Is this good enough reason to Close or Secure the border more? - Page 7 - U2 Feedback

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Old 01-06-2007, 04:20 AM   #91
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Originally posted by PlaTheGreat
I'd be very weary of using the term "invading" when you are talking about immigrants. Most of these people are below the poverty line and can no longer survive in a falling Mexican government.
In all honesty, if we want to continue preaching "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" we should give some leeway to the people eagerly trying to join this country.

There are people willing to die to have a better life here and all of a sudden you are slapping them as "criminals" guilty of "war crimes" (whoa, quotation abuse ). I'm not talking about your video. I'm not talking about hostile Mexicans. (But honestly, can you blame them for being hostile when U.S. citizens have set up militia forts to shoot people trying to come over here?)

Every day I see illegal immigrants trying very hard to get a daily job to support themselves or their family. They aren't moral criminals. And they certainly didn't mean to "invade" as you put it. It's not like they sit around in the thousands and plan how to sneakily cross the border. They are families leaving everything they have, their extended family, their histories, their possessions for the possibility of a better life.
I have illegal immigrants in my stepmother's family. A 92 year old woman who would have died without the health care that is offered in the United States. Would you call her a criminal? Is it so criminal to want life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness?

Haha: Would you deny for others what you demand for yourself?

I'm just thinking globally. I have no idea what the "crossing the border" laws are or how difficult it is to get here legally. But I'm just saying to cut the non-violent illegal immigrants some slack. They aren't criminals.
This is one of the smartest posts I've seen in a long time on this topic.
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Old 01-06-2007, 12:06 PM   #92
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Sometimes you just have to ask yourself, what would Sly Stallone do?

MEXICO CITY (AP) -- Sylvester Stallone defended boxing, praised the hard work of Mexicans and dished out some jabs against U.S. plans to build a wall on its southern border, as the 60-year-old actor visited Mexico City to promote his sixth "Rocky" film.

In "Rocky Balboa," an MGM Pictures release, the aging scrapper is running a restaurant when a computer-simulated bout inspires him to put the gloves back on. In one scene, his character defends his restaurant's immigrant cooks and waiters against slanderous comments.

"I support Mexicans who work in my country," he said, adding that the United States depends on the hard work of Latinos to keep running.

In comments to Mexican media later, Stallone criticized plans to build 700 miles of fence along the border as an immigration-control measure.

Such a fence was "crazy" and "ridiculous," he said, arguing that nations should be able to interact without being divided by walls.
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Old 01-06-2007, 01:18 PM   #93
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Originally posted by MrsSpringsteen
Sometimes you just have to ask yourself, what would Sly Stallone do?

MEXICO CITY (AP) -- Sylvester Stallone defended boxing, praised the hard work of Mexicans and dished out some jabs against U.S. plans to build a wall on its southern border, as the 60-year-old actor visited Mexico City to promote his sixth "Rocky" film.

In "Rocky Balboa," an MGM Pictures release, the aging scrapper is running a restaurant when a computer-simulated bout inspires him to put the gloves back on. In one scene, his character defends his restaurant's immigrant cooks and waiters against slanderous comments.

"I support Mexicans who work in my country," he said, adding that the United States depends on the hard work of Latinos to keep running.

In comments to Mexican media later, Stallone criticized plans to build 700 miles of fence along the border as an immigration-control measure.

Such a fence was "crazy" and "ridiculous," he said, arguing that nations should be able to interact without being divided by walls.
Sounds like someone has seen A Day Without A Mexican!

