Is a 20% tip not good enough anymore?

[joyfulgirl]

The whole American tipping thing is very weird. But that's the deal here and as long as waiters get $2.50/hr they need to be tipped for good service. In just about any other service area (such as for a manicure, massage, haircut, etc.), tipping is customary but optional, in my opinion (I always do). The other day I was at a sushi bar and not only did my friend generously tip the waiter, he also tipped the sushi chef. That was a new one for me, but the friend who did that is....guess what?...a waiter.

 

[bonoman]

I think she's coming from an American point of view. If you don't tip here at dinner, you're screwing some poor person out of their wages.

If you don't like tipping then lobby for better wages, but until that happens you don't screw over the little guy.

I or anyone else isnt screwing anyone out of their wages. The boss is. If your boss isnt willing to pay your wage then he is the one that is doing the diservice to you. People that run restaurants have made custmomers feel as if they are required to tip or the person serving them is going to starve or be kicked out of their house, they have passed the onus onto the customer, which i fell is a huge mistake.

I plan on owning my own restaurant/bar in the future, i wont be paying people 3$/hr because i'm not into slave labor and its againist labor laws.

And why should it be my responsiblity to lobby for better wages for someone else. No one is coming to my job when we go on strike for better wages. They call us greedy, but when we dont tip its like we are hurting someone. Some people are putting the blame onto the customer when it should be put on owners and themselves for not organizing themselves to fight the managers.

Or is it they make alot more money with tips then they'd ever make working for 8$/hr? Waiters can make up to $20/hr in a good restaurant. Why do you think its so convienent to work a bar/restaurant position during school-short hours good pay. Now that not including people in dinners and lunch places but good-high end restaurants and club/busy bars you can make a decent living.

 

[joyfulgirl]

bonoman--you make very good points. I wish we didn't have the system that we do here, but the tipping thing is such a deep part of our eating-out culture that it is unlikely to change in the foreseeable future. So if you don't tip when you visit a restaurant in America just because you think it's dumb, you will still suck from our point of view. I think lots of things are dumb when I visit other countries but there is no harm in respecting the culture that is in place unless it is abusive or just horrible in some way. In America we take tipping in restaurants for granted. There are too many other important battles, in my opinion, and most of us don't have the energy for this one.

 

[bonoman]

Ahh but you must understand. It is as much of your culture as it is Canadians. We pay our waiterss min. wage $5.90 in my province plus tips. And in all other provinces its a higher min. wage. i tip the waiters and the hairdresser adn the pizza guy and bartender and the taxi man. And we get higher wages then 3$/hr!

Thats why i am so pissed!

 

[Sicy]

I am getting very frustrated lately that when I tip a person 'only' 20% at a resturant, they make a huffy face, turn and stalk off without so much as a thank you. These are not fancy places I'm talking about. Most of the time my bill is $10-15 or less if I'm alone. I feel like any 10% tip is gracious, 15% is acceptable and 20% is more than kind, anything else just generous. No one has done anything special or beyond the call of duty for me, just their job. If the service has been good I think that 15-20% is fine. I realize these people work hard and it's nice to help them out, but so do I, and I'm not rich enough to go around bestowing gifts of people. Now I hestitate to even go places with table waiters because of this. What do you all think? Any bad experiences?

I completely agree. I think 15% is fine and people shouldnt complain if they dont get that much. They are the ones that chose their job. If they do something spectacular or are super extra friendly and courteous to me I will give them a bigger tip. But if they solely do their job, are rude or bland.. why should I pay them extra money?

I dont much mind tip jars, again, if I feel the servers or counter people have gone out of their way to be friendly to me, I will throw in a buck or some change.

The girls at my nail salon for instance. They are already charging a hefty price for the nails/eyebrows whatever.. why should I tip them? I just dont get it. They're doing their job. I mean I do, but some days I am really strapped, and they charge enough money as it is and I just cant do it.

 

[joyfulgirl]

Ahh but you must understand. It is as much of your culture as it is Canadians. We pay our waiterss min. wage $5.90 in my province plus tips. And in all other provinces its a higher min. wage. i tip the waiters and the hairdresser adn the pizza guy and bartender and the taxi man. And we get higher wages then 3$/hr!

Thats why i am so pissed!

Ok, I get it. I misunderstood your previous post. I thought you just didn't tip. I live in a service-oriented tourist town where people with PhDs wait tables just because they want to live here and get out of the rat race, and I actually think some waiters only get $1.50/hour! It seems crazy but I guess I have long accepted it and I honestly don't hear people complaining much about tipping in restaurants. It's just what we do. It's how tipping has gotten into everything else (ike what Sicy was saying) that is so annoying--well-paid people expecting a tip.

 

[lady lemonade]

The whole American tipping thing is very weird. But that's the deal here and as long as waiters get $2.50/hr they need to be tipped for good service. In just about any other service area (such as for a manicure, massage, haircut, etc.), tipping is customary but optional, in my opinion (I always do). The other day I was at a sushi bar and not only did my friend generously tip the waiter, he also tipped the sushi chef. That was a new one for me, but the friend who did that is....guess what?...a waiter.

