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Old 10-09-2003, 05:17 PM   #61
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Amna,

The Majority of people in Israel do not agree with you. They support Sharon. They also know its not been proven beyond any reasonable doubt that he was responsible for what happened in Lebanon. I have read plenty about it, but the evidence is still not 100% conclusive. The Israely people knew all about it before they had the opportunity to vote for him and they decided that Sharon would make a good leader. So far Sharon has maintained his support.

If Israel is not a democracy then there is no such thing as democracy anywhere. Most people including most Israely's consider Israel to be a democracy.

Israel today has the 22nd highest standard of living in the world, while the Occupied Palestinian Territories is at #98 and Syria is at #110. Israel continues to defend itself against Barbaric acts which target innocent civilians. Palestinians and Syrians continue to support these Barbaric acts despite the fact that their people continue to live in poor conditions relative to Israel. When are they going to focus their energy on improving the Standard of Living where they live instead of wasting their energy on trying to kill Israely teens in disco's. Where is the Arab and Palestininian NON-VIOLENT movement? 50 years of war and terrorism has not achieved anything for the Palestinians and Arabs. After 50 years of no progress and in fact, having loss ground, isn't it time they adopted a new strategy that actually has a chance to achieve their goals of and independent Palestine and a better standard of living for their people. Israel has achieved its goals of an independent state. They have one of the highest standards of living in the world. When are Arabs and Palestinians going to realize that if they want to achieve their goals, they will have to switch from the 50 year policy of war and terrorism to a policy of non-violent protest and investment in their childerns future instead of using them to blow up Disco's in Israel.

Arabs and Palestinians can achieve an independent state for Palestine and a better standard of living for their people, but it means giving up investing in the failed policies of the past 50 years and investing in policies of non-violent action that actually have a chance of achieving their goals. It means educating their childern instead of brainwashing (75 Virgins) them to commit suicide while in the process of killing innocent people.

The arguement that they commit suicide bombings because of the conditions they live in is a flawed one, because most people in Sub-Saharan Africa live in far worse conditions, yet they don't strap bombs to themselves to go kill innocent people.
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Old 10-09-2003, 05:28 PM   #62
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sting, how can they achieve a better standard of living if every shcool is demolished... ???

The condiditions in the occupied area is not like of that of most countries in the Sub Saharan region.... There are Israeli soldiers running the way of life in the occupied areas... They are demolishing the homes of innocent and building massive houses for Israelis.....

Maybe we ourselves should go to these places before we judge how bad it is... Sting, it is easy for us to assume how bad it is, when we have all that we need, isn't it?

think again,
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Old 10-09-2003, 05:35 PM   #63
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by the way, why is Israel the highest standard of living?
doesn't that tell you something... take a minute, and think about that..
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Old 10-09-2003, 05:37 PM   #64
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Amna,

There are 90 countries around the world that have standards of living far worse than the Palestinians. Many of them are in Africa. Yet the people in those countries don't strap bombs to themselves to go out and kill people that have nothing to do with their problems.

If anything Israely soldiers would be a good thing to have in one's neighborhood. Many countries in Africa have not law enforcement of any kind in their towns. If you think Anarchy is better than Martial Law, take a look at Somalia. Most Palestinians given the opportunity to live in Somalia or Palestine would continue to live in Palestine.

Every school is not demolished in the Occupied territories. If Palestinians did not commit terrorism, no homes or schools would be demolished.
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Old 10-09-2003, 05:39 PM   #65
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O, and how do you react to the murder of 3,ooo women and children by Sharon's order?
I mean, doesn't it phase u?
what about the killings of the many innocent children and women in the west banks, which numers def. surpass those in Israel??? Doesn't that alarm you?

It freaken gets me upset that Israeli's and Palestinians are killing themselves, because Sharon is directing it to be that way..

Beleive me, that standard of living has a whole lot of money to spend on killing...
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Old 10-09-2003, 05:40 PM   #66
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O, and how do you react to the murder of 3,ooo women and children by Sharon's order?
I mean, doesn't it phase u?
what about the killings of the many innocent children and women in the west banks, which numers def. surpass those in Israel??? Doesn't that alarm you?

It freaken gets me upset that Israeli's and Palestinians are killing themselves, because Sharon is directing it to be that way..

