Is Palin failin' ? or OMG McCain wins with Palin !! pt. 2 - Page 3 - U2 Feedback

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Old 09-03-2008, 05:11 PM   #31
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Here's my brief synopsis:

McCain shot himself in the foot. He waited til Friday to make his announcement, strategically speaking it was brilliant, but not thought out at all. It took away from the coverage of Obama's speech but it's also carrying over and overshadowing the convention. Everything these conventions are designed for is getting overshadowed.

Just like McCain's very transparent and short minded decision to choose Palin because she's a woman not work and get the cross over votes he was hoping for, but his decision also showed short mindedness in the sense of his own convention. Did he not know she would be the attention of media scrutiny for awhile and drown out anything that came out of the convention? She's unknown, and just because you didn't need a thorough vetting period, doesn't mean the public doesn't need one. Well the public is now going through their vetting period.

So the media is disecting her, the Republicans(a small portion of which biting their tongues) are praising her like the second coming, and the Dems are watching cautiously. She went from unknown to probably one of the highest VP pedestals in less than a week, she will either shine or crumble.

If she shines we have a very very close race, but not close enough... I think eventually she'll be seen as poor judgement on McCain's part, but her future in the party will be sealed for awhile(barring any huge issues).
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Old 09-03-2008, 05:38 PM   #32
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I have debated whether or not to post this, knowing full well that the "Liberal blogger" accusation will probably be tossed around. However, I've read much of what's already been posted here from various sources in the past few days. I'm far more interested in her style and methods of leadership than I am in her family situation, and it's those parts of this that are telling, in my opinion.

http://mudflats.wordpress.com/2008/0...alin/#comments

Quote:
Dear friends,

So many people have asked me about what I know about Sarah Palin in the
last 2 days that I decided to write something up . . .

Basically, Sarah Palin and Hillary Clinton have only 2 things in
common: their gender and their good looks.

You have my permission to forward this to your friends/email contacts
with my name and email address attached, but please do not post them on
any websites, as there are too many kooks out there . . .


ABOUT SARAH PALIN

I am a resident of Wasilla, Alaska. I have known Sarah since 1992.
Everyone here knows Sarah, so it is nothing special to say we are on a
first-name basis. Our children have attended the same schools. Her
father was my child’s favorite substitute teacher. I also am on a
first name basis with her parents and mother-in-law. I attended more
City Council meetings during her administration than about 99% of the
residents of the city.

She is enormously popular; in every way she’s like the most popular
girl in middle school. Even men who think she is a poor choice and
won’t vote for her can’t quit smiling when talking about her because
she is a “babe”.

It is astonishing and almost scary how well she can keep a secret. She
kept her most recent pregnancy a secret from her children and parents
for seven months.

She is “pro-life”. She recently gave birth to a Down’s syndrome baby.
There is no cover-up involved, here; Trig is her baby.

She is energetic and hardworking. She regularly worked out at the gym.

She is savvy. She doesn’t take positions; she just “puts things out
there” and if they prove to be popular, then she takes credit.

Her husband works a union job on the North Slope for BP and is a
champion snowmobile racer. Todd Palin’s kind of job is highly
sought-after because of the schedule and high pay. He arranges his
work schedule so he can fish for salmon in Bristol Bay for a month or
so in summer, but by no stretch of the imagination is fishing their
major source of income. Nor has her life-style ever been anything
like that of native Alaskans.

Sarah and her whole family are avid hunters.

She’s smart.

Her experience is as mayor of a city with a population of about 5,000
(at the time), and less than 2 years as governor of a state with about
670,000 residents.

During her mayoral administration most of the actual work of running
this small city was turned over to an administrator. She had been
pushed to hire this administrator by party power-brokers after she had
gotten herself into some trouble over precipitous firings which had
given rise to a recall campaign.

Sarah campaigned in Wasilla as a “fiscal conservative”. During her 6
years as Mayor, she increased general government expenditures by over
33%. During those same 6 years the amount of taxes collected by the
City increased by 38%. This was during a period of low inflation
(1996-2002). She reduced progressive property taxes and increased a
regressive sales tax which taxed even food. The tax cuts that she
promoted benefited large corporate property owners way more than they
benefited residents.

The huge increases in tax revenues during her mayoral administration
weren’t enough to fund everything on her wish list though, borrowed
money was needed, too. She inherited a city with zero debt, but left it
with indebtedness of over $22 million. What did Mayor Palin encourage
the voters to borrow money for? Was it the infrastructure that she said
she supported? The sewage treatment plant that the city lacked? or a
new library? No. $1m for a park. $15m-plus for construction of a
multi-use sports complex which she rushed through to build on a piece
of property that the City didn’t even have clear title to, that was
still in litigation 7 yrs later–to the delight of the lawyers
involved! The sports complex itself is a nice addition to the
community but a huge money pit, not the profit-generator she claimed it
would be. She also supported bonds for $5.5m for road projects that
could have been done in 5-7 yrs without any borrowing.