Yeah, the sushi thing is a bit puzzling. I just went out and got some take out sushi, just a couple of pieces. When the person at the cash gave me back my change, he waited there with his little tray 'til I left some change as a tip. Are we supposed to leave a tip for take out?

 

[bonoman]

If someone stood there waiting for tip without giving me my food they'd be getting the change stuffed down their troat. Ive never had that happen but i wouldnt take that lying down.!

 

[lady lemonade]

He had given me the food, he was just waiting with the empty tray where the bill had been. what surprised me was that it was a take out order that I went and got myself so i wasn't sure why i should leave a tip, he didn't do anything really, just took the money and gave me my order. To tip or not to tip, that is the question...

 

[Sicy]

Ok.. tips for take out.. now that's a little extreme.

 

[Leeloo]

Yeah that's what those tip jars are most of the time. I see them not only on the counters of takeout places, but places where all someone does is ring up your can of soda or bag of chips. Sorry, but that is just doing their job!

There was one pizza place I stopped going to because not only were you expected to tip the waitress, when you went to pay there were tip jars marked 'cook' and 'cashier!' With a waitress it's part of the deal, but those people are just doing their jobs. Sure, sure, they work so hard and want money, well dammit so do I. The cashier and cook expected at least a whole dollar each; if you just tossed in a few cents from your change they looked bent out fo shape. Because of their shameless begging, I never went back. Good food, but they lost my business forever.

 

[Angela Harlem]

Do you tip at McDonalds in America as well?

 

[Leeloo]

No not yet, but that's probably coming. The only reason it hasn't so far is because they are owned by a large company. Small time burger places do have tip jars on the counter for the cashiers. Even at places where there are no seats to eat in. In all fast food places, big and small, you are expected to clean off your own table and throw your trash away and it is crude not to do so. But the way things are going it looks like in a few years everyone will expect to be tipped.

 

[Blacksword]

Speaking as a teacher and as a former waitress I have to disagree about tipping on larger bills. Regardless how much I was tipped I had to pay out 2% on my total sales and 20% of my credit card tips. If I was stiffed It caused me money to wait on that table.

Why should it be a server's fault if someone runs up a big tab that they don't feel like tipping on? They still have to pay kitty on that table's bill. I don't know. I'm so confused as to where the tip limit comes from. There are times when a server is taxed on money they technically did not make. I know I could have found another job in college but the place I worked was great and so were my coworkers. Unfortunatly all it took was one bad tip to ruin my entire night.

Anyway, if you don't like tipping, don't go out to eat.

Sorry that kind of logic pisses me off. I go In I pay the price on the menu. That's all that is required of me by law. I'd be an asshole if I didn't give a tip but I have a right ot go and eat out when ever I can scrape up the money to treat myself or my family. I know waiter get gyped on the wages but minimum wage in my province is $6.85. On current exchange rates thats $5.14 American. Now I'm not sure the labour regulations on waiters but I can't see them being paid less than minimum (though certainly not better, save for super ritzy places). If they are form a union, it's what other people had to do.

Tack on a $20 tip and maybe a few smaller ones from a couple more tables and you're cracking $25 and hour. I know things ballance out abit in slow periods, but unless no one is there you are making more than basic wage, and will always come out well on the plus if everyone sticks to 20%

And when I said $100 I mean t at a fancy place where that's teh cost of just the meal. Then it's just bringing out plates for 2 people (fancy restaurant). If it's multiple orders for more drinks and food for a party of 8 or more, then there's a lot of work being done so then the 20% would be justified if the service was good. Bill alone doesn't tell what the ammount of work done by the waiter(s) I judge based on how much service was done and how good it was. I give what I think is fair bu tonly based on the work I see. I have a minimum I give for basic service but nothing more than that. I do not have a default tip. If you don't want to do anything about your wages don't complain when you get paid on a merit basis. I don't mind tipping, I do realize that waiters work hard for poor wages but don't tell me what I'm obliged to pay no matter how good or poor the service is.

 

[joyfulgirl]

My waiter friend shames me if I don't tip for take-out. Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't, depending on my mood. But it's usually just a buck, not 20%.

 

[nbcrusader]

Your friend is out of line - there should be no tipping for take-out.

 

[joyfulgirl]

I think it falls in a gray area. Definitely optional. I tip for take-out at the places where I'm a regular and I know they are struggling.

 

[Seabird]

Thanks Sicy. I agree. Once you have paid a price for something, you shouldn't have to add to it, and if they don't like their job they should quit.