Beleive me, that standard of living has a whole lot of money to spend on killing... AND THAT IS BARBARIC.
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Old 10-09-2003, 05:41 PM   #67
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Amna


"by the way, why is Israel the highest standard of living?
doesn't that tell you something... take a minute, and think about that.."

Because its a stable, market oriented, democracy, that has successfully defended itself against Violent attacks against its existence for over 50 years with aid from the United States.

Syria and Palestine could achieve independence and improve their living conditions if they stopped wasting their resources on unproductive actions i.e attacking Israel and committing terrorism.
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Old 10-10-2003, 12:13 AM   #68
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correction: Syria is independent

secondly, Palestine would probably be able to achieve something close to democracy, if , and only if some of the basic fundamental ways of living were accesable..

take for instance: water, education, and hospitals (these have been cut-off)

without these, a democracy can not be reached. Only frusturation and anger can be developed.

what is needed is not the IDF but UN peace keeping troops... The IDF , and many soldiers (in interviews), have stated that the reason why the join is for revenge. hmmmmmmmmm, revenge is not needed, esp. if you are going to kill innocent lives.

btw, why haven't you answered my questions above. (Sabra and Shatilla question) ?

Africa is suffering a great deal, and I only wish that the money that has been iinvested in Israel and Egypt and other countries would go to Africa... I'm telling you, This world is sooooooo freaken racist against most of Africa...

I admire how South Africa has conquered the Apartheid; and I only wish the Muslim world could rellate and aspire to how Mandela dealt with the situation... However, this conflict (arab-israeli) is still very different then any of the issues in Africa.
Africa has suffered a great deal. However, america has equiped Israel, and sharon (and others) have had the adventage of placing Palestinians in camps, and have taken their lives in the hands of frusturated soldiers... this conflict is very different, i don't think it should be compared to other conflicts... if we are to compare all conflicts through eachother, we would fail in finding a solution for each one... cuz, each situation has its own dynamics and conditions to the problem, thus, own solutions...
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Old 10-10-2003, 02:05 AM   #69
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Amna,

You neglect the fact that the Israely people know full well of what some have accused Sharon of and the fact is that there is no conclusive evidence that proves Sharon was responsible for the massacre. But some people hate others so much that they are willing to accuse them of things that have not been proven. The Israely public is different and considered these things and elected Sharon and have kept him as their leader.

Water, education, and hospitals have not been cut off. Yes maybe during extreme events caused by Palestinian terrorism, but in general these things are available. While things may not be great in the Occupied Palestinian Territories, the Standard of living in Occupied Palestine at #98 is better than the standard of living in INDEPENDENT Syria #110 and INDEPENDENT Iran #106.

The IDF does not target innocent civilians. The terrorist Organizations specifically target innocent civilians.

The aid money the USA has sent Israel over the past 50 years has helped to prevent the Jews in Israel from being slaughtered in a way not seen since the Genocide that killed 6 million Jews during World War II from happening again. It is money that has saved lives and prevented a massacre. This is money that has been well spent. Keeping peace between Israel and Egypt is certainly another fact that the money sent to both countries has been well spent.

Once again, Israel has accepted Peace Plans unlike the Palestinians. The Palestinians have never accepted a peace plan. The Palestinians continue to support terrorism and the TARGETING of innocent human life. As long as the Palestinians continue to do this and do not develop a policy of Non-violent Action similar to what MLK did for African Americans, Palestinians will never achieve and independent State or a better standard of living.

Don't believe me, then take a look at where Terrorism and war has taken Palestinians over the past 50 years. Has it achieved and independent Palestine? No? Has it helped achieve a better Standard of Living? No

So get the young future terrorist to take the table cloth looking mask off their face and get them fixing and helping problems in their local communities instead of strapping their bodies with bombs to try and kill people that have nothing to do with any of their problems.

If Palestinians ever want to have and Independent State and a better standard of living, they have to give up terrorism and war. Israel is to strong and will never be defeated by those things. Is it to much to ask that after 50 years that they realize this and turn their energy into task (Non-Violent action and negotiation) that can achieve and Independent State and a better Standard of Living?
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Old 10-10-2003, 02:57 PM   #70
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water, and many schools (most schools), have been cut off.

o, and what was the outline for the peace treaty... and yes, Sharon has gone against the outline... He is still demolishing homes left and right and rebuilding homes for Israeli occupation...

