaus
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Old 11-19-2003, 07:34 AM   #28
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I'm not quite sure what Mr Livingstone hoped to achieve or whether he would really believe W is the biggest threat. But then, who knows what people define as a threat.
As for the original post about the 16,000 police and 7 million pounds it is costing to protect a man people hate, why is it not possible for it to be 16,000 police officers and 7 million pounds to protect a man many support? Naturally not the people protesting, but there are people out there who support Bush. Anyways. I hate the media enough without debating semantics.
The 2 other things which I strongly disagree with is Mr Forsyth's ascertation that the British left are naturally supporters of men such as Saddam, Bin Laden and Kim Jong-ll. Likewise STING2 that people who are protesting are automatically for Hussein. How on earth does this conclusion keep getting reached?
Honestly! Grossly inaccurate assumptions they are. It is more plausible to assume that anyone who is protesting a war is therefore against all violence of which there is no credible cause for. That would in my mind, include men who begin a war without a moral and legal right (according to the arguments the 'left' put forward) PLUS ruthless dictators. Not one or the other.
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Old 11-19-2003, 08:11 AM   #29
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...I strongly disagree with is Mr Forsyth's ascertation that the British left are naturally supporters of men such as Saddam, Bin Laden and Kim Jong-ll. Likewise STING2 that people who are protesting are automatically for Hussein. How on earth does this conclusion keep getting reached?
Bringing down a W statue ala the Saddam statue doesn't help.
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Old 11-19-2003, 08:21 AM   #30
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Simply out of interest, where did you hear that? For what it's worth I dont agree with that happening, for many reasons, not just because my dislike of anything would lead me to such acts of vandalism.
But wolfwill, the question still remains, for these who will be knocking down this statue as well as the countless others who wont, how does this equal they would support Hussein? It's a counter action only to demonstrate a point. It doesn't indicate these guys are against Saddam's removal. Remember its the war they're protesting, not Hussein's removal.
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