While Mayor, City Hall was extensively remodeled and her office
redecorated more than once.

These are small numbers, but Wasilla is a very small city.

As an oil producer, the high price of oil has created a budget surplus
in Alaska. Rather than invest this surplus in technology that will
make us energy independent and increase efficiency, as Governor she
proposed distribution of this surplus to every individual in the state.

In this time of record state revenues and budget surpluses, she
recommended that the state borrow/bond for road projects, even while
she proposed distribution of surplus state revenues: spend today’s
surplus, borrow for needs.

She’s not very tolerant of divergent opinions or open to outside ideas
or compromise. As Mayor, she fought ideas that weren’t generated by
her or her staff. Ideas weren’t evaluated on their merits, but on the
basis of who proposed them.

While Sarah was Mayor of Wasilla she tried to fire our highly respected
City Librarian because the Librarian refused to consider removing from
the library some books that Sarah wanted removed. City residents
rallied to the defense of the City Librarian and against Palin’s
attempt at out-and-out censorship, so Palin backed down and withdrew
her termination letter. People who fought her attempt to oust the
Librarian are on her enemies list to this day.

Sarah complained about the “old boy’s club” when she first ran for
Mayor, so what did she bring Wasilla? A new set of “old boys”. Palin
fired most of the experienced staff she inherited. At the City and as
Governor she hired or elevated new, inexperienced, obscure people,
creating a staff totally dependent on her for their jobs and eternally
grateful and fiercely loyal–loyal to the point of abusing their power
to further her personal agenda, as she has acknowledged happened in the
case of pressuring the State’s top cop (see below).

As Mayor, Sarah fired Wasilla’s Police Chief because he “intimidated”
her, she told the press. As Governor, her recent firing of Alaska’s top
cop has the ring of familiarity about it. He served at her pleasure
and she had every legal right to fire him, but it’s pretty clear that
an important factor in her decision to fire him was because he wouldn’t
fire her sister’s ex-husband, a State Trooper. Under investigation
for abuse of power, she has had to admit that more than 2 dozen
contacts were made between her staff and family to the person that she
later fired, pressuring him to fire her ex-brother-in-law. She tried to
replace the man she fired with a man who she knew had been reprimanded
for sexual harassment; when this caused a public furor, she withdrew
her support.

She has bitten the hand of every person who extended theirs to her in
help. The City Council person who personally escorted her around town
introducing her to voters when she first ran for Wasilla City Council
became one of her first targets when she was later elected Mayor. She
abruptly fired her loyal City Administrator; even people who didn’t
like the guy were stunned by this ruthlessness.

Fear of retribution has kept all of these people from saying anything
publicly about her.

When then-Governor Murkowski was handing out political plums, Sarah got
the best, Chair of the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission: one
of the few jobs not in Juneau and one of the best paid. She had no
background in oil & gas issues. Within months of scoring this great
job which paid $122,400/yr, she was complaining in the press about the
high salary. I was told that she hated that job: the commute, the
structured hours, the work. Sarah became aware that a member of this
Commission (who was also the State Chair of the Republican Party)
engaged in unethical behavior on the job. In a gutsy move which some
undoubtedly cautioned her could be political suicide, Sarah solved all
her problems in one fell swoop: got out of the job she hated and
garnered gobs of media attention as the patron saint of ethics and as a
gutsy fighter against the “old boys’ club” when she dramatically quit,
exposing this man’s ethics violations (for which he was fined).

As Mayor, she had her hand stuck out as far as anyone for pork from
Senator Ted Stevens. Lately, she has castigated his pork-barrel
politics and publicly humiliated him. She only opposed the “bridge to
nowhere” after it became clear that it would be unwise not to.

As Governor, she gave the Legislature no direction and budget
guidelines, then made a big grandstand display of line-item vetoing
projects, calling them pork. Public outcry and further legislative
action restored most of these projects–which had been vetoed simply
because she was not aware of their importance–but with the unobservant
she had gained a reputation as “anti-pork”.

She is solidly Republican: no political maverick. The State party
leaders hate her because she has bit them in the back and humiliated
them. Other members of the party object to her self-description as a
fiscal conservative.