I agree that the terrorism has to stop, but as long as the IDF commits crimes against them, then it won't stop.

Ummm, i don't know how accurate those statistics you have are... In Iran, it is very much a developing state with a high level of education rate, and a developing democracy.... Just out of curiosity, where did u get those statistics, and what are they based on.
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Old 10-10-2003, 03:01 PM   #71
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We know by reason of the fact that certain utilities are cut off from the Palestine b/c adventerous journalists dear to cross the boarders.. However, if Amnesty, the UN peacekeeping troops, and the Red Cross aren't allowed in there, how are people like you and every other American suppose to know what is going on... See, we have to put the extra effort into researching these things.

Our media isnt' that free, believe me.
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Old 10-10-2003, 05:08 PM   #72
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Amna,

My statistics on Standard of living come from from the HUMAN DEVELOPMENT REPORT for 2003. It is based on the following:


MONITORING HUMAN DEVELOPMENT: ENLARGING PEOPLEíS CHOICES . .
1 Human development index
Life expectancy at birth (years)
Adult literacy rate (% age 15 and above)
Combined primary, secondary and tertiary gross enrolment ratio (%)
GDP per capita (PPP US$)
Life expectancy index
Education index
GDP index
Human development index (HDI) value
GDP per capita (PPP US$) rank minus HDI rank
2 Human development index trend
Human Development Index
3 Human and income poverty: developing countries
Human Poverty Index (HPI-1) rank
Human Poverty Index (HPI-1) value
Probability at birth of not surviving to age 40 (% of cohort)
Adult illiteracy rate (% age 15 and above)
Population without sustainable access to an improved water source
Children under weight for age (% under age 5)
Population living below $1 a day (%)
Population living below $2 a day (%)
Population living below the national poverty line (%)
HPI-1 rank minus income poverty rank
4 Human and income poverty: OECD, Central & Eastern Europe & CIS
Human Poverty Index (HPI-2) rank
Human Poverty Index (HPI-2) value
Probability at birth of not surviving to age 60 (% of cohort)
People lacking functional literacy skills (% age 16-65)
Long-term unemployment (as % of labour force)
Population living below 50% of median income (%)
Population living below $11 a day (1994 PPP US$)
Population living below $4 a day (1990 PPP US$)
HPI-2 rank minus income poverty rank

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

. . . TO LEAD A LONG AND HEALTHY LIFE . . .
5 Demographic trends
Total population (millions)
Annual population growth rate (%)
Urban population (as % of total)
Population under age 15 (as % of total)
population over age 65 (as % of total)
Total fertility rate (per woman)
6 Commitment to health: access, services and resources
Population with access to improved sanitation (%)
Population with sustainable access to an improved water source (%)
Population with sustainable access to affordable essential drugs (%)
One-year-olds fully immunized against tuberculosis (%)
One-year-olds fully immunized against measles (%)
Oral rehydration therapy use rate (%)
Contraceptive prevalence rate (%)
Births attended by skilled health personnel (%)
Physicians (per 100,000 people)
Public health expenditure (as % of GDP)
Private health expenditure (as % of GDP)
Health expenditure per capita (PPP US$)
7 Leading global health crises and challenges
Undernourished people (as % of total population)
Children underweight for age (% under age 5)
Children under height for age (% under age 5)
Infants with low birthweight (%)
People living with HIV/AIDS, adults (age 15-49)
People living with HIV/AIDS, women (age 15-49)
People living with HIV/AIDS, children (age 0-14)
Malaria cases (per 100,000 people)
Tuberculosis cases (per 100,000 people)
Cigarette consumption per adult (annual average)
8 Survival: progress and setbacks
Life expectancy at birth (years)
Infant mortality rate (per 1,000 live births)
Under-five mortality rate (per 1,000 live births)
Probability at birth of surviving to age 65, female (% of cohort)
Probability at birth of surviving to age 65, male (% of cohort)
Maternal mortality ratio reported (per 100,000 live births)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

