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Old 12-13-2004, 06:29 PM   #106
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But having said that, I think cardsosino was just making a comment on people's willingness to criticize views which are Christian and their reluctance to criticize anything that isn't.
Something that comes up here a lot actually. Sometimes it is just a means to which to change the subject because the person can't defend the comments and other times it stands very true.

Why do you think their is reluctance to criticize other religions? Possibly because most people in here who have a religious background it's in the Judeo-Christian? Or is that it's ultimately hypocritical to point out the flaws in another religion when you haven't focused on the flaws of your own first? Or is it being a victim of the PC world we live in? But then you just go back to playing victim again.

It's probably a little bit all three, but it's definately not a way to debate this subject.
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Old 12-13-2004, 06:43 PM   #107
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Originally posted by thacraic


But having said that, I think cardsosino was just making a comment on people's willingness to criticize views which are Christian and their reluctance to criticize anything that isn't.
Perhaps if I lived in a nation that was ruled by Muslim leaders and where Mulsims were given respect and admiration I and others outside of that sphere did not receive, I would have the same criticism of them. But I don't. Besides, I have to start somewhere.

Perhaps if more of the active posters on this board were Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, etc., the discussions would focus more on those religions. But since most people here have a Judeo-Christian background, that's where the discussion is going to go.
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Old 12-13-2004, 07:01 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally posted by cardosino


Not really answering the question though, yes, it's the State's recognition of it that gives us the tax breaks; but the concept of marriage IS intrinsically a religious one.

AS far as I'm concerned, if gays want the same right as married couples, that's fine. The fact that I may not see it as a true "marriage" won't lessen it one iota, my opinion isn't what matters.


Priorities.
I'm just gonna jump in here and then jump back out....but I was under the impression that marriage was NOT originally a religious concept but rather a financial/social and even political one. While I cannot give specific sources (but I can do some research if need be), the concept of marriage was to insure that a man's (ahem) offspring were, as well as he could tell (because without DNA tests there is NO sure way to know!), HIS offspring. And, it was important, in a patriarchial society, for one man's son to inherit that man's estate and/or social position upon his death. Marriage to a woman (even to more than one) ensured that the children were "his" and that he had control over his wife and children as over his animals and land.

The book Sex in History is a pretty interesting read and delves into many different cultures and how social mores develop as they pertain to sex, gender and identity.

OK, jumping back out now.
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Old 12-13-2004, 10:27 PM   #109
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On point one I wouldn't know. Point two I agree to an extent. Point three... I see this happening a lot. Points are made, then a side thought is what is addressed, leading to a completely different debate. Its seems to be a very evasive means of discourse.

But having said that, I think cardsosino was just making a comment on people's willingness to criticize views which are Christian and their reluctance to criticize anything that isn't.
I can appreciate that, and agree wholeheartedly that it is an evasive means of discourse. it's actually frustrating because the more vocal Christian members of this forum are now silent. Why? Are you all stumped? Have I pushed you back against a wall? I didn't mean to, I just want some answers. Answers which are never forthcoming in this forum and certainly never in life when discussions take place. I am not alone with the perceived hyprocisy I'm viewing in this religion. And it's never addressed. It's disheartening. Especially when the silence will soon enough end and on a different topic I'll be 'gently' reminded that I am on the burning path to hell and my future and past is littered with sin. There's certainly a lot of compassion in Christianity, there's a lot of acceptance and open loving arms. But it's a rather selective process.

Call me a sinner all you like. one thing I will never be is unaccepting and passively encourage exclusion of any fellow person in anything in my life. Let us all love and live how we choose. I dont care if Christianity wallows in it's hatred. Unfortunately and tragically, many homosexual folk do. It's a fucking shame they are made to feel as they do - persecuted.
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Old 12-13-2004, 10:40 PM   #110
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This Christanity bashing must stop.

People have got tired of Bashing Americans - so they are Bashing Christianity.

Dont always go in for fashion.

For the sake of Steve ( who I believe is a Christian)

AcrobatMan
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Old 12-13-2004, 10:49 PM   #111
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Quote:
Originally posted by AcrobatMan
This Christanity bashing must stop.

People have got tired of Bashing Americans - so they are Bashing Christianity.

Dont always go in for fashion.

For the sake of Steve ( who I believe is a Christian)

AcrobatMan
Seriously what is this about? Who is bashing Christianity?

Have you seen the post on Virgin birth, Is Jesus the only way, etc. no one is bashing Christianity. These are very hospitable debates. You may find this surprising but I would say the majority of the people in this forum are Christian.
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Old 12-13-2004, 10:53 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally posted by AcrobatMan
This Christanity bashing must stop.

People have got tired of Bashing Americans - so they are Bashing Christianity.

Dont always go in for fashion.

For the sake of Steve ( who I believe is a Christian)

AcrobatMan
I don't see that Christianity is being bashed at all. Discussion is NOT the same as bashing...a distinction a lot of people do not seem to get.

And MY Steve (the REAL Steve, by the way ), isn't Christian. So there you go.
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Old 12-13-2004, 11:10 PM   #113
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well read all the posts...and try to find out adjectives used .

Its not OK.

Its simply inappropriate !!


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Old 12-13-2004, 11:12 PM   #114
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Quote:
Originally posted by indra

the REAL Steve

Your Steve might be a good singer..but thats all about him I guess

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Old 12-13-2004, 11:16 PM   #115
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Quote:
Originally posted by AcrobatMan
well read all the posts...and try to find out adjectives used .

Its not OK.

Its simply inappropriate !!


Oh no specifics...
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Old 12-13-2004, 11:44 PM   #116
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Quote:
Originally posted by AcrobatMan



Your Steve might be a good singer..but thats all about him I guess

Apparently you've never had a chat with my Steve...that man can make me feel stupid (not intentionally, although I'm sure he could if he wanted to), and there aren't many people who can do that. One of the most intelligent people I've ever met.

And no one is bashing Christians. It is discussion, passionate, discussion, but not bashing. Bashing implies mindlessness and violence or violent intent...there is none of that. There are strong differences of opinion though. But this is a discussion forum, so that is only to be expected.
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Old 12-14-2004, 12:09 AM   #117
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Christian bashing may be fun, but watching the responses to it is even funner.
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Old 12-14-2004, 12:38 AM   #118
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the counter-response for those responses are even funnier
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Old 12-14-2004, 12:40 AM   #119
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indra, whats IQ of your Steve...170 ???
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Old 12-14-2004, 05:35 AM   #120
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Quote:
Originally posted by indra


Perhaps if I lived in a nation that was ruled by Muslim leaders and where Mulsims were given respect and admiration I and others outside of that sphere did not receive, I would have the same criticism of them. But I don't. Besides, I have to start somewhere.

Perhaps if more of the active posters on this board were Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, etc., the discussions would focus more on those religions. But since most people here have a Judeo-Christian background, that's where the discussion is going to go.
Hiya indra and BVS as well. I address both of you because you both said the same thing.

I didn't pose it as a question. I didn't ask WHY it happens. I just made a simple observation as to possibly why cardosino was pointing it out. But both yours and BVS' replies confirm that it does in fact happen.
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