Around Wasilla there are people who went to high school with Sarah.
They call her “Sarah Barracuda” because of her unbridled ambition and
predatory ruthlessness. Before she became so powerful, very ugly
stories circulated around town about shenanigans she pulled to be made
point guard on the high school basketball team. When Sarah’s
mother-in-law, a highly respected member of the community and
experienced manager, ran for Mayor, Sarah refused to endorse her.

As Governor, she stepped outside of the box and put together of package
of legislation known as “AGIA” that forced the oil companies to march
to the beat of her drum.

Like most Alaskans, she favors drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife
Refuge. She has questioned if the loss of sea ice is linked to
global warming. She campaigned “as a private citizen” against a state
initiaitive that would have either a) protected salmon streams from
pollution from mines, or b) tied up in the courts all mining in the
state (depending on who you listen to). She has pushed the State’s
lawsuit against the Dept. of the Interior’s decision to list polar
bears as threatened species.

McCain is the oldest person to ever run for President; Sarah will be a
heartbeat away from being President.

There has to be literally millions of Americans who are more
knowledgeable and experienced than she.

However, there’s a lot of people who have underestimated her and are
regretting it.

CLAIM VS FACT
•”Hockey mom”: true for a few years
•”PTA mom”: true years ago when her first-born was in elementary
school, not since
•”NRA supporter”: absolutely true
•social conservative: mixed. Opposes gay marriage, BUT vetoed a bill
that would have denied benefits to employees in same-sex relationships
(said she did this because it was unconsitutional).
•pro-creationism: mixed. Supports it, BUT did nothing as Governor to
promote it.
•”Pro-life”: mixed. Knowingly gave birth to a Down’s syndrome baby
BUT declined to call a special legislative session on some pro-life
legislation
•”Experienced”: Some high schools have more students than Wasilla has
residents. Many cities have more residents than the state of Alaska.
No legislative experience other than City Council. Little hands-on
supervisory or managerial experience; needed help of a city
administrator to run town of about 5,000.
•political maverick: not at all
•gutsy: absolutely!
•open & transparent: ??? Good at keeping secrets. Not good at
explaining actions.
•has a developed philosophy of public policy: no
•”a Greenie”: no. Turned Wasilla into a wasteland of big box stores
and disconnected parking lots. Is pro-drilling off-shore and in ANWR.
•fiscal conservative: not by my definition!
•pro-infrastructure: No. Promoted a sports complex and park in a city
without a sewage treatment plant or storm drainage system. Built
streets to early 20th century standards.
•pro-tax relief: Lowered taxes for businesses, increased tax burden on
residents
•pro-small government: No. Oversaw greatest expansion of city
government in Wasilla’s history.
•pro-labor/pro-union. No. Just because her husband works union
doesn’t make her pro-labor. I have seen nothing to support any claim
that she is pro-labor/pro-union.

Regarding the last couple of paragraphs of what Martha quoted above, the claims that she flirted with a secessionist group, the story I read is that while she's always been a member of the Republican party, she was associated with this group for about a year, and has attended at least one of their rallies. Her husband, on the other hand, was a member for several years in the early 00's, and during that time, he was not registered as a Republican.
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Old 09-03-2008, 05:39 PM   #33
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it's strange that they're "furious" with the media over the pregnant daughter,

yet they're bringing her (rather hot) boyfriend out on stage tonight
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Old 09-03-2008, 05:40 PM   #34
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Also? As governor, she cut funding to teen mothers.


Palin Slashed Funding for Teen Moms | The Trail | washingtonpost.com

Palin Slashed Funding for Teen Moms


Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin wrote in her line-item veto changes by hand in this copy of a 2008 spending bill obtained by The Washington Post.

By Paul Kane
ST. PAUL -- Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, the Republican vice-presidential nominee who revealed Monday that her 17-year-old daughter is pregnant, earlier this year used her line-item veto to slash funding for a state program benefiting teen mothers in need of a place to live.

After the legislature passed a spending bill in April, Palin went through the measure reducing and eliminating funds for programs she opposed. Inking her initials on the legislation -- "SP" -- Palin reduced funding for Covenant House Alaska by more than 20 percent, cutting funds from $5 million to $3.9 million. Covenant House is a mix of programs and shelters for troubled youths, including Passage House, which is a transitional home for teenage mothers.

According to Passage House's web site, its purpose is to provide "young mothers a place to live with their babies for up to eighteen months while they gain the necessary skills and resources to change their lives" and help teen moms "become productive, successful, independent adults who create and provide a stable environment for themselves and their families."

Palin's own daughter, Bristol, is five months pregnant and has plans to wed.

