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Old 10-24-2007, 11:13 PM   #241
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After 15+ pages of debate it all boils down to whether or not you choose to believe her that she meant for Dumbledore to be gay from day one.

If you choose to because it simply would contradict my argument that she did it to further her political views then well that's your choice. I choose not to because it simply doesn't add up.
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Old 10-24-2007, 11:14 PM   #242
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The only thing that doesn't add up is your biased argument.

It does add up. The books show that it adds up. Have you read them?
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Old 10-24-2007, 11:17 PM   #243
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Quote:
Originally posted by BrownEyedBoy
After 15+ pages of debate it all boils down to whether or not you choose to believe her that she meant for Dumbledore to be gay from day one.
It boils down to a lot more than that... just look at YOUR title of the thread.




Quote:
Originally posted by BrownEyedBoy

If you choose to because it simply would contradict my argument that she did it to further her political views then well that's your choice. I choose not to because it simply doesn't add up.
Well you started the thread with absolutely no logic and 15+ pages later still not one iota of logic. At least you are consisntent.

How you can say you can climb into a writer's head is beyond me... i think you are the one with an agenda and it frustrates you that you couldn't find anything to back it up.
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Old 10-24-2007, 11:39 PM   #244
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


It boils down to a lot more than that... just look at YOUR title of the thread.






Well you started the thread with absolutely no logic and 15+ pages later still not one iota of logic. At least you are consisntent.

How you can say you can climb into a writer's head is beyond me... i think you are the one with an agenda and it frustrates you that you couldn't find anything to back it up.
Well, since according to you I've been borderline incoherent maybe you shouldn't have bothered to answer. Every single one of your responses backs up the fact that I have a point.

It's fine that you prefer when children's books characters are made to be gay for no reason at all.

And for the record, I have read all the books and for the longest time I had a sense that Dumbledore and McGonagall had more going on than was let on. Guess not.
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Old 10-24-2007, 11:45 PM   #245
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Quote:
Originally posted by BrownEyedBoy


Well, since according to you I've been borderline incoherent maybe you shouldn't have bothered to answer. Every single one of your responses backs up the fact that I have a point.
Um, no it doesn't. It just backs up the fact that I will always fight ignorance with reason.

Quote:
Originally posted by BrownEyedBoy

It's fine that you prefer when children's books characters are made to be gay for no reason at all.
No, I just like it when art actually reflects real life. Unlike you I don't think blacks are tokens. They are part of life, therefore they play a part in art.

Quote:
Originally posted by BrownEyedBoy

And for the record, I have read all the books and for the longest time I had a sense that Dumbledore and McGonagall had more going on than was let on. Guess not.


Just don't act like you know more than the author.
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Old 10-24-2007, 11:50 PM   #246
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I don't think Dumbledore's sexuality should have been mentioned, mostly because young children can't really understand it. Teenagers could understand it better.

Honestly, though, I stopped reading the books after number four, so I'm not really sure how this is all tied together.
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Old 10-24-2007, 11:52 PM   #247
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Originally posted by ShipOfFools
I don't think the issue is whether it matters if Dumbledore is gay or not. The problem is that young children can't really understand it, which is why I don't think it should have been mentioned.
You underestimate the lovingness and intelligence of children in her reading bracket.
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Old 10-24-2007, 11:52 PM   #248
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"Ignorance", you'll find, is relative. When you're in a liberal forum of like minded people someone who thnk differently can be easily dismissed as "ignorant" or a "bigot" or even "homophobic". I am none.

But I do believe that there was just no room to associate children's books with someone's sexual preference. Not the time or the place. And that's the last I'm posting about this.

(I do respect and appreciate everyone who has argued with me. We disagree in our views but that's it for me.)
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Old 10-24-2007, 11:56 PM   #249
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


You underestimate the lovingness and intelligence of children in her reading bracket.
Read my above post, I edited it. I understand that there's a huge age gap between readers; I was only referring to the younger readers.
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Old 10-25-2007, 12:18 AM   #250
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Quote:
Originally posted by BrownEyedBoy
"Ignorance", you'll find, is relative. When you're in a liberal forum of like minded people someone who thnk differently can be easily dismissed as "ignorant" or a "bigot" or even "homophobic". I am none.
Ignorance and bigotry have pretty specific definitions and when you discriminate based on someone's sexuality that fits in the definition, when you speak of issues and the facts go against you then that fits into the definition.

Calling blacks tokens, but latinos as socialized fits into that definition. As do many many of your other statements.

Quote:
Originally posted by BrownEyedBoy

But I do believe that there was just no room to associate children's books with someone's sexual preference. Not the time or the place. And that's the last I'm posting about this.
But once again, that takes away so many children's books it's not even funny. You'll have 'See Spot Run' left...
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Old 10-25-2007, 12:21 AM   #251
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Quote:
Originally posted by ShipOfFools


Read my above post, I edited it. I understand that there's a huge age gap between readers; I was only referring to the younger readers.
Well someone gave an example of a kindergarden child who was very capable of understanding it, and I don't really think she fits into the age group that is capable of reading that book yet, so I can't really see the issue.
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Old 10-25-2007, 12:37 AM   #252
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Maybe BEB is just not happy with this news? Makes him less of a wizard in his eyes. . .
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Old 10-25-2007, 02:38 AM   #253
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Bonovoxsupastar : maybe she will gain a few, but do you really think that many people will say "Ah! controversy! I want to read this." if they never read HP before? I think the fans she has kept after this, she kept - and some she has lost (now and in the future), I'm not sure there will be a massive coming of new "rebel" fans now.

Phillyfan: see, and that's what I'm trying to say. I feel for those who won't be able to read HP now (not those that choose not to do so), because of the aftermath to this revelation. I feel for the coming two movies kids' attendance because how many articles will have that little note included "JK Rowling sparked controversy by outing Dumbledore" and how many parents will remember that and ban the movie for their kids? It will hang like a shadow over all things HP now.
It's sort of like when the actor Daniel Radcliffe did that play in London and it had nude scenes and all the titles went "Harry Potter NAKED on stage". No one payed attention to the play itself, or his acting. So now it may very well be "new HP movie, encyclopedia, interview et etc but HE'S GAY". You know ?

Once again, understand I do not care for which team Dumbledore bats, I just wish she had this approached this a different way. I found that comment "if I knew it would make you so happy, I'd do it sooner" interesting...did she want to but was stopped by her editors ? Was she unsure of the fan reaction ?
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Old 10-25-2007, 03:42 AM   #254
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Again, U2girl, should we constantly be catering and pandering to the opinions of bigots and the uninformed? We'd never get anywhere as a society.
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Old 10-25-2007, 04:40 AM   #255
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2girl
but do you really think that many people will say "Ah! controversy! I want to read this." if they never read HP before?
You'd be amazed at how many people clamor to check something out once it becomes controversial. A lot of people do it just so they can say they were a part of the whole ordeal, but some also do it 'cause of that danged thing called curiosity .

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