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Old 12-21-2005, 09:44 AM   #16
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You aren't required to go to public school. Home school and private schools are options.


you are required to go to some sort of school, and the public schools are funded by taxes in order to educate students.

not everyone can afford private school and not everyone wants to be homeschooled, and more impotantly, there are millions of American kids who go to decent public schools, like i did, who simply don't need or want to have to deal with superstitions in a science classroom.
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Old 12-21-2005, 09:47 AM   #17
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you are required to go to some sort of school, and the public schools are funded by taxes in order to educate students.

not everyone can afford private school and not everyone wants to be homeschooled,
Isn't that were the school voucher program comes into play?
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Old 12-21-2005, 09:53 AM   #18
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Isn't that were the school voucher program comes into play?


depends on the city.

it might be a way to "punish" public schools by removing students and their funds who disagree with non-theocratic teaching. i also think that "no child left behind" has much to do with the voucher program -- by requiring high standards, and then refusing to fund the schools to meet these standards, the Bush administration has essentially set up thousands of public schools to fail, and to then be labled "failing," thus creating a greater sense of urgency on the "need" for vouchers so that parents might remove their children from "failing" schools.

it's ingenous, really, if one's long term goal is not just the dismatnling of the Department of Education, but public education itself.
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Old 12-21-2005, 10:00 AM   #19
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While I'm not crazy about tax dollars being used to teach ID/religion, I do think that if a class on ID is offered, it should be a philosophy class, not a science class, and taking it should be an elective, not a requirement.
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Old 12-21-2005, 10:33 AM   #20
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While I'm not crazy about tax dollars being used to teach ID/religion, I do think that if a class on ID is offered, it should be a philosophy class, not a science class, and taking it should be an elective, not a requirement.


would you support the same elective classes on Hindu theories of reincarnation, as well as other religion's explanations of the origin of life? why should ID get preferential treatment than other religious myths?
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Old 12-21-2005, 12:23 PM   #21
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would you support the same elective classes on Hindu theories of reincarnation, as well as other religion's explanations of the origin of life?
Sure, why not? Those would be very interesting classes. I like learning about what other societies believe. Just keep them where they belong (social studies, or whatever) and don't offer them as science.

In fact, I think a "religions of the world" class would be a cool thing to take. As an American I'd welcome the chance to learn more about other societies, because we can be a little isolated when it comes international things.
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Old 12-21-2005, 01:07 PM   #22
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Sure, why not? Those would be very interesting classes. I like learning about what other societies believe. Just keep them where they belong (social studies, or whatever) and don't offer them as science.

In fact, I think a "religions of the world" class would be a cool thing to take. As an American I'd welcome the chance to learn more about other societies, because we can be a little isolated when it comes international things.



in the context of a religion class, i totally agree.
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Old 12-21-2005, 01:26 PM   #23
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I took a religions of the world type class when I went to a Catholic college, I loved it. And trust me, it/the professor NEVER made any type of value judgment about any of the other religions. My CCD ed and upbringing didn't expose me to much about other religions. I think it's one way to open up kids' eyes to other religions and other ways of thinking.
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Old 12-21-2005, 02:16 PM   #24
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I went to a Catholic school all the way up to University and in high school we were required to take "World Religions" - it was a mandatory course for everyone.
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Old 12-21-2005, 02:19 PM   #25
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I went to a Catholic school all the way up to University and in high school we were required to take "World Religions" - it was a mandatory course for everyone.


ah yes ... know thy enemy.









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Old 12-21-2005, 02:25 PM   #26
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it wasn't like that at all Irvine, I was never taught there or anywhere else that they were my "enemy"
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Old 12-21-2005, 02:31 PM   #27
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it wasn't like that at all Irvine, I was never taught there or anywhere else that they were my "enemy"


i was kidding
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Old 12-21-2005, 04:30 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by cydewaze
While I'm not crazy about tax dollars being used to teach ID/religion, I do think that if a class on ID is offered, it should be a philosophy class, not a science class, and taking it should be an elective, not a requirement.
this is exactly where the discussion belongs...in a philosophy class. Anyone who thinks schools are opposed to God should go to philosophy classes. God is constantly mentioned. Some of the greatest philosophers ever believed in some sort of God; some didn't.
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Old 12-21-2005, 05:10 PM   #29
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this is exactly where the discussion belongs...in a philosophy class. Anyone who thinks schools are opposed to God should go to philosophy classes. God is constantly mentioned. Some of the greatest philosophers ever believed in some sort of God; some didn't.
If a PhD mathmetician theorizes that evolution is mathematically impossible, does this still belong in a philosophy/religion class? Can science handle the questioning?
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Old 12-21-2005, 05:21 PM   #30
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If a PhD mathmetician theorizes that evolution is mathematically impossible, does this still belong in a philosophy/religion class? Can science handle the questioning?

simply because there might be questions about evolution, and that the theory itself might well evolve, this still has nothing to do with theistic claims of a grand designer. such a claim by a PhD would remain rooted in and of science, not of philosophy or theology, and would thereby have a place in a science class. if such results by a PhD mathematician were then appropriated by ID proponants as proof of ID, based upon their premise that any questions or alterations of Evolution become de facto evidence of ID have misunderstood, entirely, how science works

the judge says this perfectly: "ID is at bottom premised upon a false dichotomy, namely, that to the extent evolutionary theory is discredited, ID is confirmed." what ID proponants have done is create what's been called a "contrived dualism"—the bogus assumption that "all scientific evidence which fails to support the theory of evolution is necessarily scientific evidence in support of creationism."

at the end of the day, the PhD mathematician is not testing ID; he is testing evolution.
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