"Bristol and the young man she will marry are going to realize very quickly the difficulties of raising a child, which is why they will have the love and support of our entire family," Palin said in a statement released by the McCain campaign. "We ask the media to respect our daughter and Levi's privacy, as has always been the tradition of children of candidates."

Earlier today the Associated Press reported that Sen. John McCain (Ariz.), the presumptive Republican presidential nominee, opposed funding to prevent teen pregnancies, a position that Palin also took as governor. "The explicit sex-ed programs will not find my support," she wrote in a 2006 questionnaire distributed among gubernatorial candidates.

Reporters asked McCain in November 2007 whether he supported grants for sex education in the United States, whether such programs should include directions for using contraceptives and whether he supports President Bush's policy of promoting abstinence.

"Ahhh, I think I support the president's policy," McCain said.
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Old 09-03-2008, 05:49 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post
it's strange that they're "furious" with the media over the pregnant daughter,

yet they're bringing her (rather hot) boyfriend out on stage tonight
That's being heavily debated in the librul blogosphere. Critics are saying that she made her daughter's pregnancy news by making a public announcement, when what was actually in question was her infant son's parentage, and all she needed to do to squelch those rumours was to release his birth certificate. Basically, she threw her daughter under a bus to save her own political ass.

Others also feel that since she's of the opinion that she/the government should have control over others uteruses, that her and her daughter's uteruses should be fair game, too.

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Old 09-03-2008, 06:02 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VintagePunk View Post
I have debated whether or not to post this, knowing full well that the "Liberal blogger" accusation will probably be tossed around. However, I've read much of what's already been posted here from various sources in the past few days. I'm far more interested in her style and methods of leadership than I am in her family situation, and it's those parts of this that are telling, in my opinion.

In the Land of Palin. � Mudflats




Regarding the last couple of paragraphs of what Martha quoted above, the claims that she flirted with a secessionist group, the story I read is that while she's always been a member of the Republican party, she was associated with this group for about a year, and has attended at least one of their rallies. Her husband, on the other hand, was a member for several years in the early 00's, and during that time, he was not registered as a Republican.
Holy shit. That thing should be read in its entirety live on all the news channels during the convention tonight. Election would be over.
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Old 09-03-2008, 06:03 PM   #37
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it seems the Republicans have declared war on the media. not a good idea. Joe Klein says:

Quote:
The story of the day out here in Minneapolis is the McCain campaign's war against the press. This has been building for some time. Those of us who have criticized the candidate--and especially those of us who enjoyed good relations with McCain in the past--have been subject to off-the-record browbeating and attempted bullying all year. But things have gotten much worse in recent days: there was McCain's rude, bizarre interview with Time Magazine last week. Yesterday, McCain refused to an interview with Larry King, for God's sake, because Campbell Brown had been caught in the commission of journalism on CNN the night before, asking McCain spokesman Tucker Bounds what decisions Sarah Palin had made as commander-in-chief of the Alaska national guard. (There was an answer that the unprepared Bounds didn't have: she had deployed them to fight fires.)

So what's going on here? Two things. McCain is just plain angry at us. By the evidence presented in the utterly revealing Time interview, he's ballistic. This is a politician who needs to see himself as the man on the white horse, boldly traversing a muddy field...any intimations that he's gotten muddied in the process, or has decided to throw mud, are intolerable.

The second thing is more insidious: Steve Schmidt has decided, for tactical reasons, to slime the press. He wants the public to believe that there is an unfair--sexist (you gotta love it)--personal assault going on against Palin and her family. This is a smokescreen, intended to divert attention from the very real and responsible vetting that is taking place in the media--about the substance of Palin's record as mayor and governor. Sure, there are a few outliers--and the tabloid press--who have fixed on baby stories. That was inevitable....the flip side of the personal stories that the McCain team thought would work to their advantage--Palin's moose-hunting and wolf-shooting, and her admirable decision to have a Down Syndrome baby. And yes, when we all fix on the same story, whether it's a hurricane or a little-known politician, a zoo ensues. But the media coverage of the Palin story has been well within the bounds of responsibility. Schmidt is trying to make it seem otherwise, a desperate tactic.

