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Old 04-05-2006, 01:34 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by AussieU2fanman
If ANYBODY saw Jesus defy ANy law of physics, do you really think they'd be yelling 'Crucify him!!!' at his trial?
Yes. You have to think back to a time when science was superstitous, diseases were attributed to demons, etc.

No matter how well intentioned the miracles, it would be seen as a threat or attributed to evil by some.

People don't like what they can't explain or control.
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Old 04-05-2006, 02:09 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by Zoomerang96
(though by the same token, tell me anyone else who allegedly has?)
Ric Ocasek is the second coming!!



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Old 04-06-2006, 02:56 AM   #18
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does it actually really matter?
people who are truly believing in their religion shoudl not be shaken by the possibility that not everything can be taken literaly in the bible. maybe he did, maybe he didn't -> is it that important to the idea?

as an atheist is regard that the fact the obviously was able to look past scarres and predjuces (lepras etc) and treat them with respect, the bigger miracle.
In my opinion also a bit more important to the whole development of the ideas of christianity than wallking on water, turning water intgo whine and other "miracles"
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Old 04-06-2006, 05:43 AM   #19
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I like the walking on water story better than the walking on ice one.
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Old 04-06-2006, 02:26 PM   #20
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not only did Jesus walk on ice, but Judas was a good guy:


[q]Judas did not betray Jesus, lost gospel claims
By Jenny Booth

An ancient manuscript written in Egypt in 300AD purports to show that Judas Iscariot was not the betrayer who sold Jesus to his enemies for 30 pieces of silver, as the bible says.

The apocryphal account of the last days of Jesus's life portrays Judas as a loyal disciple, who followed Jesus's orders in handing him over to the authorities and thus allowed him to fulfil the biblical prophecies of saving mankind.

The fragile 31-page document, which has had a chequered history since it was discovered near Beni Masar in Egypt in the 1970s, was put on show for the first time this afternoon at the National Geographic Society in Washington, along with an English translation.

It is believed to be a copy of a still earlier Gospel of Judas, which may have been written about 150 years after Jesus's death by Coptic scholars.

[...]

The story it tells is strongly at variance with the Church's official line on the death of Christ, making Judas Jesus's closest friend.

"The Gospel of Judas turns Judas’ act of betrayal into an act of obedience," said Craig Evans, the Payzant Distinguished Professor of New Testament at Acadia Divinity College in Wolfville, Nova Scotia.

"The sacrifice of Jesus’ body of flesh in fact becomes saving. And so for that reason, Judas emerges as the champion and he ends up being envied and even cursed and resented by the other disciples."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...121611,00.html

[/q]
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Old 04-06-2006, 06:11 PM   #21
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That actually makes a lot of sense to me. Even as literature, that was the one dynamic that always bewildered me. Such a sketchily drawn character for the arch villain of Christianity. It was the one relationship in the Bible I mull over and over, the one relationship I was enthralled by, and this article is relatively close to what I was thinking anyway--although I've heard it somewhere before.
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Old 04-06-2006, 09:22 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by Headache in a Suitcase

(I'm suddenly getting those guilty, laughing-at-something-Jesus feelings.)

The other issue here is that he lived in the MIDDLE EAST. Is ice ever really an issue in these parts?
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Old 04-06-2006, 11:01 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by angelordevil
The other issue here is that he lived in the MIDDLE EAST. Is ice ever really an issue in these parts?
Freezing temperatures are not unheard of. But it takes quite a bit to freeze over a lake as suggested.
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Old 04-07-2006, 09:13 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by a-mole

as an atheist is regard that the fact the obviously was able to look past scarres
Uh-huh
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Old 04-07-2006, 10:21 AM   #25
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uhm sorry.. taht was some seriously bad spelling/ writing on my part

"As an atheist I regard the fact the he obviously was able to look past scares etc..."

I hope now it is better understandable
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Old 04-07-2006, 11:29 AM   #26
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I curious to hear what the Vatican's response will be to the gospel of Judas finding.
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Old 04-07-2006, 10:13 PM   #27
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Maybe he was clubbing baby seals at the same time

As you read this e-mail, Canadian fishermen are clubbing and shooting to death thousands of baby seals for their fur. Last week, The Humane Society of the United States was in the Gulf of St. Lawrence, documenting the first phase of Canada’s annual commercial seal hunt. We were there to expose this cruelty to the world as part of our campaign to stop the hunt once and for all.

Today, I want to update you on the dramatic events that have unfolded during the first weeks of the hunt.

Update from the Ice
While in the icy waters of the Gulf, my team of observers and members of the media riding in our boats were continually harassed by sealers. Here is just a glimpse of what our dedicated team of experts witnessed and endured:



*Warning: This video contains some graphic images

The ProtectSeals Team catches Canadian fishermen in acts of aggression against both seals and humans.
*Warning: This video contains some graphic images


* On the second day of the hunt, a sealing boat rammed one of our small inflatable boats, forcing it onto the ice, damaging the propeller, and endangering the lives of all aboard.

* Later in the day, two other sealing vessels repeatedly charged at our inflatable boats, putting all observers at risk of capsizing. When the captain of The HSUS’s nearby vessel twice radioed the Canadian Coast Guard -- which was patrolling the waters ostensibly to ensure the safety of both sealers and observers -- for help, his calls were ignored.

* After a sealing vessel chased down one of our small boats and forced it to maneuver quickly to avoid being crushed into the ice, officers of the Department of Fisheries and Oceans emerged from the vessel’s cockpit and arrested our team for allegedly violating the terms of our observation permits by supposedly coming within 10 meters of a sealing vessel. Seven legally permitted observers, including representatives of The HSUS and one media representative, were detained, and our footage of the hunt was immediately confiscated.

* Although no charges have been filed against the observers, Canada's Minister of Fisheries and Oceans has announced that The HSUS will not be allowed to observe the rest of the seal hunt. Right now we are exploring all legal options available.

But here's the real tragedy in this story. Yesterday, the hunt in the Gulf resumed, and it is estimated another 70,000 seals will be clubbed and shot to death over the next few days in this second phase of the hunt. Seals are dying at this moment by the tens of thousands, just for their fur. And by the time this year’s hunt closes in May, more than 325,000 baby seals will be dead in total, each one sacrificed for the relatively few dollars furriers pay for their skins.
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Old 04-08-2006, 03:57 AM   #28
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cows are dying at this very moment
so are rabbits, foxes and whatever anymal is used for cloth production (leather and furr)
but I am sure killing seals is the worst because they are the cutest

though i must admit i do not get why still use archaic methods and make the animals suffer unneseccarily

anyways.. how has jesus walking over water/ ice in the middle east to do with baby seals?
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Old 04-08-2006, 05:59 AM   #29
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If there was an abundance of seals then nobody would have an objection to it, but many species are endangered, it has nothing to do with cuteness. And yeh, streamlining the whole killing process to make sure there is as little as possible pain is essential I think.

EDIT : LOL just realised that this has nothing to do with Jesus walking on ice. Only a FYM interference thread could start off about Jesus walking on ice and end up about steamlining killing processes for various animals used for food/clothing.
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Old 04-08-2006, 04:45 PM   #30
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hehe
that was my original point exactly

just needed to throw some fuel in anyways
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