. . . TO ACQUIRE KNOWLEDGE . . .
9 Commitment to education: public spending
Public expenditure on education (as % of GDP)
Public expenditure on education (as % of total government expenditure)
Public expenditure on education, pre-pimary and primary (as % of all levels)
Public expenditure on education, secondary (as % of all levels)
Public expenditure on education, tertiary (as % of all levels)
10 Literacy and enrolment
Adult literacy rate (% age 15 and above)
Youth literacy rate (% age 15-24)
Net primary enrolment ratio (%)
Net secondary enrolment ratio (%)
Children reaching grade 5 (%)
Tertiary students in science, math and engineering (as % of all tertiary students)
11 Technology: diffusion and creation
Telephone mainlines (per 1,000 people)
Cellular subscribers (per 1,000 people)
Internet users (per 1,000 people)
Patents granted to residents (per million people)
Receipts of royalties and license fees (US$ per person)
Research and development (R&D) expenditures (as % of GDP)
Scientists & engineers in R&D (per million people)

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. . . TO HAVE ACCESS TO THE RESOURCES NEEDED FOR A DECENT STANDARD OF LIVING . . .
12 Economic performance
GDP (US$ billions)
GDP (PPP US$ Billion)
GDP per capita (US$)
GDP per capita (PPP US$)
GDP per capita annual growth rate (%)
GDP per capita, highest value (PPP US$)
GDP per capita, year of highest value
Average annual change in consumer price index (%)
13 Inequality in income or consumption
Survey Year
Share of income or consumption (%) - Poorest 10%
Share of income or consumption (%) - Poorest 20%
Share of income or consumption (%) - Richest 20%
Share of income or consumption (%) - Richest 10%
Inequality measures - Ratio of richest 10% to poorest 10%
Inequality measures - Ratio of richest 20% to poorest 20%
Inequality measures - Gini index
14 The structure of trade
Imports of goods and services (as % of GDP)
Exports of goods and services (as % of GDP)
Primary exports (as % of merchandise exports)
Manufactured exports (as % of merchandise exports)
High-technology exports (as % of merchandise exports)
Terms of trade (1980=100)
15 Flows of aid from DAC member countries
16 Flows of aid, private capital and debt
ODA received (net disbursements) Total (US$ millions)
ODA received (net disbursements) per capita (US$)
ODA received (net disbursements) (as % of GDP)
Net foreign direct investment inflows (as % of GDP)
Other private flows (as % of GDP)
Total debt service (as % of GDP)
Total debt service (as % of exports of goods and services)
17 Priorities in public spending
Public expenditure on education (as % of GDP)
Public expenditure on health (as % of GDP)
Military expenditure (as % of GDP)
Total debt service (as % of GDP)
18 Unemployment in OECD countries
Unemployed people (thousands)
Unemployment rate (% of labour force)
Average annual unemployment rate (% of labour force)
Female unemployment rate as % of male rate
Youth unemployment rate (% of labour force aged 15-24)
Female youth unemployment rate as % of male rate
Long-term unemployment (as % of total unemployment): Female
Long-term unemployment (as % of total unemployment): Male

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

. . . WHILE PRESERVING IT FOR FUTURE GENERATIONS . . .
19 Energy and the environment
Traditional fuel consumption (as % of total energy use)
Electricity consumption per capita (kilowatt-hours)
GDP per unit of energy use (PPP US$ per kg of oil equivalent)
Carbon dioxide emissions - Per capita (metric tons)
Carbon dioxide emissions - Share of world total (%)
Ratification of environmental treaties - Cartagena Protocol on Biosafety
Ratification of environmental treaties - Framework Convention on Climate Change
Ratification of environmental treaties - Kyoto Protocol to the Framework Convention on Climate Change
Ratification of environmental treaties - Convention on Biological Diversity

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

. . . PROTECTING PERSONAL SECURITY . . .
20 Refugees and armaments
Internally displaced persons (thousands)
Refugees by country of asylum (thousands)
Refugees by country of origin (thousands)
Conventional arms transfers (1990 prices) - Imports (US$ millions)
Conventional arms (1990 prices) - Exports (US$ million)
Conventional arms transfers (1990 prices) - Exports share (%)
Total armed forces Thousands
Total armed forces Index (1985=100)
21 Victims of crime