There is a tendency in the media to kick ourselves, cringe and withdraw, when we are criticized. But I hope my colleagues stand strong in this case: it is important for the public to know that Palin raised taxes as governor, supported the Bridge to Nowhere before she opposed it, pursued pork-barrel projects as mayor, tried to ban books at the local library and thinks the war in Iraq is "a task from God." The attempts by the McCain campaign to bully us into not reporting such things are not only stupidly aggressive, but unprofessional in the extreme.


and off the record, Republicans-caught-on-tape (including my favorite Republican, Peggy Noonan) reveals some refreshing honesty:

YouTube - Mike Murphy and Peggy Noonan Trip over Live Mics on MSNBC

Quote:
Chuck Todd: Mike Murphy, lots of free advice, we'll see if Steve Schmidt and the boys were watching. We'll find out on your blackberry. Tonight voters will get their chance to hear from Sarah Palin and she will get the chance to show voters she's the right woman for the job Up next, one man who's already convinced and he'll us why Gov. Jon Huntsman.

(cut away)

Peggy Noonan: Yeah.

Mike Murphy: You know, because I come out of the blue swing state governor world: Engler, Whitman, Tommy Thompson, Mitt Romney, Jeb Bush. I mean, these guys -- this is how you win a Texas race, just run it up. And it's not gonna work. And --

PN: It's over.

MM: Still McCain can give a version of the Lieberman speech to do himself some good.

CT: I also think the Palin pick is insulting to Kay Bailey Hutchinson, too.

PN: Saw Kay this morning.

CT: Yeah, she's never looked comfortable about this --

MM: They're all bummed out.

CT: Yeah, I mean is she really the most qualified woman they could have turned to?

PN: The most qualified? No! I think they went for this -- excuse me-- political bullshit about narratives --

CT: Yeah they went to a narrative.

MM: I totally agree.


PN: Every time the Republicans do that, because that's not where they live and it's not what they're good at, they blow it.

MM: You know what's really the worst thing about it? The greatness of McCain is no cynicism, and this is cynical.

CT: This is cynical, and as you called it, gimmicky.


MM: Yeah.
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Old 09-03-2008, 06:06 PM   #38
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Basically, she threw her daughter under a bus to save her own political ass.
I don't buy this, if anything I think she's using it to prove just how hardcore pro-life she is...

One thing about it though, it's going to change ultra right politics when it comes to sex if she gets elected, or even if she doesn't and remains the conservative darling...

How are they going to use the old "well it all goes back to the parents" adage, or push abstinence only programs through government, or cut funding for unwed mothers? How will they be able to do this with a straight face after embracing wholeheartedly Palin as their VP?

It could have some good come out of it...
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Old 09-03-2008, 06:09 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Irvine511 View Post
it seems the Republicans have declared war on the media. not a good idea. Joe Klein says:





and off the record, Republicans-caught-on-tape (including my favorite Republican, Peggy Noonan) reveals some refreshing honesty:

YouTube - Mike Murphy and Peggy Noonan Trip over Live Mics on MSNBC
Fucking brilliant...
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Old 09-03-2008, 06:10 PM   #40
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She sure sounds like a Republican in all these things.
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Old 09-03-2008, 06:11 PM   #41
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this thread just keeps getting better...
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Old 09-03-2008, 06:12 PM   #42
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i'm just kind of amazed that we're only 5 days into her selection, and the blogs are still firing away, and not just DailyKos.

there's all this Jews for Jesus stuff, her pastor, etc.

why did they offer this to her? and why did she say yes?

maybe she'll be brilliant tonight.
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Old 09-03-2008, 06:15 PM   #43
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Regarding the last couple of paragraphs of what Martha quoted above, the claims that she flirted with a secessionist group, the story I read is that while she's always been a member of the Republican party, she was associated with this group for about a year, and has attended at least one of their rallies. Her husband, on the other hand, was a member for several years in the early 00's, and during that time, he was not registered as a Republican.


maybe now, for the first time in his adult life, Todd Palin is proud of his country?
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Old 09-03-2008, 06:21 PM   #44
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I don't buy this, if anything I think she's using it to prove just how hardcore pro-life she is...
I don't know if I necessarily buy it in exactly that way, either. Her daughter is visibly pregnant, and the family is now high profile. They'd have to address it eventually. But I do think there is some truth to the statement that it's unfair to call off the hounds when she's the one who made it news.



I honestly hope that the mainstream media doesn't let up on this (Palin in general, not the pregnancy story). Kudos to Klein for putting that opinion out there.

I went to the CNN website and sent off a note of support for Campbell Brown and the network. I hope they keep it up.
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Old 09-03-2008, 06:24 PM   #45
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maybe now, for the first time in his adult life, Todd Palin is proud of his country?
I'm sure he is. But then, he's white, so, does it even matter?


Re: the happy father to be, his my space page was suddenly taken down a couple of days ago, but not before many took screen shots. He's a self-proclaimed "fuckin redneck."

Poor kid. I'm sure he's so not ready to be thrust upon the national stage, trotted out by the campaign.
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