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Old 03-31-2004, 01:18 AM   #16
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Infact, studies have shown that "light" drinking can be beneficial to your health.
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Old 03-31-2004, 11:42 AM   #17
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Originally posted by oliveu2cm
But- I know they were also talking about the health of the people who work in pubs. They're working, not drinking. So the ban is to protect their health, and I don't think that's hypocritical.
Apparently you haven't been to a pub in Ireland many are drinking behind the bar.

I think the full on ban of smoking in every pub is just stupid. People bring up the second hand smoke issue, but as soon as you let that rule, then you'll have some that complain that people drinking in pubs leads to fights or drunk driving and then drinking will be banned too.

Everything we eat, drink, breathe will someday kill us, some faster than others, but you can't ban everything. You can create smoking sections, certain pubs can be smoke free, but the all out ban is just going to lead to more and more banning.
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Old 03-31-2004, 02:52 PM   #18
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Apparently you haven't been to a pub in Ireland many are drinking behind the bar.

I think the full on ban of smoking in every pub is just stupid. People bring up the second hand smoke issue, but as soon as you let that rule, then you'll have some that complain that people drinking in pubs leads to fights or drunk driving and then drinking will be banned too.

Everything we eat, drink, breathe will someday kill us, some faster than others, but you can't ban everything. You can create smoking sections, certain pubs can be smoke free, but the all out ban is just going to lead to more and more banning.
I doubt it. In Toronto they have banned smoking and no one is talking about banning drinking. I haven't heard of any other city in the world where banning drinking has followed a ban on smoking.
Like I said, the pub is a social institution, drinking would never be banned in Ireland.

BTW, I worked in 3 pubs in Dublin and there was no drinking behind the bar in any of them.
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Old 03-31-2004, 03:18 PM   #19
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I doubt it. In Toronto they have banned smoking and no one is talking about banning drinking. I haven't heard of any other city in the world where banning drinking has followed a ban on smoking.
Like I said, the pub is a social institution, drinking would never be banned in Ireland.

BTW, I worked in 3 pubs in Dublin and there was no drinking behind the bar in any of them.
I was trying to make a point, no it will not happen any time soon, but it opens it up for that type of argument.

Up until a few decades ago smoking was just part of life in Ireland a lot of places for that fact, in fact at one time moderate smoking was considered healthy(due to the notice of sped up metabolisms, etc.). 20 years ago, hell even 10 years ago no one thought a total smoking ban would be implemented in places such as L.A., New York, or Ireland. We did have a temporary ban of alcohol here in the states, so who knows.

I've only been to Ireland once and the pubs we hung out in the bartenders would share shots with us or drink a pint here and there, it wasn't constant, but it was there. There are bars that do it here in the states as well. Some frown upon it some don't.
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Old 03-31-2004, 03:28 PM   #20
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Perhaps that debate could arise BonoVox, but I don't think the cigarette is as much of a cultural cornerstone as the pub is in Ireland.

Even if they banned it here in Barcelona, alcohol would never be banned. First because of economics, wine is huge here, and becausealcohol is deeply integrated into the culinary habits of the culture here whereas, smoking is not.

Anyhoo, I guess we'll see what happens down the road. I still look forward to the day it banned here.
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Old 04-02-2004, 02:06 AM   #21
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Originally posted by Sue DeNym
The main reason I don't go to bars or nightclubs is that I cannot stand smoke. I understand people like to unwind with a drink and a cig, but we nonsmokers would like to unwind, too. I'd love to enjoy some live music or go dancing, without having to deal with smoke.
Well said.

I think its a good law because the smoke is not good for the people who work in bars.

I hope they ban smoking in pubs and clubs in Montreal. I hate reeking of cigarette smoke after a night out and having to wash all my clothes. Also my eyes get all red.

Us non smokers shouldnt have to endure and smell of someone elses disgusting habit.

Im sorry if I offend anyone but thats how I feel.
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Old 04-02-2004, 07:51 AM   #22
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Irish Lawmaker Loses Post for Smoking

DUBLIN, Ireland - Ireland's sweeping new ban on workplace smoking claimed its first casualty Thursday — a high-profile lawmaker who lost his political post after lighting up in the parliamentary bar.


John Deasy, who was supposed to lead the Fine Gael party's official support for the ban, was punished after smoking at least three cigarettes Tuesday night in the bar beside the debating chamber.


Fellow lawmakers said Deasy had tried to open a locked emergency door into an outdoor courtyard. When the bar staff wouldn't let him out, he began smoking indoors in violation of the ban.


Fine Gael leader Enda Kenny said he had no choice but to dismiss Deasy from his justice post in the shadow cabinet.


"Politicians must lead by example. No man, no woman, and no politician is above the law," Kenny said.


Kenny said Deasy may also face prosecution. The ban specifies a maximum $3,700 fine for anyone who smokes in an enclosed workplace.


Deasy, 35, declined to comment. He will remain a lawmaker representing Waterford in southeast Ireland.


The son of a former agriculture minister, Deasy had been tipped as a possible future Fine Gael leader. He frequently captured media attention with his stinging attacks on the government, left-wing opposition parties and even — to the anger of Kenny — his own right-leaning party.


Representatives of more than 10,000 pub owners in Ireland have claimed the ban will cost them business in a country where about 30 percent of adults smoke. So far, however, pubs have reported few problems in enforcement. Unlike the parliamentary bar, some have created new outdoor areas where drinkers can still smoke legally.
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Old 04-02-2004, 07:55 AM   #23
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Old 04-05-2004, 12:59 PM   #24
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They'll get used to it.