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

. . . AND ACHIEVING EQUALITY FOR ALL WOMEN AND MEN
22 Gender-related development index
Gender-related development index (GDI) rank
Gender-related development index (GDI) value
Female life expectancy at birth (years)
Male life expectancy at birth (years)
Female adult literacy rate (% age 15 and above)
Male adult literacy rate (% age 15 and above)
Female combined primary, secondary and tertiary gross enrolment ratio (%)
Male combined primary, secondary and tertiary gross enrolment ratio (%)
Female estimated earned income (PPP US$)
Male estimated earned income (PPP US$)
HDI rank minus GDI rank
23 Gender empowerment measure
Gender empowerment measure (GEM) rank
Gender empowerment measure (GEM) value
Seats in parliament held by women (as % of total)
Female legislators, senior officials and managers (as % of total)
Female professional and technical workers (as % of total)
Ratio of estimated female to male earned income
24 Gender inequality in education
Female adult literacy rate (% age 15 and above)
Adult literacy rate (female as % of male)
Female youth literacy rate (% age 15-24)
Youth literacy rate (female as % of male)
Female primary net enrolment ratio
Primary net enrolment ratio (female as % of male)
Female secondary net enrolment ratio
Secondary net enrolment ratio (female as % of male)
Female tertiary gross enrolment ratio
Tertiary gross enrolment ratio (female as % of male)
25 Gender inequality in economic activity
Female economic activity rate (% age 15 and above)
Female economic activity rate (index, 1990=100, age 15 and above)
Female economic activity rate (as % of male rate, age 15 and above)
Female employment in agriculture (as a % of female labour force)
Male employment in agriculture (as a % of male labour force)
Female employment in industry (as a % of female labour force)
Male employment in industry (as a % of male labour force)
Female employment in services (as a % of female labour force)
Male employment in services (as a % of male labour force)
Female contributing family workers (as % of total)
Male contributing family workers (as % of total)
26 Gender, work burden and time allocation
27 Women's political participation
Year women received right to vote
Year women received right to stand for election
Year first woman elected (E) or appointed (A) to parliament
Women in government at ministerial level (as % of total)
Seats in lower house or single house held by women (as % of total)
Seats in upper house or senate held by women (as % of total)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

HUMAN AND LABOUR RIGHTS INSTRUMENTS
28 Status of major international human rights instruments
International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination
International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights
International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights
Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination Against Women
Convention Against Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment
Convention on the Rights of the Child
29 Status of fundamental labour rights conventions
Freedom of association and collective bargaining - Convention 87
Freedom of association and collective bargaining - Convention 98
Elimination of forced and compulsory labour - Convention 29
Elimination of forced and compulsory labour - Convention 105
Elimination of discrimination in respect of employment and occupation - Convention 100
Elimination of discrimination in respect of employment and occupation - Convention 111
Abolition of child labour - Convention 138
Abolition of child labour - Convention 182

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BASIC INDICATORS FOR OTHER UN MEMBER COUNTRIES
30 Basic indicators for other UN member countries