We did something like that on campus. We didn't go to class, or meetings, or anything, but instead stood outside all day protesting. I ended up on the news!
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Old 01-06-2007, 02:58 PM   #94
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We've had a truly ferocious controversy over illegal immigrants ever since the Hispanic Cultural Center was shut down in a Birmingham suburb. The Catholic diocese was all over the suburb's case after the closing. It seems like illegal aliens were getting picked up at this place to get to and from work. The legal Latinos at my parish were furious. They asked "how are they supposed to support their families"?. These people are not flag-waving lefties either, one couple I know from Chile are very conservative.
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Old 01-06-2007, 03:35 PM   #95
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So your saying in the end illegal immigration (which is a crime entering illegally) should not be a law since the provide very cheap labor? What other laws should we ignore?
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Old 01-06-2007, 04:19 PM   #96
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Jesus, Justin. it's apparent that what you think everyone else is saying is not even close to what they're actually saying. Sometimes I think you argue simply because you don't want to actually think about what other people are saying. Have you stopped to read Pia's response? Are you aware that the vast majority of illegal immigrants do not traffick drugs, or shoot at Guardsmen, or commit crimes once inside the country? Does that even register at all to you?

Is it even possible for you to argue logically as opposed to emotionally?
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Old 01-06-2007, 05:02 PM   #97
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Sometimes I think you argue simply because you don't want to actually think about what other people are saying.
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Old 01-06-2007, 07:11 PM   #98
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Yes I know the majority do not traffic drugs and guns, but there are still LAWS.
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Old 01-06-2007, 07:27 PM   #99
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You know (and yes, I admit I'm crossing subjects here), but for one who has said he would probably personally kill someone who murdered a family member/friend if the opportunity presented itself, you suddenly have a lot of respect for the law despite desperate circumstances.
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Old 01-06-2007, 07:58 PM   #100
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Same could be said about you. Some one who considers the DP to be unjust, and yet finds people crossing into our country and breaking the law, and some of them using someone else SS# which can ruin someones credit shure intrigues me.
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Old 01-06-2007, 08:33 PM   #101
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Quote:
Originally posted by Justin24
and some of them using someone else SS# which can ruin someones credit shure intrigues me.

My god, will you quit using this as an arguing point. It's a moot point!!!

Stick to the real facts and arguing points.
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Old 01-06-2007, 10:07 PM   #102
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Reason & Logic. You should give 'em a try

Quote:
Originally posted by Justin24
Same could be said about you. Some one who considers the DP to be unjust, and yet finds people crossing into our country and breaking the law, and some of them using someone else SS# which can ruin someones credit shure intrigues me.
Um, no, the same could not be said about me, because my belief that the death penalty is wrong in no way contradicts my feelings on illegal immigration. Whereas you, who openly admitted that you could break the law given the desperate circumstance that you found someone who murdered someone you cared about, show absolutely no sympathy for those who break the law and cross the border due to desperate circumstances. And they're not even killing anybody.

You're right, they're one and the same.
psst... it usually helps things along if your argument makes sense

And as has been repeatedly voiced, your argument is deeply flawed - you're picking out the worst possible case and then making it sound like it's the norm. Apparently it really hasn't sunk in that the vast majority of those crossing the border do not engage in identity theft, drug trafficking or any other nefarious crimes.
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Old 01-06-2007, 10:18 PM   #103
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How many in Colorado recentlly were arressted for Identity theft? ( I think it was over 1000) and yes I know it's only a small percentage.
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Old 01-06-2007, 10:20 PM   #104
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I wonder how many legal residents of the US are arrested each year for identity theft. I would imagine just a few more than that. The point is that identity theft is not an immigration issue, and you need to drop it as an arguing point, because it doesn't hold any water.
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Old 01-06-2007, 11:37 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally posted by Justin24
and yet finds people crossing into our country and breaking the law, and some of them using someone else SS# which can ruin someones credit shure intrigues me.
Justin! I believe you and I had a talk about this point. Me, Pla, and others have constantly pleaded with you to not make assumptions about all Mexican immigrants. You tell me you aren't being racist, but I say you are about to cross that line. You always associate that with them, and them only. Attributing one inconsequential and weak statistic to generalize it to one group and one group alone is obviously you singling them out.

Someone even pointed out to you that only 5% of identity thieves are illegal immigrants. What about the other 95%???
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