When I moved to California from Missouri, it was so amazing to be able to go out places and not have to breathe smoke!

What's the big deal anyway? So you gotta smoke, go step outside and puff on it and come back in...
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Old 04-05-2004, 01:51 PM   #25
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Originally posted by oktobergirl
When I moved to California from Missouri, it was so amazing to be able to go out places and not have to breathe smoke!
This is the first thing I notice when leaving California - the number of smokers out there....
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Old 04-06-2004, 02:48 PM   #26
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We don't have any laws banning smoking in Alabama. We do have individual businesses that don't allow smoking, but I can't imagine the lamebrains in Montgomery to all of a sudden start giving a damn about the people they're supposed to represent.
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Old 04-06-2004, 11:48 PM   #27
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I've worked in a bar for 3 years... the last two of which have been smoke-free thanks to provincial legislation.

When people were allowed to smoke, it was god-awful. I have nothing against smokers, but to have to work in that thick, moist, haze of stale smoke was really uncomfortable. It wasn't much fun to have the smell ingrained into the very fibres of my staff shirt and pants either, let alone my hair and skin.
Some might not think it bad, but consider the difference between spending a couple hours at a bar with your smokes, and spending an enitre working shift in such an environment.

Now, the bar is smoke free. I'm happy, the 70% who didn't smoke in the first place are happy too. The smokers, who were undersandably disgruntled for some time, still come to our bar; we haven't lost any business. They now go outside to the padio to enjoy their cigarette (and the padio's actually a bit of a social hot-spot now ).

Granted, Canadian culture is not Irish culture. I'm sure there will be problems there that we didn't have here. But people will adapt...
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Old 04-07-2004, 03:27 AM   #28
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Where to start...

Ok, smoking is legal right, like we are still alowwed to purchase smokes? Right? Ya, yup, we are. But we can only smoke where our government tells us to? Oh i get it. When i buy a business and want to run it MY way, beacuse it is my business, and the government steps in and tells me what to do within my business, that not freedom. The entire arguement that smoking kills and that this is for health reasons is bullshit, ask yourself if government were so concerned about health reason then why are smokes not banned in your country? Oh thats right, money, taxes. I pay 10$ CDN for a pack of smokes. $6.50 of that is federal tax! Did you know that? Maybe that the reason that smokes havent been banned, they want it both ways, they love our money but at the same time take away our freedoms.

What is next, not being allowed to smoke in your house? Our not being allowed to smoke in your car? There have been laws prohibiting smoking off public streets!

Doesnt anyone see the hipocracy of it all. All the non smokers here havent said a peep about getting rid of smokes all together, why, maybe because we are free to act as we like? But like to turn around and put smokers into a second class.

The people that complain they hate the bars because they are smokey and you smell like smoke, why are you still going to these bars? I dont understand it? Oh thats right, you'll accept the hardship of having to deal with something that discomforts you for plesure, well thats the only reason i can come up with. So now what you have done is put smokers into the same spot. When a smoker now goes to a bar they are put through the discomfort of having to go outside, into say -20C weather.

There has never been any comprimise brought forward. Like for example, has anyone here been into a casino, or a bar that has PROPER ventalation? If you have you will know the difference between a bar without and a bar with. Has anyone ever considered opening a bar for non-smokers? Obviously it is a great idea, since there are so many that hate smoking out there. Ya, i've seen places like that come and go, but i guess thats besides the point.


Oh, and to iacrobat, about your comment:

May I also add, I don't think drinking affects your health on the same level as smoking does. No one complains about second hand alcohol. It's not a good comparison.

No one complains about second hand alcohol? You've never been to a battered wives shelter, or seen drunk drivers, or was the victim of rape, or been the victim of child abuse. Not a good comparison is right, i'd take smoking anyday!
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Old 04-07-2004, 04:43 AM   #29
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i´m a smoker, i like a cig when hanging around with friends talking deep stuff and having a few beers. anyway, the irish solution does not disturb me. i understand that i shouldn´t harm the health of others. for this, i have to compromise.

anyway, i would like to see the same measures for driving. my health is harmed everyday because in the city where i live there are around 500,000 cars. i don´t own a car. how can anyone blame me for smoking, when they poisin my lungs every single day by driving?

start off with some zones where cars are allowed to go, and some more where they aren´t. we have a well functioning public transport system (in compare to some other cities, i admit - but that can be changed by investing more into public transport), plus i don´t live in the last love-nest in the country where you really need a car to go to the next supermarket 10 miles away.

if they forbid going with a car in town, build up big parking areas, and you´d pay 5000 $ for illegal private driving in town - which pollutes my lungs everyday and will eventually also cause lung cancer - then i am all for the smoking ban too.

if not, i´m not against the smoking ban anyway, but with all the other shit that pollutes me, i think that smoking ban is hypocritical.
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Old 04-07-2004, 06:51 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by bonoman

Oh, and to iacrobat, about your comment:

May I also add, I don't think drinking affects your health on the same level as smoking does. No one complains about second hand alcohol. It's not a good comparison.

No one complains about second hand alcohol? You've never been to a battered wives shelter, or seen drunk drivers, or was the victim of rape, or been the victim of child abuse. Not a good comparison is right, i'd take smoking anyday!
I don't think it can be argued that wife abuse, rape or child abuse is directly related to alcohol in the same way lung cancer is directly related to second hand smoke.

I think there are larger issues at work in the examples you gave, it's not simply an issue of alcohol. Alcohol may be a catalyst, but removing it would not resolve the issues.

A bad comparison indeed.
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