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Old 03-28-2002, 03:58 AM   #31
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Did anyone else see A Brief History of the Universe - based on Stephen Hawkings book? It talked about the idea that is the universe came from a big bang and is expanding, does that then mean at some point it will reach its stretching point and shrink? Will time travel backwards and history become our future? Afterwards I needed a nap. <brain cramp>


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Old 03-28-2002, 07:49 AM   #32
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Originally posted by YellowKite:
Will time travel backwards and history become our future? Afterwards I needed a nap. <brain cramp>
Science fiction. Assuming that the universe eventually does contract and start coming back together, why would that mean that time would reverse as well? I think time travel is complete science fiction for the only reason that I don't think time, in itself, is "recorded" whatsoever. Time is just a series of "present" moments that cease to be "present" instantaneously. Past/future...all human concepts. All we have is the present, folks, regardless of our location or the size of the universe.

Melon

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Old 03-28-2002, 09:13 AM   #33
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There's a few things I'd like to address:

1. The universe is defined as everything that exists.

2. The universe is finite. How do I know? Look at it mathematically. I am finite. I am also an aspect of the universe. If you divide any number by infinity, you always get infinity. I am 1. 1/infinity=infinity.

3. Due to the very nature of the universe (all that exists), multiple universes cannot exist. If they did, what would they all be a part of?

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Old 03-28-2002, 12:10 PM   #34
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1. The universe is defined as everything that exists.
that's how it should be defined, but often people define it differently.

Quote:
2. The universe is finite. How do I know? Look at it mathematically. I am finite. I am also an aspect of the universe. If you divide any number by infinity, you always get infinity. I am 1. 1/infinity=infinity.
I'm just talking out of my ass here, but that reasoning just follows along the lines that you are part of the infinite, not that the infinite doesn't exist.

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3. Due to the very nature of the universe (all that exists), multiple universes cannot exist. If they did, what would they all be a part of?
I think what people usually mean by multiple Universes is multiple dimensions within the universe defined as a whole.



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Old 03-28-2002, 12:16 PM   #35
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Assuming that the universe eventually does contract and start coming back together, why would that mean that time would reverse as well?
I don't think it would reverse time either, but it would certainly have some interesting effects since time, gravity, weak nuclear, strong nuclear and many more I'm too tired to mention at the moment, are all intertwined together.


Quote:
I think time travel is complete science fiction for the only reason that I don't think time, in itself, is "recorded" whatsoever. Time is just a series of "present" moments that cease to be "present" instantaneously. Past/future...all human concepts.
you may be right, I don't think we'll ever know on this plane. But time and the universe could also be fully formed. We may just be experiencing and moving through it in this direction.

This of course has ramifications on the concept of free will, as do the ideas of multiple universes, but it's a theory that can't be discounted.

For what it's worth, I don't think actual time travel, in the way that science fiction uses it, is ever going to be possible.

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Old 03-28-2002, 07:23 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by melon:
Science fiction. Assuming that the universe eventually does contract and start coming back together, why would that mean that time would reverse as well? I think time travel is complete science fiction for the only reason that I don't think time, in itself, is "recorded" whatsoever. Time is just a series of "present" moments that cease to be "present" instantaneously. Past/future...all human concepts. All we have is the present, folks, regardless of our location or the size of the universe.

Melon
First, the current scientific consensus to my knowledge is that the universe is not only expanding, but accelerating, thus making the problem of collapse and reverse time travel not something to worry about.

Also, theoretically, time travel is not science fiction. From Discover Magazine, March 2002, page 75...

"Einstein established that a limited form of travel into the future is possible. According to the special theory of relativity, rapid motion or a strong gravitational field can noticeably slow the passage of time. If you set out in a very fast spaceship at 87 percent the speed of light--161,000 miles per second--you'll see time pass twice as quickly for the rest of the world as it does for you. Press on closer to the speed of light, and you can race ahead even more rapidly into the future.

Going into the past requires a great deal more work..." It goes on to describe how that would be accomplished, theoretically.

So, just because we don't know how to do something or don't completely understand it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Also, I don't remember who brought it up entirely, but there is a very interesting article about the existence or non-existence of time in Discover Magazine, December 2000, entitled "From Here to Eternity." In it, physicist Julian Barbour argues several interesting points:

1. Time is an illusion, a creation of human perception.

2. If time is removed from the foundation of physics, new theories are needed to explain why humans experience the sensation of passing time.

3. "Each stage of a person's life--from fetus to young adult to senior citizen--eternally coexists with all others." "Each instant has a content, and that content is eternal." Thus, we're all immortal.

Some pretty heavy stuff to wrap your mind around, admittedly, but that's just some tidbits from the article, which does a great job explaining theories of time. It is interesting, to say the least, to try to justify Einstein's theories with Barbour's. I also recommend reading St. Augustine's Confessions, which has some pretty interesting philosophical arguments on the nature of time which are still relevant today 1700 years later. Or has it really been 1700 years?

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Old 04-01-2002, 12:29 AM   #37
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HeartlandGirl do you know if that article is on the web somewhere?

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