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Old 08-14-2003, 07:59 PM   #31
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Well, let me put it this way; the first half of Gladiator was historically accurate (except the fact that Aurelius wanted to restore the republic, all evidence suggests that he wanted the line of Emperors to continue, especially if you read his 'Meditations'), I thought. The second half was totally made up, though it had historical background. ie - Emperor Commodus was in fact assasinated by an athlete, but not by Maximus Decimus Meridius. I also studied Ancient Roman history, though I didn't think it was 'that' inaccurate.

I wouldn't have thought the Italians liked the movie much, it was filmed in Malta.


Razors pain you; Rivers are damp;
Acids stain you; And drugs cause cramp.
Guns aren't lawful; Nooses give;
Gas smells awful; You might as well live.

Dorothy Parker, 'Resumé'
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Old 08-14-2003, 09:00 PM   #32
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I'll be damned if I even really remember "Gladiator". I'm atrocious at remembering stuff from movies and plays. There was no way in hell that Aurelius wanted to bring back the Republic. I remember thinking that someone had read too much Tacitus! Good movie, though. I do remember that.

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Old 08-15-2003, 04:30 PM   #33
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Originally posted by Anthony

Its funny that you mention 'The Patriot', since I have issues with that film as well. Yes, I do blame the screenwriter more than the director, I just found it funny that Mel Gibson starred in two very large films that outright demonised the British. Randal Wallace is truly horrendous; from Braveheart to the bastardization of the 'Man in the Iron Mask', to the laughable 'We Were Soldiers' and not to mention the calamity that 'Pearl Harbour' was. I am acquainted with his work all too well, unfortunately.

I myself enjoyed 'Braveheart' thoroughly, I just thought it had not only mild historical inaccuracies, but some pretty wild ones. Wallace dying on the same day as King Edward? Wallace impregnating the Queen of England? The constant demonising of King Edward (including my favourite, him throwing his son's gay lover out the window) where the only real historical evidence about the man shows him as a reasonable, logical and even 'just' man. I just thought the constant and hugely irreverent demonising of the British was not only uneccessary, but detrimental to the historical integrity of the film. I enjoyed the film, I would have 'loved' the film had it been braver when it came to showing what we have record of. Yes, the poem is the only 'real' evidence of Wallace ever existing, and it was ultimately based on that, but if a film is meant to be 'historical', I think it should atleast try not to take too many liberties.

My fear is that Mel Gibson seems to enjoy demonising certain parties, and, while I'll admit that 'Braveheart' and 'The Patriot' are movies more prone to Hollywood sensationalism, I fear that his directing will demonise certain parties in 'The Passion'. It would be a shame if this were to happen.

I didn't think 'Elizabeth' was all that bad, to be honest. Being a fan of Roman history though, I thought 'Gladiator' was a gem. Yes, there were plenty of inaccuracies, but none of them were that far from the recorded truth.
Well, Gibson didn't have anything to do with the production of "The Patriot", all he did was star in it. I guess you could say he picked it because he liked how it demonized the English, but I can't see alot of big actors turning down that part.

I agree that the British were ridiculously portrayed in "The Patriot" but I never thought they were too bad in "Braveheart." I'd have to watch the movie again because my memory is fuzzy. I'm not saying it was accurate, but England doesn't exactly have a stellar record in Scotland or Ireland. And humanity wasn't exactly looking it's kindest in the late 13th century, but that could just be me.

I always took Edward I's death scene with a grain of salt. He was in very bad health for much of his life. We don't see him die, so maybe he rebounded. I seem to remember reading some unfavorable things about him, mostly regarding his activities in Scotland and Wales. But that is from the point of view of the conquered. Didn't he order his body boiled until only bones were left, so he could be carried at the front of the army everytime Scotland resisited?

I never had a big problem with the Queen Isabella love plot, if only because she was the "She-Wolf of France" and her exploits (romantic and otherwise) were pretty legendary. But my liking to see a obscure Queen doesn't really excuse fiction, LOL.

My Roman history professor *hated* "Gladiator" but I always liked it. "Elizabeth" was just too horrible. Her life is interesting enough without adding poisoned gowns. I don't remember much of that film, just that I yelled at the t.v. screen the whole time...I should refresh my memory.
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Old 08-15-2003, 11:46 PM   #34
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August 12, 2003

WIESENTHAL CENTER URGES MEL GIBSON TO MAKE CHANGES TO THE PASSION; Jewish Human Rights Group Receives Flurry of Phone Calls and Hate Mail Accusing Jews of Killing Jesus

Rabbi Marvin Hier, dean and founder of the Simon Wiesenthal Center said that the controversy over Mel Gibson’s yet-to-be released film, The Passion, has generated an unprecedented wave of hate mail and calls to the Jewish human rights group over the Center’s endorsement of changes to the film proposed by Christian and Jewish scholars.

Included in one of the letters that the Wiesenthal Center received soon after the film was screened in Colorado Springs, Colorado, the writer said in part, “…What this tells me is that you do not want the real truth to be shown on a public setting that will remind millions of Americans that the jews were in fact totally responsible for the death of Jesus Christ.”

The letter continued, “I don’t endorse terrorism of any kind but the odds are that some of these enlightened folks will go for the throat of you jews and some of your offices of hate such as the ADL main office in New York, or maybe even the Simon Wiesenthal Center. Every time I hear of a suicide bomber killing jews in Israel I think to myself YES!”

“We fully understand that the crucifixion is central to the belief of more than a billion Christians and in no way do we want to impede Mr. Gibson’s right to make a film,” said Rabbi Hier. “However, we urge that he make some of the changes suggested to him by the distinguished group of Catholic and Jewish experts in the field to help ensure that the Jewish people are not yet again falsely singled out as being responsible for the death of Jesus,” Hier concluded.

The Center is also seeking a dialogue with leading Christian leaders to discuss the matter further.

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