I have to say, some of the posters in this thread have really missed the issue. I am NOT against tipping waitresses. I am against it when I tip them nicely for their average service and they get as rude as if I had not tipped at all. They walk off like they're going to the back to cuss me. Well, as some others have said, and I said, I am not rich enough to go around bestowing gifts on people. I can't give them more than I can to help them with their miserable existence, because I have one too. I don't think I should be made to 'not eat out' anymore because someone doesn't appreciate my 20% tip. No one is hardhearted to the plight of these people and most of us have been there ourselves. That's all the more reason it's so frustrating and makes me not want to even bother when they get rude, whiney, and act cold. Would it really be hard to say, "thank you?" That attitude doesn't make me want to tip higher, it makes me regret tipping them at all!

Examples: It was a small Italian resturant. My guest and I got two lunch specials, $5 each, a sub, fries and drink. As I was paying out with my credit card, the waitress hovered behind the cashier until she saw what I wrote. She saw $2.25. She rolled her eyes, bit her teeth, turned on a dime and clodded back into the kitchen as if I had not tipped at all. She had been nice, but had not done anything other than her job. She took our orders, carried them out, and refilled our drinks once. I feel my tip was more than fair. If I ever eat there again, I will not eat in.

Another example: I was with a little kid in an IHOP. We had a coupon for a free kid's meal. I got a burger meal. The total bill was around $8.00. The wait boy totally neglected us from the time he brought our food until it was time to go, then when he saw us get up to leave he came running over, kissing up, playing friendly to get money. I handed him two dollars. He glared down at it with his mouth open with a look on his face as if I had shit in his hand. He never thanked me or even moved. I was disgusted.

There are other bad experiences but I won't go on. It bugs me that some in this thread seem as though they are holier than thou for 'helping out the struggling' and look down their noses at the ones who are against expected excessive tipping. We are not bad people. We have to live our lives too. Like somebody else said, if I was a millionaire I would hand out gifts but I can't. Should I never eat out or do anything fun because my 20% tip isn't good enough, or someone making a normal average wage wants more too because they see waitresses getting it?

I believe in tipping waiters/waitresses 15-20% and if that's not good enough, I'm sorry. As for the tip jars and the other people wanting tips, yeah, this has gotten bad. Adding tipping to take out, delivery, etc. only sets precedents which everyone will come to expect. It's pathetic that the US has sunk to the level where even people with jobs have to beg!

 

[nbcrusader]

I think it falls in a gray area. Definitely optional. I tip for take-out at the places where I'm a regular and I know they are struggling.

But, to shame you for not tipping is not fair. That implies that the tip is a "right" and your failure to tip is depriving someone of their "right".

 

[joyfulgirl]

But, to shame you for not tipping is not fair. That implies that the tip is a "right" and your failure to tip is depriving someone of their "right".

Well, he shames me good-humoredly. He's a waiter and so his bias is obvious and he knows it.

 

[Seabird]

But, to shame you for not tipping is not fair. That implies that the tip is a "right" and your failure to tip is depriving someone of their "right".

I agree. It starts a precedent everyone will come to expect and those who don't donate will be considered slobs. That is not fair. This may be how the tip jars got spread around.

 

[Seabird]

nevermind

 

[joyfulgirl]

I have to say, some of the posters in this thread have really missed the issue. I am NOT against tipping waitresses. I am against it when I tip them nicely for their average service and they get as rude as if I had not tipped at all.

I think in the examples you gave the people are just ignorant (maybe they can't do the math, lol). In a high-end restaurant, no one would roll their eyes at a 20% tip unless they are just an a** in life.

 

[Seabird]

I never go to high end places. I can't afford to. I've hear the tips some of those girls get makes them drag home more money than a job paying 2 times as much. I heard one girl from an Outback Steakhouse brag she easily cleared over a hundred bucks a night in tips. Many jobs today don't pay that well for a day.

 

[joyfulgirl]

Yes, my friend averages about $200 a night where he works but he only works maybe 1 shift a week and so still needs a day job.

 

[Seabird]

200 bucks a night? That's more than I make 3 days

*edit, I just added up my sorry salary

 

[Sicy]

Once again I agree with you Seabird.

How can someone roll their eyes at you for tipping $2 on an $8 bill? That is just ridiculous.

I am struggling as well, I live paycheck to paycheck, I cannot afford to be 'handing out extravaggent gifts' to people that make my food. 10 - %15 and you better be happy about it or I wont come back.

 

[Seabird]

Thank you Sicy! That's telling it like it is!

 

[joyfulgirl]

Once again I agree with you Seabird.


I am struggling as well, I live paycheck to paycheck, I cannot afford to be 'handing out extravaggent gifts' to people that make my food. 10 - %15 and you better be happy about it or I wont come back.

If you only leave 10% you better not come back or you might find a little extra ingredient in your food known as The Human Spittle.

 

[Seabird]

If you only leave 10% you better not come back or you might find a little extra ingredient in your food known as The Human Spittle.

Anyone who would do that doesn't deserve a damn thing but a kick in the ass It's scumbags like that I have NO sympathy for. 10% is better than nothing.