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

MDG Indicators
MDG1 Goal 1: Eradicate extreme poverty and hunger - Goal 2: Achieve universal primary education
Population living below $1 a day (%)
Poverty gap ratio (%)
Share of poorest 20% in national income or consumption (%)
Children under weight for age (% under age 5)
Undernourished people (as % of total population)
Net primary enrolment ratio (%)
Children reaching grade 5 (%)
Youth literacy rate (% age 15-24)
MDG2 Goal 3: Promote gender equality and empower women
Ratio of girls to boys, in primary education
Ratio of girls to boys, in secondary education
Ratio of girls to boys, in tertiary education
Ratio of literate females to males (age 15-24)
Female share of non-agricultural wage employment (%)
Seats in parliament held by women (as % of total)
MDG3 Goal 4: Reduce child mortality - Goal 5: Improve maternal health
Under-five mortality rate (per 1,000 live births)
Infant mortality rate (per 1,000 live births)
One-year-olds fully immunized against measles (%)
Maternal mortality ratio (per 100,000 live births)
Births attended by skilled health personnel (%)
MDG4 Goal 6: Combat HIV/AIDS, malaria and other diseases
HIV prevalence among pregnant women aged 15-24 (%), in major urban areas
HIV prevalence among pregnant women aged 15-24 (%), outside major urban areas
Condom use at last high-risk sex (% age 15-24), female
Condom use at last high-risk sex (% age 15-24), male
Orphans' school attendance rate as % of non-orphans'
Malaria-related mortility rate (per 100,000), all ages
Malaria-related mortility rate (per 100,000), children aged 0-4
Malaria cases (per 100,000 people)
Children under 5 with insecticide-treated bed nets (%)
Children under 5 with fever treated with anti-malarial drugs (%)
Tuberculosis-related mortality rate (per 100,000 people)
Tuberculosis cases (per 100,000 people)
Tuberculosis cases detected under DOTS (%)
Tuberculosis cases cured under DOTS (%)
MDG5 Goal 7: Ensure environmental sustainability: land and air
Land area covered by forests (%)
Ratio of protected area to surface area
GDP per unit of energy use (PPP US$ per kg of oil equivalent)
Carbon dioxide emissions per capita (metric tons)
Consumption of ozone-depleting chlorofluorocarbons (ODP metric tons)
MDG6 Goal 7: Ensure environmental sustainability: water and sanitation
Population with sustainable access to an improved water source, rural (%)
Population with sustainable access to an improved water source, urban
Urban population with access to improved sanitation (%)
MDG7 Goal 8: Develop a global partnership for development: development assistance and market access
MDG8 Goal 8: Develop a global partnership for development: landlocked countries and small island developing states
MDG9 Goal 8: Develop a global partnership for development: debt sustainability
MDG10 Goal 8: Develop a global partnership for development: work opportunities, access to drugs and access to new technologies
Youth unemployment (% of labour force aged 15-24), total
Youth unemployment (% of labour force aged 15-24), female
Youth unemployment (% of labour force aged 15-24), male
Population with sustainable access to affordable essential drugs (%)
Telephone mainlines and cellular subscribers (per 100 people)
Internet users (per 100 people)
Personal computers in use (per 100 people)
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Old 10-10-2003, 05:19 PM   #73
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Amna,

When it comes to accurate statistics, you will not find any better than those from the UNDP. Iran may be developing, but its still behind even the Palestinian Occupied Territories in terms of standard of living.

The IDF does not commit crimes against the Palestinians. Yes there are accidents, but if it was the IDF's goal to kill innocent Palestinians, it would only take a few weeks for the IDF to kill everyone on the West Bank.

The Peace Plan gave the Palestinians 98% of everything they wanted and they rejected it. The Partition plan back in 1948 would have given the Palestinians 50% of the land and instead they rejected that and invaded Israel with Armies from 5 Arab countries. The Palestinians have not accepted a single Peace Plan EVER!

"water, and many schools (most schools), have been cut off."

Palestinians in the Occupied Territories have a better Standard of Living than those who live in Iran. The Palestinian Occupied Territories have the #98 standard of living in the world while Iran has the #106 standard of living in the world.
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Old 10-10-2003, 11:59 PM   #74
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Israel has accepted a Peace Plan???? Words don't speak, action does.... Do you consider continuing to build Israeli homes in place of Palestinian homes, accepting the Peace plan? This is what is also igniting frusturation in the West Bank....


With the number of accidents that the IDF has commited, you would have think that they would set apologies out to the people, or help rebuild homes to those who are innocent...

This is as simple as it gets.

with the way IDF and Sharon are doing there job, its not getting better, is it?

Nope, i only wish there were peace Keeping troops... Peace KEeping troops are trained to bring peace and mantain peace and construction.. The IDF is trained to kill. hmmm,what is needed for the situation???
YOu've got people in the IDF who are there for revenge; the proof is in John Pilger's documentary... Just think about it, will this accomplish any peace, no, it will only prolong agression coming from both sides, a cycle that will not end.
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Old 10-11-2003, 12:07 AM   #75
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I'm kind of confused, how can they measure the standard of living in Palestine, if no one knows how much land is occupied, considering every day another few batches of homes are built in replace of palestinians homes???? think about it, i'm glad you have researched that, and i'm only hoping I can completely download the list on the UNDP website; however, as accurate as this may seem, you might want to think about the methods of researching ;a certain state like Palestine (one state that is being occupied and taken away day by day, how can you measure that state)?

hmmmm... ?..?
I'm just a bit confused, thaz all???
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