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Old 02-16-2006, 12:23 PM   #31
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Originally posted by MrsSpringsteen


In many circumstances in the US, women are still blamed-the way they dress, they went to the guy's apartment/hotel room/dorm room, they were drunk, they led the guy on, they kissed the guy-a myriad of reasons.
Well said.

Anyone ever read "Reading Lolita in Tehran?" It's such a great book and issues such as rape are brought up. A girl is imprisioned and she gets raped repeatedly by the guards because she's beautiful. Then they tell her it's her fault for being a temptress; it's just awful.
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Old 02-16-2006, 12:38 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrsSpringsteen


In many circumstances in the US, women are still blamed-the way they dress, they went to the guy's apartment/hotel room/dorm room, they were drunk, they led the guy on, they kissed the guy-a myriad of reasons.
The attitude still exists, but it is not codified in the US justice system (and we have specific laws designed to keep such thinking out of the court room).

As for the Iranian girl, I can't believe there is no self-defense defense in their legal system.
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Old 02-16-2006, 01:13 PM   #33
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while rape shield laws preventing women who claimed they've been raped from being cross-examined about their sexual histories have been a step in the right direction, i would still argue that the attitude of blaming women for rape is still present in the justice system. it's just been driven underground, as it still informs police investigations and the criminal system, ever so subtly. nowhere is this more prevalent than in the pitiful sentencing policy for rape--all too often convicted rapists get away with a slap on the wrist: token sentences or sometimes only probation. i wish the justice system (and, society as a whole, really) would start treating rape as the abominable crime against humanity that it is.


ps - reading lolita in tehran was a fantastic book.
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Old 02-16-2006, 01:25 PM   #34
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And the rape shield laws are often a joke-lawyers and judges find their little ways around them. We don't hang women here who have been raped but some are tormented psychologically and abused in the legal system and their lives are never the same because of it, not to mention the rape. It is a "hanging" on a different level.
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Old 02-16-2006, 01:44 PM   #35
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Originally posted by MrsSpringsteen
And the rape shield laws are often a joke-lawyers and judges find their little ways around them. We don't hang women here who have been raped but some are tormented psychologically and abused in the legal system and their lives are never the same because of it, not to mention the rape. It is a "hanging" on a different level.
I agree that victims suffer through the criminal justice system, but I think that is an inherent flaw for all criminal proceedings. Not only are defendants entitled to face their accuser (not the most comfortable situation for a victim), but the defendant's attorney has extremely broad latitude in creating doubt in the jury's mind. The result can be a very uncomforable experience for any victim in a criminal matter.
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Old 02-16-2006, 02:51 PM   #36
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This is awful. But as others have pointed out, this kind of thinking goes back so far that I don't know how it will ever be completely eradicated or if it even can.
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Old 02-16-2006, 04:17 PM   #37
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Originally posted by nbcrusader
How different our worlds are...

yeah, nb?....... not soooo far apart.........

......why don't you go do a little a little research on the "Christiian Reconstructionist/dominionist Movement" right here in the USA?

They would have women like 2nd { Oh, [I]I forgot women are stillsome times treated like second class citizens in the usa} third or fourth class citizens here.. Likechattel.

I 'fundamentalists of ANY religion that treats women like chattel/broodmares/doormats etc

I am here in the USA where-- I am sometimes treated like a first class citizen-- depending on the laws-- locally, state-wise & federally and what area I am in & with which people/persons.
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Old 02-16-2006, 04:34 PM   #38
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yeah, nb?....... not soooo far apart.........

......why don't you go do a little a little research on the "Christiian Reconstructionist/dominionist Movement" right here in the USA?

They would have women like 2nd { Oh, [I]I forgot women are stillsome times treated like second class citizens in the usa} third or fourth class citizens here.. Likechattel.
You post may begin to make sense if the United States was a theocracy run by Christian Reconstructionists/Dominionist who had overhauled the entire criminal justice system to match their purported beliefs.

But it is not.

But please, let’s marginalize the plight of others in this world because we can find some small splinter faction with repugnant beliefs.
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Old 02-16-2006, 06:03 PM   #39
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I read "Reading Lolita in Tehran". It's a great book, read it if you can. I couldn't put it down.
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Old 02-16-2006, 06:33 PM   #40
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That breaks my heart.
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Old 02-16-2006, 07:03 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


The attitude still exists, but it is not codified in the US justice system (and we have specific laws designed to keep such thinking out of the court room).

As for the Iranian girl, I can't believe there is no self-defense defense in their legal system.
I guess that Allah didn't have quite enough forsight on that one.
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Old 02-16-2006, 09:00 PM   #42
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I bet Karma will come back to them 10 fold.
It's called a stealth bomber.
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Old 02-17-2006, 01:37 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


You post may begin to make sense if the United States was a theocracy run by Christian Reconstructionists/Dominionist who had overhauled the entire criminal justice system to match their purported beliefs.

But it is not.

But please, let’s marginalize the plight of others in this world because we can find some small splinter faction with repugnant beliefs.
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Old 02-17-2006, 01:43 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


You post may begin to make sense if the United States was a theocracy run by Christian Reconstructionists/Dominionist who had overhauled the entire criminal justice system to match their purported beliefs.

But it is not.

But please, let’s marginalize the plight of others in this world because we can find some small splinter faction with repugnant beliefs.
I agree with this. I don't think we should minimize the potential damage these groups can cause if they gain too much influence (and some already seem to have a lot). But every time something really backwards happens in a Muslim country it's like there's a required mention of how the US is just as bad.
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Old 02-18-2006, 01:58 PM   #45
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I 'fundamentalists of ANY religion that treats women like chattel/broodmares/doormats etc


Religious bigots, of any denomination are the main reason for most of the trouble in the world, I don't need anybody to tell me how to worship, & if there is a God up there, i'll worship him in my own way. I hate all the shit that comes with sectarianism, I was born into a catholic family, and looking back at my childhood it makes me so sick to think of the way my parents used to search for a "Catholic" church whenever we went on holiday, as if we'd have entered a non catholic church we'd have burst into flames, or some other "dreadful" fate befall us, don't we all worship the same God, get a life people stop being told how to lead your lives, and just enjoy the short time we have on the planet!!
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