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Old 04-08-2004, 01:46 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader
Newspapers publish only a fraction of what is out there.

The LA Times is very selective in how it presents the news.
Ok then.


Can anyone give us a link to this from anywhere that is a news outlet and not a flag-waving conservative message board?
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Old 04-08-2004, 02:14 PM   #17
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I have not heard the quote, nor will I go looking for it, but I have to ask, would it be absurd for a 'foreigner' to characterize people like Pat Robertson, Al Sharpton, or Lewis Farrakhan as "legitimate" voices of America?

I only ask because I find the word legitimate very ambiguous.

The most basic definition is "authentic" which you can pretty much chyaracterize any human being as.

I weigh what Kerry is saying versus what Bush is doing. The only thing I see Bush doing is tripping over his own feet in Iraq. I won't even mention the words domestic issues here.


For me there is no choice.
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Old 04-08-2004, 02:20 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by ouizy

I weigh what Kerry is saying versus what Bush is doing. The only thing I see Bush doing is tripping over his own feet in Iraq. I won't even mention the words domestic issues here.


For me there is no choice.
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Old 04-08-2004, 02:24 PM   #19
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We would be better off ignoring Sadr?
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Old 04-08-2004, 02:29 PM   #20
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We would not be better off ignoring Sadr, but if you would like me to get radical we would be better off changing our assassination laws.

If the US's goals in Iraq were really to rid the country of Saddam Hussein and his close loyal followers, we could have done that with tactical, surgical strikes that bombed these men from above.

We would not need to risk the lives of thousands of Americans in a guerilla war that is now taking place on the ground by disparate groups, of which we are not even sure if they are friends or foes.

This 'after-war' war was not planned for and now we are stuck knee deep in shit.

There are two ways out of this:

One, we pack up and leave, thus leaving the country a wasteland that we created, or two we stay the course (which will take much longer than Bush will be in office) and we risk thousands of lives, and millions in resources in a country where we are not wanted by its citizens, its rivals, or its neighbors.

A lose-lose situation, and one that was created by our government.
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Old 04-08-2004, 02:31 PM   #21
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LOL.

I meant that sarcastically.

I think Sadr is, in fact, a voice we should be listening to. We should not be ignoring people like him. Iraqi people are listening to him, and for that reason so should we--so we know what people are thinking and hearing, so we can hopefully defuse dangerous situations before it is too late.

I think that is probably what John Kerry meant.

And, ouiz, you're right about this being a no-win situation. I hate to make comparisons to Vietnam, because no doubt our troops have done a lot of good, too. And I have humanitarian leanings, and I love to hear that schools have been reopened and hospitals repaired and the like. But I wonder if we aren't squandering all the progress if we made, if these few small steps forward actually turn out to be some huge steps back. It's becoming painfully obvious that the architects of this war really thought there would be no Iraqi insurgency, that they would just roll over and die at the sight of the first plane or tank, that the Shia and the Sunni and the Kurds would all of a sudden start playing nice. I'm not seeing how there were plans made for an afterwar, which is especially shameful, since I know lots of people thought this was a very real possibility.
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Old 04-08-2004, 02:33 PM   #22
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ahhhh OK
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Old 04-08-2004, 02:38 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
I did say he wanted to take it back. I can picture his advisor waving franticly NO NO NO as it was a phone interview if I am not mistaken.
Dread, just listen to it on the link deep provided. You've got a quote out of context. It was nothing like you are picturing.
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Old 04-08-2004, 03:12 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by paxetaurora


I think Sadr is, in fact, a voice we should be listening to. We should not be ignoring people like him. Iraqi people are listening to him, and for that reason so should we--so we know what people are thinking and hearing, so we can hopefully defuse dangerous situations before it is too late.

I think that is probably what John Kerry meant.
Absolutely. This is exactly how I took the quote and I think the right are going overboard with this quote.
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Old 04-08-2004, 03:19 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by paxetaurora
I think Sadr is, in fact, a voice we should be listening to. We should not be ignoring people like him. Iraqi people are listening to him, and for that reason so should we--so we know what people are thinking and hearing, so we can hopefully defuse dangerous situations before it is too late.
A voice we should be listening to, or a person whose influence we should understand.

If he is spewing out anti-American, anti-semetic rhetoric, I'm not sure how much "listening" we should do.
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Old 04-08-2004, 03:32 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


A voice we should be listening to, or a person whose influence we should understand.

If he is spewing out anti-American, anti-semetic rhetoric, I'm not sure how much "listening" we should do.
I "listen" to Bush's rhetoric it doesn't mean I believe or follow it. I listen to understand.
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Old 04-08-2004, 03:39 PM   #27
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If you are putting GWB on al-Sadr's level, then there is no point to "listening" to either of them....
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Old 04-08-2004, 03:49 PM   #28
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Still waiting for a news link.


Or was the quote that started this taken out of context?
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Old 04-08-2004, 03:54 PM   #29
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Originally posted by nbcrusader
If you are putting GWB on al-Sadr's level, then there is no point to "listening" to either of them....
Oh now you're stretching...

No I was just defining the word listen. I believe one can listen without prescribing to their logic or beliefs.
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Old 04-08-2004, 04:11 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by joyfulgirl


Dread, just listen to it on the link deep provided. You've got a quote out of context. It was nothing like you are picturing.
I listened to the link. If you listen further he basically says this man should not be arrested.

The fact that the words left his mouth, and that he corrected himself. I said that in my post.

He is not a voice, nor a legitimate one, that ANYONE who represents me should be listening too.

I first posted about al-Sadr last year. The administration waited TOO long to deal with him.

Whoever Kerry has surrounded himself with should be fired.
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